ACI 11 «Руководство к образу жизни бодхисаттвы, часть II», занятие 9

Class Nine: Contemplations on the Perfection of Meditation, Part III
August 14, 1997
transcribed by: Amber Moore

[appears to be incomplete, check]



prayers: [short mandala]
prayers: [refuge]

We were talking about {dak shen nyamba}, which means to learn to treat other
people and yourself the same and it means to learn to feel about others pain the
way that you feel about your own pain and to feel about others happiness the
way you feel about your own happiness and to work for each one of them as
much as you work for those of yourself. And I think that Jim asked the best
question, where ever he is. Oh, hi. Which was that, you know, which was the
one that naturally comes to your mind, which was that you can't feel their pain
directly. You know, I don't get hurt when someone sticks a pin in, or if Winston
doesn't get any sleep, it doesn't make me tired. [laughter]. And if some other
person gets some great pleasure then it doesn't make me happy. You know
what I mean, it doesn't affect me directly, and I think Master Shantideva gave
the, I have never really heard that argument before, that with practice, other
peoples pain, even though you can't feel it directly, can become intolerable to
you. You can decide that someone else's pain is something that you will no
longer accept, the way that you no longer accept your own, even though you
can't feel it. By practice, jst by practice, because so must of what you are depends
upon what you decide that you are and the boundaries of what you decide of me
is something arbitrary, you can put those boundaries where you want, you were
born with        certain baoundaries and your culture had reinforced certain
boundaries even by giving you a different name from other people, but those
are not fixed in stone and Master Shantideva will say again tonight, "Those
boundaries are arbitrary, those boundaries are not fixed, you can act with those
boundaries as you please. I don't know if anybody ever tried it, I tried it in a
very wimpy way, to imagine that somebody else was my self and imagine
trying to create some happiness in their mind, as if it were my own mind, and it's
very cool, I don't know how many people tried it. It's kind of, very liberating to
expand what you call yourself to another person and then purposely try to
create some happiness in your mind and then pourposely trying to watch that
happiness grow and watching them enjoy that happiness.                 It was very
interesting, it was really kind of liberating for me. I don't know how many
people tried it, but we'll see. Tonight we'll con'tinue with that practice and then
we'll move on to another practice for getting bodhichitta. Why are we talking
about these practices in the first place? We're in the chapter on meditation.
These practices have nothing to do with meditation, right? No, it's what do you
meditate on and if you ever go to a class on meditation, you'll often times, see, if
you go to a class on meditation, there'll be a great emphasis on how to sit, how
to breath, how to close your mind, you know, how to get you mind of certain
objects, but then they don't teach you what to meditate on. You know, I have
alot of people come to me and say, 'You know, I learned how to meditate, I
learned how to sit, I know i'm supposed to focus my mind, everything is clear,
now, what so I do?" So Master Shantideva says, "Go to the forest, seek isolation,
take your gentle walks and then enjoy thinking about doing good for other
people and that's where he started with all of this, that's where we are. Tonight
we could not finish the reading, we tried, we couldn't do it. But the verses are
ready, so hector is going to do the verses. Just do one, stop at a space, okay.

Hector: "Being beyond ones self."

"Suppose you say that the reaseon that you don't protect them id=s that their
pain doesn't hurt you. Why then, do you not protect yourself from future pain?
Since it doesn't do hurt to you either." We had this argument before, which is
going to become Jim's famous question, okay. And it is the big question. And
Master Shantideva says, "Suppose you say that the reason why you don't help
other people, you don't protect other people is that their pain doesn't do
anything to you, it doesn't hurt you. " And someone again came up with this
arguement, Okay, so on your homework don't forget togive homework
arguement number two. This is Master Sahntidevas sacind arguement why you
ahould think of others pain as if it were your own. And Master Shantideva
replies with a {telngyur}, a prasangika, he says, which is a logica l reply of asking
someone, you reply with a question, with a sarcaxtic question and hopefully the
other guy guy gets it. Sometimes they don't, He says, "So then why do you
protect yourself from future pain sonce they don't do any hurt to you either",
meaning he gives three examples. He says, "In the morning, if you know your
boss is going to yell at you in the afternoon, you might call in sick, okay. In that
case, you are helping someone else even though you can't feel their pin. So then
why don't you help other people as well? You're, you're acting vrazy. Okay, I'll
run it by you again. These arguments seem silly or something, or they seem
naive, and when you get to an argument that seems naive inn Buddhism, you
better stop and look at it, because it's usually extremely profound and it went
over your head. Okay, he says, "You don't take care of other people, why?
Because I can't feel their pain, directly. Then why do you worry about yourself
in the afternoon, in the morning? You know, why do you call in sick because the
boss is going to scream at you in the afternoon? Because you can't feel his pain,
right now, right? SO that's another person, so then why do you do that? Then
he gives another example, he says, "401 k programs", I guess they had them in
ancient India, he says, why do you go through putting away a 401 k? You know,
why are you saving money to take care of thid guy who is going to exist twenty,
thirty, forty, years from now, what's the point? He's a differrent person, you
can't feel his old age, you can't feel his poverty, you can't feel his sovial security
sheck, a hundred and eighty dollars for a month. ou know, why are you aking
car of him? According to you, you shouldn't be taking care of him. Okay, stop
taking care of him, you know, tell your boss to cancel the 401k, because that's a
another person who's pain you can't feel.

student: [unclear]

That comes next, okay, it does come next, really. Sometimes I say it's coming
next ans it doesn't come next, but this time it's really coming next, okay?
[laughter] Okay, third argumant, why do you take care of your future life?
Definately, your future life is a totally different being, this guy is born, not even
born yet, you know, palnet Xirces, you know, among the "race of the golden
bird people", you know and you don't have any relationship with him, you're
not gonna be, you have no way to be aware what's happening to him, and why
are you doing good deeds, why are you trying to collect good karma? You're
trying to take care of somebody that could be born millions of years away,
millions of light years away, you know, and you're trying to take care of this guy
that isn't born yet and is totally different from this guy that is going to die in this
life, you know, someone is going to sit in a hospital bed in New York City, or in
a nursing home somewhere in America and going to die. And then there's this
other guy that's born somewhere, god knows where, you know. So why are
you trying to take care of him? You can;t feel his pain, you know, so you're
acting crazy, that's his argument, you're acting crazy, that's his argument.

student: [unclear]

She said, "Isn't it the same mental continuum?" He said isn't it the same mental
continuum? I say Hector read the next verse. [laughter]
Hector: Your idea that you do so because you think to yourself that you will
have to experience it is all wrong, because the person who has already died is
one person and the one who has taken birth is another all together." He didn't
answer yet, okay, he's still rubbing it in. In fact, one more verse he's going to
rub it in. And here he says, this is where he brings up the idea and he says, "But I
have to experience it, you know. It's me that has to experience the pain of the
future life. You know, therefore, I should take care of him and he is me and
other people are not me, I will come to feel that pain, myself directly, and he
says, therefore I should take care of him. And he says, "No,no, no, you were just
basing it on the fact that they were separate from you. You know, you were
emphasizing that they were separate from you, a separeate person. And Master
Shantideva, although, no logically, yet, okay, is saying, "Look, who could be
more deparate than this guy who's gonna be born in some other realm? How
could anyone be more separate than you, there's people sitting around you,
these people are sitting on the same pew as you, they are like sitting a few feet
away from you and you are not taking care of them . But you're taking care of
this guy who is totally separate, he's years and years away, he's miles and miles
away, and you're taking care of him. Why? It doesn't make sense, so don't give
me this stuff about, "I have to experience it.", because he's so far away and he's so
different than you that, why are you worrying about it right now? Still doesn't
address your question, he'll get there, but not in the next verse, do the next
verse.

Hector: "Now, suppose that a particular pain was only something that a
particular one had to care about. If this were the case then a pain in the foot
would be nothing for the hand, why then does it care?" He's not addressing you
question yet, he's still addressing the idea that we compartmentalize who we
should take care of. This is, this is me, I'm only going to take care of the local
person. What;s that word? It's a french word? Peroquial. I'm gonna take care
of the person that's in this little border and I'm not going to take care of other
people who are in other little borders. Okay, so it's this border, there'a this line
that separates me from other people and I'm gonna take care of people who are
inside that line and I'm not going to take care of people who are out side of that
line. So he says, "In that sase, if you are walking along the street and you get a
plinter in your foot, don't reach doan and pull it out, because you have to be
local, you know, the hand if over here, the foot is over here, you know hand
should take care of hand and foo tshould worry about foot. Let foot worry
about the foot. Foot should take his thorn out of his foot, that's foots problem.
Okay, why do you whay don't you go further, you know, you have a boundary,
why don't you bring the boundary in further? You know, divide all the parts of
your body up. Say, "Hand will take care of hand and foot will take care of foot.
SO if foot gets a splinter of glass in it or something, Hand should ingnore it,
according to you. If, if you're being logical then go ahead, define yourself even
shorter, draw the boundary here, around the hand, and hand will take care of
hand and foot will take care of foot, because it's all arbitrarty. So according to
you, if it's all arbitrary, we can decide what we want. Okay, hand will take care
of hand and hand doesn't have to help foot anymore, okay, if foot is itching and
needs a scratch, hand will just ignore foot, okay because foot is, foot is separate
from hand, okay.           He's saying that acording to you, your logic is sick.
Everybody is sitting there going...... [laughter]. He's sayint the self is srbitrary,
what you decide is you is arbitrary. You know, he's been begging you to make
yourself fatter and try to spread out among more people and now he's getting
like frustrated because this guy is like fighting himand he's like, "Okay, have it
your way, make yourself smaller." You know, "Decide that yourself id you
hand or decide that yourself is your foot and when your foot itches, don't let
your hand help him , because they are separate, you know, the hand doesn't feel
what the foot feels. Right? So why should the hand help the foot? You know, if
it's on the basis of twhat they feel, the foots the oney one that's tickling, the
hand's not tickling, why should hand help out foot? They're separate , the hand
is not feeling directly, the thing that the foot is feeling directly, according to you,
if it makes sense, hand should ignore the foot, hand should not scratch the foot,
okay, shouldn't do it, doesn't make sense according to you. Think about it,
Rinpoche would say, "Cook it." It's a great argument, it doesn't seem to bowl
anybody over. Okay, we'll go to twenty, go ahead. Are we only what we
control?"

"The things we call a stream, or else a collection, are ureal, they're like a string of
things or an army. That of one with suffering doesn't exist at all so who is he
that could ever stop it. SInce the one who owns the pain does not exist, there can
be no distintions among the many."

Okay, here is where he answers the question, he goes int an interesting
argument. And it's a little bit difficult. It's a little bit of a preview of the ninth
chapter, which has, you know, given people headaches, you know, for about
thirteen hundred years, okay, [laughter]. Okay, it's difficult, but it makes sense.
We're gonna talk about two concepts here, one is {tsokpa}. {Tsokpa} means a
co,,ection of parts. When you have, for example, a holiday, you call it a {tsok},
because it's many monks getting together. And that's a {tsok}. So your body is a
{tsok}. Your body is a {tsokpa} made up of your hand, your fet, your arms, your
legs, your torso. That's a {tsokpa}, that's a collection of parts . It takes a {tsokpa}
to make a thing. When you pecieve any particular object, like, this pen, you're
seeing the top and you'er seeing the tip and you're seeing the bottom. And ths
pen is a {tsokpa}, it's a collection of three different parts. The top, the middle and
the tip. And that's, that's three parts that make up a {tsokpa}. Shantideva,
Master Shantideva says, "Look, {tsokpa]'s are {dzunba}." {Dzunba} means,
"unreal, unreal", artificial. {Dzunba} means "fake", sometimes, okay, what does
that mean? You have to think carefully about it, the pen is a fake, because it's a
{tsokpa}. Alright, the pen is unreal, because it's a {tsokpa},
970819-1.aaa
Geshe Michael Roach
Couse XI: Guide to the Bodhisattva's Way of Life, Part II