Сяопин Джоу / Элисон — Книга 2: Самоцвет истинного намерения (Панчен Лодро Лексанг о «Виная-сутре»), занятие 11

[ШАПКА ДЛЯ ЦИТИРОВАНИЯ]
Курс: Xiaoping Zhou / Alison — Book 2: The Gemstone of True Intent (Panchen Lodru Leksang on the Vinaya Sutra) — Diamond Cutter Classics
Урок: Занятие 11 — «team class» разбора домашнего задания Сяопин по Виная-сутре (обеты мирянина, однодневный обет, категории обетов); дата по плейлисту 31.10.2024
Ведёт: не установлено — Геше Майкл Роуч отсутствовал (восстановление после операции, был в Сан-Диего); занятие ведёт команда учеников совместно с Сяопин
Дата и место: 31 октября 2024; место не указано (онлайн-класс, Zoom)
Источник: YouTube, канал Diamond Cutter Classics, плейлист PL1KVm5jgTljRBpdDsc-GnPM-ab-9EEPLy; расшифровка TurboScribe
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[Speaker 1]
How are you? Good. That's some nice shrubbery you have there.

Thank you. I think it's a money tree. Is it working?

Is it growing money? Yeah, actually. That's green papery stuff.

I mean, I used it. It didn't work, but you just got to try. You got to sell it.

It's all about the confidence on your face as you pass it to the clerk. If you bring it to Shenzhen, they take it because it's a cashless city, so they don't know the difference. They're like, oh, it's money.

Great. That sounds wonderful. Yeah.

Welcome to Xuanzang's Tower, everybody. Happy to be here. We're making it for another week.

We're still here. And today we have a really special team class with Xiaoping, who I think this might be your first team class, which is exciting. And we're ready to do our best to dig into this classic of Vinaya together and see what we can come up with.

So, wow, whenever you're ready, let's go for it. Thank you. Thank you, Nick.

Sure. Thank you. Let me share.

Oh, and Xu Gang is clarifying that it is a team class and it's not Tim's class. Sorry, Tim. I know that you got really excited for a moment there.

I did. I had a moment on Monday when I was like, oh, my God, it's my class. I am not prepared.

Yeah, that's okay. None of us are. It's fine.

Well, it was gloriously unprepared. How about that? Congratulations on moving into your new house.

Thank you. Tim now has the highest house in Rimrock, so the tallest. It's at the highest point.

It's like a Lam Rim story. And then I think they're building a tower on top of Geshe Michael's house to make sure it's higher than Tim's. I'll start the fundraiser.

Sorry, I got a problem. Can you give me one minute to figure out? I switch to a new computer now.

I couldn't share the document. I don't know why. Sorry.

Any excuse to continue our witty banter. Is it a brand new computer? Yes.

So you have to give Zoom the permission to share the screen and then restart Zoom. Oh, okay. So it's in the settings.

It's under the Apple and then system settings. Yeah. And then go to, what is it called?

Maybe accessibility? I think it's privacy and security. That's it.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Privacy and security.

Yeah. And then what? And then accessibility within privacy and security.

Okay. Accessibility. Oh, okay.

Zoom. Okay. I found it.

The beauty of team classes. We can achieve anything with team. And then I have to log out, right?

Yeah, we'll see in a minute.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
We'll hold it down. How about that, Xiaoping? Good.

Thank you for the excellent services. Does anyone follow college football? Not if I can help it.

Not if you can help it. It's been 100 years. Does Cleveland still have a team?

That's not college. Sorry. It might not be college.

I'm watching the Penn State, Ohio State game in an hour with my parents. I'm excited. Oh, that's cute.

They're in every college football game somehow. I mean, every time I hear about college football. They're always playing.

Most games, right? Yeah. I grew up in Florida, which may have the most teams.

But your college football team were the Geoducks. What's a Geoduck? I know even less about that than football.

And that's really saying something. Oh, Gooey Ducks. Oh, that's better.

Clams. Clams. Yeah, right.

That's right. Gross. Go Gators.

Oh, of all things. Oh, Florida Gators. Nice.

Yeah, right. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, Gators, Seminoles, Hurricanes.

There's a whole Florida rivalry. Isn't this interesting? Isn't this what you all come for?

This is what everyone came to try and try. It's fine. I do.

I enjoy these team classes. We're going to have fun today. Yeah, I'm excited.

Grateful for everybody being here. And thank you for your gracious patience. Casey Michaels is doing well.

You saw him, Tim? Or Tim, Nick? I'm Nick.

Did he say Nick? It's hard to keep us apart. I understand.

I distinctly said team. He's doing great. He's doing great.

I'm texting with him every day. He's strong and healthy. Can you see me now?

Yeah, we got you, Xiaoping. Sorry, I apologize for this. I didn't know.

Okay. Okay. First, homework.

Very easy homework. First one, there's one way to distinguish different kinds of vowels. We mentioned in my last Vinaya class.

Very easy. Just one word. Answer.

A long word, it seems. Number. Yes, number.

Yeah. So if, yeah. So one easy way to distinguish.

Yeah. Second. These are just review.

So very easy. Five things that a layperson must give up after taking layperson's vows. Killing people.

Killing. Kidding. Kidding.

Watching college football. Lying. Sorry, Tim.

About watching college football. No. Okay.

We've got killing, stealing. Killing, stealing. Well, killing a human.

Stealing more than a quarter car shop and a worth of something. Lying about your spiritual realizations. Yes.

Drinking alcohol or other substances that intoxicate you. And committing adultery either. If you're married or someone else is married.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, thank you.

[Speaker 1]
Someone else is always married, unfortunately. No alcohol here. I put no chemical pills also.

[Speaker 2]
Good.

[Speaker 1]
Third one. What are we supposed to do during the one-day vow? You can talk about the things you give up and also what's the essence.

In general, what are we supposed to do? Why we abstain from those things during the one-day vow? Meditate and stuff?

Yes. You're not supposed to wear fancy clothes, sit on a fancy throne, or do any of the five things the layperson promises not to do, pretty much. Yes, anything else?

I think it's pretty much practicing being an ordained person. Yes, it's similar. Similar to practice being an ordained person on that day.

Anything else? Nirvana. Don't eat after 12.

Wait for nirvana. Don't eat after noon, 12 o'clock noon. Yes.

Kim's trying to think about whether or not he can watch college football on that day. Yeah, no high chairs. Yeah.

What about a lazy boy chair? Any kind. I said throne.

Show activity, lying, two kinds of crazy makers. No incense, flower strings, skincare or makeup, dancing, singing, playing music, wide and high chair, eating at the wrong time. In modern time, for example, a wide and high chair, what does it say?

If it is modern application. Can you give some example? It could be a fancy bed even, right?

Yeah, fancy cars, fancy clothes, for example. A lazy boy past the 12 o'clock setting. No SUVs.

What about your SUVs? Does a moped count? Ciao.

No chairs with a cup holder. Okay, so at that time when we are keeping the one day vow, we are supposed to stay quiet and think about our life. Okay, thank you.

Three vocabulary. First one, we talked about it earlier.

[Speaker 2]
Number.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, number. Second one. Through.

By desire. You can get rid of the S. Yeah, there you go.

Yeah, good. That makes it by desire or via. Okay.

Handling money. Holding money. Yeah, touch money, use money.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay, now teamwork.

Go on, Tim, get in there. Maybe I read this paragraph and Ben, can you correct me? We'll find out only if you do badly.

Okay. Okay. Thank you.

Nice. Okay, let's see. Here we go, team.

All right. Excuse me. The holding money.

Isn't it? I don't know how to pronounce it. D-N-G-U-L.

It's a good observation. I think that is more of a typical arrangement. That's what's in the verse.

So did I touch money? Yeah, the opposite way. Where'd you get this?

In the verse. The test? Yeah, where'd you get the arrangement of the words?

Did you copy and paste it or did you remember it? Copy and paste. Maybe I did something wrong.

I can check. Yeah, it's usually the other way. That's all.

In the verse, it is the other way. Yeah, that makes sense. Okay.

Cool. Nice. Was that Chunzang?

Thank you, Chunzang. Yeah, that's wonderful. You mean this?

Yeah, that looks more nice. Like the right word should be... Thank you, Vanapos and Chunzang.

Oh, yeah, it could get a pass as... Yeah, just in case someone discovers this later, put a P-A at the end. Here?

So it remembers it under a rock. Yes. That would make it more complete.

That's crisp. Thank you. Yeah, beautiful.

Thank you. Otherwise, it was money grab. Okay.

Grab money. Okay. Okay.

Where's it a quote from? Why is it Shesong Piehche? Is it from the Vinaya Sutra?

Great question. This seems to be an argument, right? Not only is it from the Vinaya Sutra, but it supports some position being put forth.

Right. Must be. I mean, it literally says...

Because it says... It's from the auto commentary. Okay.

We went through the long list of things in the different vows for different sets of vows. So we're ending that up here. Thank you.

Can we start it with full monks? Like full monks, blah, blah, blah. I mean, we don't have to, but...

Yeah, it's okay. Either way. But yeah, sure, you can.

But also are considered to be full monks. Yeah. I like it.

But yeah, I think it's also a way of reasonable to say a full monk is either way. Let's see. The other reason I'm bringing up the because it says maybe rather or something rather than that is so the case is...

Correct me if I'm wrong, Adam, but don't we usually use like a yin-te or something for that is so the case? Yeah. Oh, it's okay.

I mean... I mean, it's because she's in pictures a little bit more specific. Well, it's just a four.

You have to include the four. Right. Because that's the...

Oh, yeah. So whether or not it was an argument even. I mean.

Right. Because it could just be, you know, it says it's more of a... Yeah.

It's just a list. I mean, would Geshe Michael even include in this quote the name of the book? Perhaps.

I mean, even though it's not. At the beginning when it was mentioned. Yeah.

Oh, right. You might say it also says. It also says.

Yeah. Outside of context. I don't know if I just saw this alone.

I would say if I knew it was the auto-commentary, I would say that is so the case for as the auto-commentary says. Again, unless we just mentioned it already. So the reason that this was brought up is that there are exact numbers of vows in each set of vows.

So what we're saying is the case is that, yes, we have listed the exact numbers as said or stated in the auto-commentary. Do you want paper? Okay.

So we're proving that vows are based on number because the auto-commentary defines a full, a fully ordained person as one who's given up. Well, I think that this because probably in English belongs up by the commentary because he's ending this quote with renouncing every deed of body and speech that should be abandoned is considered to be a full monk. That's what I would I would suggest and then I would be shut down.

So it's good. It's good. But then as far as the intention is the idea that justifying the idea that the different sets of vows work according to number and our justification here is the fact that for a full monk, it's all that.

Is that the idea you think? Yeah, I don't know that this proves that. Okay.

But I just know how we started off this whole section. But in any case, we are going to need a the auto-commentary says, right? We do have it way up above a few paragraphs above.

Okay. Yeah, so without the other text above, it's kind of hard for us to really make a if we can see the other text shopping. Is it possible for you to bring up?

We can go back when we look in her other text. Let's not make her go yet to a different doc. Okay.

Okay. We don't need to torture her that much yet. Okay.

But we'll see. We'll see it. Yeah.

Well, we'll find a way before the class is done. Okay. Okay.

Let's look at the next little section here. Um, yeah. Cool.

Um, shopping, you are you going to pick on somebody? Okay. I will pick on somebody.

So we all share this, the happiness and team, would you like to read? I'm sorry. You want all of us to read?

Okay. All right. Would you please correct?

Thank you. Okay. Okay.

Let's see. Uh, uh, shopping. Do you want to read us the English for good luck so that we can criticize you thoroughly?

Oh, okay. Therefore, the root test of the Abhidharma in the section containing the phrase only for the purpose of novice monk and for the ordained monk, the word for the purpose of applies to all four from the present vows up to 40 ordained monk vows. Let's see.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Novice. Okay. Um, what's, what's Jay here?

Uh, gets all check for the purpose of, uh, okay. Jay is for the purpose of, um, uh, oh, I see. It's funny that that would come before the time though, right?

Uh, since it's gets all check for the purpose of novice monks and, oh, yeah. Interesting. Could be specifically.

Yeah, could be targeted towards. Oh, that's cool. Okay.

Um, oh, and that's the quotation, right? That's the quotation from the root text. Um, that's a, that's cool.

Um, let's see. Um, it may help to know that in the root text, there is a knee after check. And so it gave me.

Okay. Oh, no, I'm sorry. Uh, it actually, hold on.

Yeah. I just looked in gopher too. And the previous translations you get like 163, but the way it is here, this, I mean, not that uncommon.

Interesting. Um, I put the root text in the chat. In the chat.

There we go. Uh. Oh, okay.

So, so it's, it's faithfully quoted. Um, yeah. Okay.

Um, only applies to, so. Only applies to. Okay.

Well, it's a little confusing, but Abhidharma is terse. Um. So.

That's okay. And the rest of this is also familiar. Let's see.

The. No, it's not. Okay.

Um, what do you think? Shungi nang, nangtsen in this section. Uh.

Oh, look, there's. Chedong. What do we think now?

Where is this helping us? It could be a Shungi nangtsen. Is that section or category?

Yeah, that makes sense. It could be category as in. You mean here could be category.

Yeah. But. I mean, Shungi nangtsen, I guess section makes nangtsen by itself can mean category or list.

But Shungi nangtsen, it makes more sense to. In there, but. I'm just curious.

Because it could be for the category. Categories of novice and full monks. Right.

Combining the two. It could be something like that. Yeah.

Yeah, well, it's easier maybe from the back of the sentence, right? You should. You should apply.

Uh. From. Ganyun Gidongba.

The novice vows, ney, all the way on up to Geylang Gidongba. The monk's vows. Yeah, so these.

Oh, the word for the. Oh, the word for the purpose of look at. So.

Che. The word Che, I guess. Um.

Yeah. The word the word for the purpose of in this section or when in the text, the shung. Indicates these categories is referring to the application of all four of them to.

From novice monks or novice vows all the way up to fully ordained monks vows. So is there any. Are you talking about novice monk novice vows?

Uh. Let me not mess it up. Ganyun is.

[Speaker 2]
Layperson.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, from layperson to novice. Oh, excuse me, from layperson to fully ordained monk. Yeah, that's right.

Um. So is it possible, uh. That this che dong.

Blank knee is a device that's working like this may. I mean, that seems like the gloss. I've not seen it written that way, but there's a lot I haven't seen.

I wonder if that's the idea that was in some older form of writing. You can say che dong. Um, and then have that knee at the end is also a little.

Um. But maybe che dong can be from blank to blank. Um, and that it's an older form.

And in fact, if it's being mentioned in the commentary, it might even be. Um. Uh.

Tricky enough, opaque or enough that it needed commentary. What's your question about the che dong, Ben? Yeah, just if.

I'm still fuzzy on on the word che, but that's the word that's being glossed. Yeah, I guess for the sake of. Um, just the the question of why the che comes after gets since the import of this.

Passage that says. Right, novices che dong monks. Knee.

Right. Somehow means that we're applying it to. From novices all the way up through monks.

Um. I guess. What does this really mean, though?

Like, does this mean that that they're shared? Those for whatever we're talking about. The only four are.

All the way up from the lower from the novice all the way up to the full monk. Like, I don't understand what it's actually saying. Yeah, I'm saying.

Yes, it does. Yeah, that word che is being applied to all four categories from gain in to get along. Yeah, I think that's.

Yeah, that's the meaning of change. Yeah, so it doesn't apply to all four vowels. It applies to all four types of vowels.

Categories. Right. I think that's right.

Yes. Okay, that's right.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
That makes a lot more sense now. Okay. That's why I was getting confused.

Now I'm okay. We don't know what the four are. No, they're in the root text.

Look, then we'll probably put them in the. I think we're looking at the whole phrase. Yeah, what's being explained here?

Not just check. Right. Oh, I see what you did there.

Because the chip marks that. The. Yeah, I think it's saying.

The chain from that line, though, the chain tongue section of that line. Sorry, the CESPA. Gates will check down on me.

That phrase of those words. That's what in that line means phrase, not word. Sick means that whole bit.

Yeah, yeah, I think it's. Yeah. Why does it say that's the tongue at the end of that line?

That's why it says together. Okay. Okay, so.

What applies to all four? They're all. That's okay.

Yeah, okay. It says it. Okay, these are all.

Forms of morality. Apparently. Okay, all right, I think that we have.

Milked this passage for all the meaning. Okay, here. Let's see, therefore, the root section.

Oh. Yeah, it's fine. Therefore, in the root text, you probably don't need in the section category.

In the Abhidharma, you could just cut to where it says the phrase and. You can even take out the word containing. Therefore, in the root text of the Abhidharma, the phrase.

Yeah, what do you think? Only for the purpose that includes the knee. Would you just say.

For the purpose, because he just mentioned. There. Yeah, I'm still stuck with why that check.

Is after gates. In that sentence. Well, it does seem peculiar, but then I guess my feeling is that's why.

He took the effort to comment on it since we wouldn't otherwise know. Yeah, I think it's I think it's weird in the West Chinese, too. That's why they're commenting on.

It's not just you. It's good to know I'm not alone. Because he says it's for all four.

It's seems just for emphasis, the. Like for the purpose of these three and even for and including. The full monks themselves, like it gives you like it's sort of like an added emphasis.

It's literally saying that we're reading it that way. Oh, as well as yeah, don't could be as well as. Yeah, as long as as well as and then me.

Yeah, as well as Asian fully ordained monks. Yeah, yeah, cool. You want to go on shopping?

OK, so let's go on. Anybody, let me see. You could pick anyone.

I'm sure they're just too shy, but desperate to be called. OK, Mike Hoffman, would you like to read? Definitely.

Thank you. From the wrong. Yeah.

Yeah, great, thank you. OK. Yeah.

Oh, gosh, I don't think we're abandoning vows. Oh, sorry. Why don't we go through all the words?

Because let's do it. People can't follow other people aren't going to be able to follow. Let's do it.

Yeah, do you want to? Yeah, well, I almost want to work from the back. I mean.

That's fine. Jarkovich, right? Because you should apply.

Right, you should take these words as a name or something. Let's see. Geylangidonba, right?

The vows of a Geylang, a fully ordained monk. Should be nupa, like thought of as. Applying to.

No, nup means to get the vows, to obtain them. Nupa. Oh, are gotten for the sake of ceitu.

Giving up, pongwa, matak, all the pongjas, all the things that you should give up. Uh, in lu and nok, in body and speech. Um, uh, that's also true.

Uh, so I guess we hadn't all the way up to that went the other direction, but that's okay. We can deal with it. The, the, that's true coming from the donpa of the Geylang, the vows of a novice.

Uh, which are taken, thank you again, the word, uh, ceitu for the sake of, uh, of giving up. Justify, notum, uh, the five root pongjas, the five root naughty things that you don't want to do. Um, ranginukel, um, help me.

That's your duty. That's your. That's, that's your mandate.

Yeah. Kel. Interesting.

Kel, like kelwa, like goodness, like. Well, nukel is a idiom. Nukel is your, your, your mandate, your, your, your duty or something.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
We had it in Xiaoping's homework, like two homeworks. Um, yeah. Cool.

Okay. So because, oh, so because you should apply or you should understand, we're still talking about ceitu, right? We're still talking about cei, aren't we?

Um, because you should apply cei. Do you think that jar good? The jar is the application of the word cei in those words.

Um, because you should, uh, apply the word ceitu as referring to your, um, you know, that you take it up as your duty as a novice to keep just the five all the up to taking it up. Go ahead. Yeah.

I think I got it. I think I know why cei. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Ceitu cei. Um, the novice only has to do those, uh, things that apply to the vows that they took. The, while, while the, um, earlier game has to do all of them.

That tadak. Yeah, yeah. Okay.

I think I got it. Um, ceitu, the reason cei is after just geitsel in the original lines is because he's saying cei, it only applies the, the geitsel only has to do those vows that apply to their own rangi their particular set of vows, their own duty. While the fully ordained, um, monk in this case has to do knee, all of them in total.

Nice. Yeah. Good.

Yeah. So when we talk about that verse that we had earlier, then we were saying, these are the, um, the knee at the end is the only ones of the fully ordained vows that specifically apply ceitu in this case are, uh, those appropriate to, which is the cei, uh, right. The vows that you took, the, the five.

Right. And that's why it says towangatam here, only those five. He says, mainly, I don't know why he says mainly, but you only have to do those five things that you gave up.

You don't have to do all of them. Isn't it mainly giving up? You're probably right.

Oh, the thing, the main thing he said you'd give up, pangje na, pangje tsoa, tsoa. Yeah. Gibson put in a note in the text about, or in the chat about rangin nukil, right.

Meaning those particular vows. Yeah. That's what we were just talking about.

Yeah. Right. Particular.

Or is it mainly, is it mainly because if you take like one day vows, there's other things you're supposed to give up that are more than the five? I think it means, it probably means principle to the things you said you'd give up. I guess I was taking it to mean that these five then in effect form a sort of a root pangjas to the greater system.

It could be because the four are the root, like the pampas. Yeah. Yeah.

Maybe these are, if you wanted to. Right. If you're taking Buddhist vows, you've got to take those five.

Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Or they're not Buddhist vows.

[Speaker 1]
Or it could mean that's your main mandate, but you still should think about not doing all that other stuff that fully ordained people do because that's cool stuff to do too. Yeah. Although, right.

Yeah. Right. Like you didn't promise to not spit on the ground, but that's kind of gross.

So like mainly, you know? Yeah. Yeah.

I like this idea. Yeah. Maybe, right.

We probably like, again, these are the, you've got to take these vows at least for them to be Vinaya vows or Pratyamoksha vows. But everything else is inclusive of them such that these are in a sense a root five. Although I would have put so after that song, but it seems like maybe it's saying that these are the root Panjas or the root of Panjas, right?

The root of Panjas is these, you know, particular five vows, particular five things to give up. What about just like the principle five? Yeah, I think it's great.

It's just, you know, normally it's a silly technical thing, but principle five would be not solo as opposed to Tso'o Na unless you put a genitive in there. Tso'o needs a genitive like cheer. Right, exactly.

That's the problem is you can do in a post positional language, right? In English, the adjective comes first and in West Chinese here, the adjective comes after. However, you can use the apostrophe I or a key to switch them.

Sometimes then you can get the adjective to come first like it might in English, but it's not here. So that's the only thing that made me a little uncomfortable about saying that it's as obvious as root five, though it might be implying that. In a slightly more verbose way.

Yeah, well, we are linking up different phrases here because we've got Yes. Algi and then Pongche. Yeah.

And then Pongwe. Right, exactly. Yeah, we have a virtual train of genitives.

We have a train. All aboard. Genitive train.

Oh, Tim's conclusion. Oh, I'm sorry. Tim, yeah, Tim.

So, Tim, what's your conclusion? It's not fair. I humbly request that you make fun of our pronunciation of your name in the future so that we feel more justified.

I'm just making fun of Tim. I don't care. I must be pronouncing Xiaoping like some other word.

Okay. Yeah, I think it's the five which are your main duty to give up. Only those five which are the main thing that you should be giving up.

Yeah. Yeah. So, it's a particular five or just five main thing?

I don't, I mean, I like particular to give this point. I would say these particular five main things. I might say foundational five.

[Speaker 2]
Foundational.

[Speaker 1]
Because it's solo. You see, it's root, these, or you could say main five or particular five. Particular, but it's solo is like, it's not just any five.

These are the roots, the guts. Right, because if you say foundational, then it's implied that it's distributed to all the other ones. Right, which I think it seems to be.

Yeah. Okay. Yeah, you can torture yourself about this later, Xiaoping.

You have to solve all the problems before our eyes. Okay. It's fine.

We can just wax poetically as a team and then you can decide intelligently. Wait till it's behind our back to decide whose advice to disregard. It'll make us feel better.

Okay. Wise. Good.

Um, cool. Yeah. Can you hear me?

Quite well. Um, cool. Thank you.

As long as I, as long as As your Yeah. Yes. Life remains.

Yeah. Right. Yeah.

Yeah. For sure. For sure.

Yeah. That's so meaning life, right? For however long your life lasts.

Yeah. You're 10, the 10 pong jaws of a getsu. And Yeah.

Give up if you're going to be a novice. And Uh, that's how I to do. Six bows, I guess.

Yeah. Teachings. Um, the The things that are conducive to supporting those six.

Yeah. Okay. Oh, that's cool.

Yeah. Are they talking about the vices that come along with them? Or are these six secondary, right?

Um, yeah, six associated, right. Go could be six things that support them. Um, the We call them secondary when we do our search on recitation.

Yeah. Cool. Thank you.

Um, yeah. Those are your particulars. Yeah.

Yeah, those are the particulars. Uh, those pong jaw chain a having Yeah, given up those particular things. On charge chain a having done so.

Um, and Right. Um, Right, taking rub to chair. So time.

What did you put here? Oh, yeah. Okay, wait.

So, um, so pong pong jar. Without the S. Something to something.

So the particular things that you are supposed to give up all the way up until those things you've actually given up. What's the difference between the what's the pong out here as opposed to pong jar that this s p o n g b a r for our listeners. One is a verb and one is not.

What is it now? Okay. Yeah.

May implies like until until. Until what? I'm trying to find it in the text.

Everything's highlighted. So I'm having a hard time with which line. End of second line.

First, beginning of third line.

[Speaker 2]
Let's see. Thank you.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. Um, because pong jar indicates the objects to be given up and pong is the things that you have given up. Is it related to the sotarvabjun?

Like the individual, the divisions of the individual vows of the individual freedom ones? Oh, thank you. Yeah.

The vows of leaving the home life of Pratimoksha of individual freedom. They are up to chewa. They're divided or.

Yeah. So it's from those. Um, yeah, it's from the the ten and the six and the six.

Oh, they come from they come from that's what the name is. Yeah. I think so.

Yeah. Um. From those.

Yeah. Those that come from their constitute the. Yeah, they, they, yeah.

Maybe constitute the pay that rub to chase apart. The subdivision. Yeah.

Um. Uh, Mikta here. Um, and those contents.

I'm not sure about, uh, oh, uh, uh, no, see those or. The object. Here.

Yeah, yeah. Day that Mikta. Um.

Is that. Oh, that's the definition of an intermediate. Okay.

Yeah. So it's any right, a definition of the. Uh, get on my.

Home. Um. Intermediate nuns vows, right?

And I also have an intermediate nun, right? Yeah. Is that, uh, let's see.

Um, that Mikta just means thing. That thing, which is a vow, which is. Of the subsect.

Rob to chewa of. In files of individual freedom of leaving the home life. And then that S after NIPA is.

The debt that everything before that is like the definition. Okay. So.

[Speaker 2]
So.

[Speaker 1]
That you take. The values, the things that you. Like the value obtained or take.

It's same as told, but I use new sometimes. Yeah. Um, so right.

Maybe we're following this similar format in treating sets of vows as isolations within the. The greater body of possible vows. Right.

If fully ordained vows would be everything. Then, um, and then, uh, a novice. Or excuse me, a lay person vows would be just the 5.

Then we can also, we're also looking at an intermediate nuns vows as being. A subsection in all the possible vows in this case. Just the 10, the 6 and the 6.

Yeah, I think we're up to chewa means subset here or divided out from. Yeah. Right.

So that's interesting to define. Uh, sets of vows as subsets. Within the monks vows though.

That's sure going to be problematic. Considering fully ordained nuns. Yeah, right.

Yeah. It seems like we should consider a subset of fully ordained nuns because they have the most. Right.

That's it. Yeah. The monks only have these vows from within the greater corpus, the greater body of vows that are.

The full and complete full nuns vows. Yeah. Yeah.

If, but, uh, we weren't consulted. And this, um, what that's interesting. Well, I'll be interested to see.

Yeah. What happens from here? This is cool jumping.

You only have two minutes left, but you could make someone read for good luck. And then we could come back again, unless you have some other priorities. That is two minutes.

No, uh, uh, Bertha, would you like to read? They are translating. Oh, sorry.

Uh. He's already looking for her. No cutting.

Thank you. Kei patang ni nduk mi ja. Men du gyur par mi ja shing.

Ka na ma to chap mi ja. Nde shek sung pey chu duk go. De dak sung rab le shung yin.

Jei patang. Thank you so much. And this Geshe Michael translated himself.

Oh, great. I got it from his test. Yeah, we did it already.

Oh, okay. We did it in your book, your last book too. Yeah.

Yeah. Well, maybe we can... It's time by...

We can read it so we have more content for discussion for the next 15 minutes. That seems wise. Yeah.

Okay. Yeah. Okay.

So, that is time for today. And thank you all, all the teamwork. Nice.

And so now it is discussion time. And anybody want to share what they have learned from this section in the last one hour? You can just open your mic or feel free to raise...

Or you want to raise your hand. Okay, let me see. Nobody.

Okay, I'll just call your name. We're not in DSEU. Adam, would you like to share anything?

Nothing's coming to mind, but something. Yeah. What was it we were talking about?

So, the last six that were up there, I think that section that Geshe Michael had translated, I was trying to recall why a few of those... Because some of them seem a little funny. But in particular, there were these here, like, never sit together alone with the same kind of male.

You know, never touch a male with any part of your own body who's not a close relative. Never act as a go-between. And when I heard that one, I was like, was it...

I think we were talking about playing like a maker between two people. And then just the idea of the concentric circle kind of nature of keeping vows becomes very, very clear. Because if you never sit with a male, then you're not capable of actually touching them with any part of your body.

So, I think it just kind of spoke to me as being... Standing out as a... You know, just how refined, I guess, you have to get.

And if you keep kind of the outermost part of any particular vow, that can kind of protect you from some of the more easier ones that are kind of common to do. Like, it'd be kind of hard to not touch another male, like, on a Tokyo subway, I think, right? So, you know, anyways.

So, you kind of caught me on the spot, but that's where I'm at. Thank you so much. They didn't have Tokyo subways in ancient India, but I'm sure of it.

Yeah, yeah. Thank you. There were some very crowded streetways in Varanasi, though.

I like how this seemed to me to be a reminder that when we talk about specific vows related to a set of vows, that we're also... It includes those other more foundational vows. And I think, like, sometimes we forget, you know, like, oh, I'm doing the Bodhisattva vows.

I don't have to think so much about the root vows or, you know. So, it's just another wonderful reminder that it's all of a cloth. Yeah, that's nice.

Thank you so much. I will add on to Paula's. Oftentimes, when things don't seem to be working right for me, or I'm like, what's going on?

Usually, I return back to the foundational practices, like the foundational vows. Because I'm like, huh, maybe there's a reason why these are supposed... they are foundational.

And I always find that that seems to resolve things more quickly than if I'm looking at what you're saying, like Bodhisattva vows or other vows. Like, it seems like if I focus on those, in addition to, right, not forgetting, but in addition to, like going back to the principle practices, like the three principle practices, right? Like the renunciation, bodhicitta, and wisdom.

That seems to always help me find out where I'm possibly, in maybe subtler ways, breaking those foundational practices. And then things kind of seem to come back together for me. It's just sort of how it works.

It seems to work for me. Cool. Very beautiful.

Because sometimes when we, particularly when you take higher vows, then sometimes we may neglect those foundations. And, yeah, but actually those foundations can keep us anchored and have a foundation. And to, so to help us keep on track, personal experience.

There's a tradition in the yoga tradition. You find in some commentaries that the Yamas, the five foundational commitments in yoga. What is it?

Don't hurt anybody. Ahimsa, Satya, don't lie. Ahimsa, Satya, Asteya, don't steal things.

Brahmacharya, not hurting people with sexual energy. And then aparigraha, not having too much. That these four are commentary on the first.

That these are elaborations on how to not hurt anybody. And so it's nice to think of this greater body of vows for myself, who has a more limited set of vows. To be able to look at the ordained vows as this deeper way of engaging.

Even for me, as a deeper way of engaging in the depths of how to not hurt people. That there are subtler and subtler levels. I don't want to hurt anybody.

How can I get better at it? Here's this list of things I might not think of the way that I hurt people. If I dig in the ground the way I put other people in my community at risk.

If I try to swim across a raging river. Or is it really a good idea for me to get involved in passing messages between boys and girls? Or should I also stay the heck out of that?

Maybe I don't have the vow. But maybe that's not a territory where it would be healthy for me to be asserted in. And why is that?

Why is it that this greater list of vows. That you can take a commitment to try to flex the muscle of keeping the behavior. That an enlightened being can't help but automatically act according to.

That an enlightened being automatically keeps all of these. And you can learn to flex the muscle of keeping them. But this is the fully ordained nun's vows.

Probably especially in my opinion. Are something like perhaps what it would look like to be a fully enlightened being. And then you can play with any of these elements if you want to practice being a Buddha.

I think then the more for me anyway. The more that I study and work with these ideas. The more vows I seem to want.

It's like oh I want these now. Please help guide me. Because I can't figure it out myself.

Oh I want to try more. And I think that's. I'm not saying anything about becoming ordained.

But there's kind of this. We all wondered for a moment. Maybe.

To me it feels like one of the motivations that would eventually perhaps take me to that place. Like oh I want this now. For that particular reason.

And I love what you're suggesting. That maybe there's something. Because someone asked in the chat earlier about why do nuns have more vows.

Maybe there's something closer to enlightenment there. That you're suggesting. I kind of like that.

Well you know Tim that's exactly why I took nuns vows. I wanted more directions on how to be like a Buddha. That's what the vows are.

They're directions. Do this. Don't do that.

Think about this. So yeah. Great.

Thanks for sharing. Thanks for sharing that. This reminded me of a joke that sometimes gets Michael May about why nuns have more vows.

But today we are talking about different explanation. I think Venerable Jimmy will be very happy to hear this explanation. And I see somebody wrote in the chat.

She said that vows help to tidy up our lives step by step. Do you want to open mic and share? Oh sorry it could be quite noisy.

Is it noisy? We can hear you great Svetlana.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. I just wanted to share that vows as Venerable Karin perfectly mentioned it's like directions. So it can help us to stop all mess in our lives step by step.

Because it's difficult for us to tidy up our life from moment on. So it can help us how to navigate in our lives. And make it more pure and easier.

And taking decisions based on some principles which can make our life happier and lighter.

[Speaker 1]
Great. Thank you so much. And they might go some way toward that end done without taking them as a vow.

But taking them as a vow. Committing your life to them is the way to freedom. Cool.

Okay. And I think it's okay to say that you can play with these. I mean before I got Bodhisattva vows for example.

I kept them in my book. I forgot who told me originally what there's a silly American saying. Try before you buy.

But you can. There's no reason you can't put vows in your book that you don't have yet for fun. To have deeper ways to think about your interactions with the world.

Deeper ways to think about caring for people. Or fake it till you make it. Yeah, fake it till you make it.

Try the vows before you buy the vows. If you'd like. No one can stop you from seeing what it would be like to practice these things before you've made a commitment to them formally.

Vanapakachi, you want to share?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, I just would like to thank all these beautiful people. Nuns who said about the other. Why do we have so many vows?

I mean nuns. And it sounds great for me. Because I thought about it.

And I thought we're just worse. That's why we have to think about ourselves most strictly. But that's great.

Maybe we got closer to enlightenment. And what today's class brought to me is that we shouldn't touch a man. We, I mean nuns.

I'm a nun. So I'm not supposed to even touch a man by hand. So to say hi is already not as good as I thought.

So I will try. And thank you for this class. And thank you for this explanation.

It helps me. And of course it's helping other people to just be more precise about the vows we have. Because this is the way to our freedom.

To something bigger, something higher. And this direct us through our life. And let us understand what we not yet understand.

And maybe it will help us to make next step. And next step. And next step.

Thank you for the class and for your explanation. Thanks everyone.

[Speaker 1]
Thank you everyone for the class. I think it's time. Yeah.

But before last thing, just want to share that Geshe Michael is recovering well. And yesterday he could start to walk downstairs first time after the surgery. So just want to share the good news with everybody.

And thank you for our team's help. I appreciate it. Thank you.

Thank you Xiaoping for a great class. That was awesome. So much fun.

Yeah. Thank you for being brave and being willing to be abused by all of your friends publicly. We love you and it was awesome.

Thank you. Dr. Kwan. Hello Dr. Kramer. How's it going? Congratulations Xiaoping. First team class.

Amazing. Now the team is teaching five classes a month. So many team classes.

Congratulations team. Just kidding. But yeah, it's also very cool to see how the dynamic is building when it has to be a team class.

And all the students and participants are like sharing ideas, exchanging ways of proposing ways of addressing the tech. So it's very, very cool. And I'm glad we are getting together here to spend this wonderful time together.

Great community. So today I'm going to share with you what's happening around. Okay.

So this is the thing. Guess who won the World Series? Geshe Michael's baseball team, the Dodgers.

Now because they won, it's the eighth World Series championship they have as far as I understand. One time Geshe Michael was talking to me about baseball. And then I say, I don't know anything about baseball.

And he said, well, you know, Ken Rinpoche was an expert of it. So I'm still thinking and still inviting you guys. Come on, participate on this.

Send a short video and tell me why do you think there can be deep meaning about talking about such things as sports? And maybe coming up with an idea of talking about like sports and deeper inner growing teachings, you know? Like how do you connect these two things?

Deep inner growing teachings with sports? Just give me your ideas and we will see who wins. And the person who wins will make big prizes.

I'm not telling you what. But still wondering also about what's the connection between the Four Fruits and the Bodhisattva label. So if any of you knows about this, please share as well.

I think it's going to be very fun. And you will like it if you send us videos. Okay.

Keep going with Halloween celebration. Big American party happening just two days ago. It's very wonderful to me to see how the Peachtree Cafe is serving as a place for connection, friendship, community.

Many, many friends attended there and hosted the party. Even when Geshe Michael is having a great time in San Diego, the students and friends hold the fort there. And apparently it was so wonderful.

So thank you for doing this and bringing joy to the community. Somebody else could throw a party. It's Sky Harvest.

They are, you know, working in this community house. There are some scriptures in the wall, as you can see, probably written by Errol a few years ago. We don't really know, but we are investigating.

And a few people in town. You know, it's a very small town, but it's already attracting people. Soon we're going to be talking about the organizers of Sky Harvest to hear what is this deal about.

It's growing. It's happening. And soon they are going to be throwing a big project on it.

Today we want to talk with some very good friends that happen to be doing a very cool project. It is a meditation retreat in Colombia. And we're going to go linking with them.

And they're going to share about what they are about to start doing this morning. Today. I mean morning because they are in Colombia.

Hola. Can you help me to spotlight them, please? Tech table.

Hello to everyone. Hola, Sandra. Hello, Paulina.

Hi. We just want to say hi to everyone. We are here in Colombia.

This is the participants. Yay. We have 33 participants for this retreat.

We're going to learn how to meditate based on all this ancient wisdom. So we are so excited. It's going to be three days of beautiful teachings, yoga, silence mornings, vegetarian food, and a lot of beautiful community and space to learn how to meditate and to give the basis to meditate on a daily basis.

So thank you very much to everyone. Please send your blessings because we are very excited to expand these teachings in Latin America. Yes.

And where is Aldo? Here is Aldo. Hi, Juan.

Hello, Aldo. Can you send a quick hopes? What are your hopes for this retreat, Aldo?

What do you expect and what do you hope to accomplish? Oh, we expect to really learn the basics, to really train the mind, to have like a peaceful, insightful, calm, kind mind, Juan. That's the goal.

Wonderful. And then when are you going to be back in Colombia? Soon.

Very soon. Okay. Sending best wishes.

It's very nice to see you. You're about to start this today teachings retreat. And please let us know at the end how it goes.

Of course. Thank you, Juan. Thank you, everyone.

[Speaker 2]
Thank you, Juan.

[Speaker 1]
Great team. Great family. Bye.

Best luck. All right. So there you go.

That's the event happening in Colombia. And I have a few other things. Oops.

Not this. But I'm trying to share my screen again. One second.

I don't know why now I cannot. Yes. I hope you can see.

Can you see the pictures? It's apparently coming. Not yet.

Is that the meditation retreat picture or no? You have started sharing your screen is what it says. It's been going on for a long time.

Maybe I'm going to see if the tech table could help me this time. They asked me, do you want me to help? And I said, no, I want to try because I want to learn better.

But in my, I'll say, in the face of trouble, now I beg for help. Thank you so much. Okay.

So that was a retreat where our friends Paulina and Aldo are. And they are there. They already got there a few days ago.

They've been giving small, like introductory courses. And today, this weekend, is like this in-depth retreat they're going to have. And on next Tuesday, they go back to their own countries.

So we want to wish them best of lucks. And just to share a few other news, just before we finish for today, the advanced level four, NSCIM, keeps going. They have a few more days to go.

And just to answer the question one of our friends had a few days ago, the AI at the bottom of the poster stands for ancient intelligence, as far as I understand, which is a very interesting idea, how we can double our productivity using ancient intelligence. And, yeah, people are still on it. We want to wish them also best of lucks.

Can we go to the next picture, please? Just, again, as a reminder, upcoming things. Get ready in just a few more days, about two weeks from now, we're going to be having the Hatha Yoga Pradipika chapter four.

And tomorrow we're going to have a small talk with Lidia, which is going to share also similar to the other day when Errol came and shared some content with us. On Monday, sorry, we're going to have Lidia also sharing some content. So if you are not sure yet if you want to sign up, I really, really encourage you.

It's going to be very amazing. New translations, new material that Geshe Michael has finished is going to be shared. And the content is very, very deep.

Also, as a reminder, Kyoto is still in process. If you want to sign up, if you want to come, just a reminder, keep talking with Tim Lowenhaupt, keep talking with Alejaso. They can help you.

They can make it happen. Just make sure you let them know you want to go, because they're going to try to figure it out what's the best way of still feeding you in. Can I add one thing about that?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. We have mainly sold out in Kyoto, which is awesome, but we have come up with a way that maybe 40 more people can come. So please do get yourself on the waiting list.

We're confirming with the venue if we can do that. So I just want to say we have found a secret way of doing it. We just have to confirm if we can or not.

So if people want to do it, how can they sign up for the waiting list? Just contact you? They can contact me.

That's also on our website as well. And, of course, yeah, Octavio, we are having an online program as well for that. So that's available for sign up on the website too.

Very, very well. Thank you as well. So there you go.

I think it's going to be very cool, very amazing.

[Speaker 2]
It's going to be my first time.

[Speaker 1]
Juan, you snuck in last minute. We got a space for you. Awesome.

Thank you. I appreciate it. Thank you so much.

Yes, I also already signed up a few, I don't know, days or weeks ago. I talked with Ale. Hope everything is well.

Thank you so much. And I bet it's going to be amazing. Very, very fun.

I'm excited. My first December there. Let's see how it goes.

And just finally, just to leave you with, yeah, send us whatever you want to talk about. I'm still cooking, like, a few different events. A few people have contacted us.

And I haven't forget about you. I just haven't organized myself very well. But we're going to do it.

And I'm going to be reaching out to cover all of your wonderful news. But if you have any other news you want to share, please send us a message or contact me directly as well, if you happen to have my contact. Or just send an email to info at virtualnews.com.

And we can keep talking and schedule something to present your projects or even good news that just happened. Okay, so that's all for today. I wish you a very good weekend.

And see you Monday if everything goes well. Thank you so much.