Бетси Грир — Книга 2: Интерлюдия о пустоте, занятие 53

[Speaker 1]
I'm going to start with my presentation.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, you just started there. I didn't know. I was worried about what you were writing.

[Speaker 3]
Here's a fun writer.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. Nick got your tongue. I lost my voice.

I really have a flu. I have the flu. I'm sorry.

I don't know, man. I think you're doing pretty good. Hey, Ben, he's kidding, right?

I don't know. I think he sounds incredible.

[Speaker 2]
I'd like to hear him sing personally.

[Speaker 1]
You don't? I'm not kidding. It could be worse than it used to be.

[Speaker 2]
Exactly. It's beautiful. Listen to the dulcet tones.

Thank you so much for being here this morning, everybody. Thank you especially for being here this morning once again. We're so lucky that you spend this time with us.

Having weekly time with you is very, very cool. It's still a special occasion even though we get to do it weekly now. It's exciting to get to wake up.

It's better than a cup of coffee. Not as good as both you and a cup of coffee. And also, Utpala, thank you so much for preparing, texting me furiously this morning.

I know you had internet troubles. We're very lucky to get the full you, and you are crafting a way to make it all work for us no matter what happened. Thank you, live translators.

Your effort is staggering. I can't believe that you do this every week. It is utterly inspiring that you put up with the likes of especially me, which reminds me to be slower.

And with no further ado, I turn it over to Dr. Geshe Michael and Utpala. Thank you so much.

[Speaker 1]
Thank you, Dr. Kramer and Venerable Utpala. Utpala, we're turning it over to you for your amazing homework. Good morning, good afternoon, good evening.

We're doing a text called Introduce on Emptiness, and you might want to do a few dharani if you know them in preparation for this quiz. By the way, Grandpa is exempt from all quizzes. Yes.

All right. Oh, I guess I got to share my screen first. Hold on.

It helps if you give away money, Utpala, I'm telling you. You get more attention. If you owe people money, it gets more attention.

Can you see the quiz?

[Speaker 3]
Yes.

[Speaker 1]
Yay. Okay, here we go. It was a really long time ago, but we were talking about, you know, various aspects of, oh, gosh, it was the Detailist School, the Sutra School, the Mind Only School, the Objectists, and the Consequence Branch.

So we had a lot going on last time. So hopefully you remember a little. I tried to make it easy.

Okay. So when blue appears to a sense consciousness, the blue itself appears to be, by definition, the basis of its essential nature and characteristics, such as the phrase, this is blue. So what's going on with what appears to the sense consciousness?

It's a lot easier than that whole sentence, those whole two sentences. Just blue? A little bit more difficult than that.

Okay. The appearance is infected by duality. Whoa.

So according to the Mind Only School. That's like two cinnamon rolls, right? Something like that.

All right. According to the Mind Only School, or maybe it's the cinnamon and the roll together. But anyway.

So what does apperception experience when it experiences that consciousness we just asked about? This was a long time ago. It experiences it without the appearance of duality.

So what does duality mean from a Buddhist perspective? A. And B.

In what way is it often misunderstood? Let's go with A first. It means object and subject.

[Speaker 2]
The way they appear is different to the way that they really exist.

[Speaker 1]
Gosh, you tried to mix them both into one. Very good, Juan. But yes, from the Buddhist perspective, the way something appears and the way it exists are not in accord.

So, Juan, let's B. Yeah. B is like sometimes it's confused with this thing of, I don't know, subject and object are.

No, I don't know. I forgot.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
I got this backwards. People misunderstand this to mean that subject and object are separate and that non-duality means that they're one. Yeah.

That's cool. Okay. There's no objects or something like that.

Yeah. Right? Something like that.

Right. It's all one. So a mentalist and a consequentialist walk into a room.

And they encounter an object that appears to an unmistaken sense consciousness and does not exist by definition. And for each one, I'm going to ask you to say what appears and what problem do they have? So we'll start with the objectist.

So they encounter an object that appears to an unmistaken sense consciousness and does not exist by definition. What appears? An object which functions?

That does not exist by definition. Oh, something that, okay. So an object that which by definition doesn't.

[Speaker 2]
I mean, which is not, it's not real.

[Speaker 1]
What object? You said it appears to an unmistaken sense consciousness. And what problem do they have?

None. Apparently there's no object. So they wouldn't know how to establish that as an existing thing.

Okay. Now a mentalist encounters an object that appears to an unmistaken sense consciousness and does not exist by definition. What appears?

So what does it look like? Or what did they think of it as?

[Speaker 2]
Appears to be outside. Couldn't she not appear outside?

[Speaker 1]
To be outside. But like, what's, what's, what is that appearance? What is the, shall we say nature of that appearance?

[Speaker 2]
This is the ripening of a seed inside the coochie number shape.

[Speaker 1]
Oh, and it is bold by name and mental image. So something appears and it's just, you know, labeled by name and mental image. That's fine.

So what problem do they have now? This is of course, according to the consequence branch of the middle way, because they think they have no problem. So this one pulled in something that was a little, that was pretty interesting last time.

To me anyway, their problem is they wouldn't know how to establish it as a real thing. It's just a mental concept. And it has nothing to do with cause and effect.

A consequentialist encounters that same object. Appearing to an unmistaken sense consciousness. And that does not exist by definition.

What appears to them? It seems like you could repeat a from the previous one. You'd be pretty safe.

Right. But it's also part of a cause and effect relationship. So it's, it's merely labeled by name and mental image and it's part of a cause and effect.

It's also established on a, on a seed. Right. Like the last one.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
The last one. Well, somehow they separated that out. So that may be something that we, we debate word about how can something be, I mean, it's related to a seed, but not related to cause and effect.

How does that happen? What is cause and effect? If it's not seeds ripening.

So what's their problem. According to whom. According to the consequence.

Okay. According to themselves. What's their problem.

No problem. Okay. So I'm going to ask for you to give me either the Tibetan for the English or the English for the Western Chinese.

Infected by duality. What's infected. Lay.

[Speaker 3]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. That's cool. Later.

Dual. Oh, has. Yeah.

Nice. Up to that point, or as far as that. Perfect.

Perfectly. Perfect. Yay.

Very much. That's a word looking for his money. Which is virtual reality.

Oh, nice homework. Good. All right.

I mean, I'm so glad I don't have to be there. All right, here we go back. Let's see.

That good. Okay. Yeah, that's it.

Okay. Let me get the big cursor up from Mrs. Miss vinegar. Okay.

Would you like to start then. And then we'll go to something else. Yes, please.

Nice. Okay. Let's go from the back.

I think it'd be easier. Dhagnyen Chenpo Mahatma is referring to Je Tsongkapa. They just quoted his book about trang ne, about interpreting the Buddha, right?

So I was wondering though, if that wasn't... Could it also be that at this instant they're talking about Master Dharmakirti? Because within...

The last direct quotation was Je Tsongkapa. But it also included a little quotation from the Pramanavarttika. Because there are two objects of consideration, there are two accurate perceptions.

Yeah, it could be. I mean, it could be. But I think when they say Dhagnyen Chenpo, I think they'd be referring to Je Tsongkapa.

Okay. Yeah. Otherwise they'd say Kepa Chenpo or something like that.

I think so. Okay, okay. Now, what he's saying is, dzok depa mi sipa means what?

It's impossible for the sutras. Yeah, that's the point, okay? So this whole sentence is negative.

You cannot find a person in the second school who blah blah blah blah blah. According to Tsongkapa, you couldn't find a person in the second school who believes the following. So we're getting an impossible statement.

We're expecting an impossible statement, okay? Something about them. shung di kap su At that point in...

dun je nupar means what? It means an object that's necessarily able to perform a function. Yeah, something which can perform a function.

Something which can perform a function. Oh right, the kyap is later. Yeah, and then it says all objects which can perform a function have to be...

two choices, rang tsen or chi tsen. Are they theoretical entities? Or are they actual cups in the world?

If they can perform a function, they are actual cups. They must be manifest objects, yeah. Actual objects.

Must be. Have to be. If it does something, it has to be a manifest object in the world.

We had it in Adam's text. We raised a possibility, right? We raised a counterexample.

What was it? Does anybody remember? A mental entity that could perform a function.

Ideas? Idealism? Yes, like democracy or something like that.

But a second school person would say if it functions, if it can do something, it must be an actual object in the world, and it cannot be a theoretical cup. The theory of a cup, or the idea of a cup, doesn't do anything, according to them. wang che ma chulway ngo kyi nang yin wang che ma chulway...

What's wang che ma chulwa? That's an unmistaken sense consciousness. Yeah, and he is purposely excluding what kind of perception.

An inaccurate perception. Not like super drunk, or got their head banged, or something like that. Angry person, jealous person.

wang che ma chulwa... Assuming their sense consciousness is accurate and unaffected by some other circumstance, then what it's... the thing that's appearing to their sense objects, when you consider anything appearing to an unmistaken sense object, something which dun che mi nirpa, mi si...

Yeah, is not able to perform a function, is impossible. Yeah, if a sense consciousness which is not crazy is perceiving something, it's impossible that that object is not doing something. Okay?

Double negative. It's impossible that that object is not doing something. If you can perceive something with a sense awareness, eye, ear, nose, tongue, skin, then it must be performing some kind of function.

For example, triggering your awareness. You know what I mean? Got it?

Almost by definition, it must be performing a function. If it's functioning, it must be the actual object in the world, and if it's the object of a sense awareness, it has to be doing something. It has to be performing a function.

Why is he talking about that here? Why is he saying that's the belief of the second school? There's your key.

Second school. Because we just talked about the two objectists. Yeah, the third school would say what?

Oh, the third school would say... Can the blue out there perform a function? The blue out there?

Perform a function. According to the second school, the blue out there has to be able to perform a function. For example, triggering my eye awareness.

But according to the third school, can the blue out there perform a function? Why not? There is no blue out there according to the third school.

Got it? Big difference. It's a big difference.

Second school, the blue out there is inspiring, or is triggering my sense perception. Third school, the seeds in my own mind are creating that object out there. There is no object out there.

Big difference. Got it? Cool?

Okay. All right. SHES PA'I PHYI ROL That's what they say.

Okay. You want to do one more Venerable Upala and then you can pick on other people. Yes, please.

SEMS BSAM PA'I DBANG ZHES LA DE GANG SNANG BA'I DUN DE NYID ZHES MA PA LA SKABS DER BAG PA'I RANG ZEN DUN DU PHAR DUN PA'I ANG MIN TE Okay. The SEMS BSAM PA, what's that mean? Those are the mind-only school.

What's the Sanskrit? I'm sorry? What's the Sanskrit for SEMS BSAM PA?

Probably it's either Chittamatra or... Chittamatra. Chittamatra.

They're also known as NEL DROD CHOS PA, Yogacara. Two synonyms. Yogacara, or NEL DROD CHOS PA, or SEMS BSAM PA, which is Chittamatra, which all means mind-only school.

They say... And by the way, you guys should pay me for all the corrections I make on your class.

[Speaker 3]
No.

[Speaker 1]
Because the problem is the word they have in the carving is a possible word. You have to really understand the subject matter to understand that they misspelled it, miscarved it. Very frustrating.

SEMS BSAM PA DBANG ZHES LA DE LTAR SNANG BA'I DUN DE NYID The object that appears to the sense consciousness according to the mind-only school, is it the same object that appears to the sense consciousness according to the second school? No. No, it's not, right?

And he doesn't call the second school DO DE PA. He doesn't call them sutras here. He calls them...

He calls them logicians. SEMS BSAM PA, Pramanas. Those guys who love to talk about Pramana.

Okay, accurate conception. DE'ER BDAG PA'I RANG BRTZEN DU BDOD PAR LTOS PA'ANG MIN TE SKABS DE'ER BDAG PA'I RANG BRTZEN DU BDOD PA This BDAG PA means what? It's...

This BDAG PA can mean known. Known as. Yeah.

It can mean known as, but it can also mean for an object to announce itself. Okay, so you guys got to be aware of that. BDAG PA can mean for an object to announce itself.

Generally, BDAG PA for example means advertising or marketing to announce something. RANG BRTZEN DU BDOD PAR So does the mind-only school want to call a cup which appears to have the sense consciousness, do they want to call it RANG BRTZEN, a cup in the world? No.

No, I would say not. I don't think they use that word much. Okay, CI TSEN, RANG BRTZEN.

They're not that big on it. So when we were in Adam's text, we were talking about RANG BRTZEN and CI TSEN. RANG BRTZEN, cup in the world.

CI TSEN, the concept of a cup in your mind. That's a big topic with which school? Sutra school.

Okay, good. So we're getting... By the way, why we're talking about all this stuff in the first place is that we are on the three characteristics of the mind-only school and we've been stuck there for like two years.

And just so you know, we're about to come out of it. It's like moving out of an eclipse. Into the light, you're saying?

Yeah. So let's mention one more time the three categories in which the mind-only school puts all things. GZHAN RANG Things that are under the power of other things.

Yeah, all-cause things. They're called under the power of other things because they're at the mercy of their causes. All objects which are at the mercy of their causes are called other power.

Other power. GZHAN RANG That's the first category. Most stuff is there.

Most existing stuff is there. Then there's, I don't know, KUN LTAR Which means... Mental concepts?

Conceptual stuff, whether it exists or not. And you got to say it that way. Conceptual stuff, whether it exists or not.

GARG CHAS are KUN LTAR But they don't exist. People who could irritate you that aren't coming from you. Those are conceptual.

You made them up in your mind, but they don't exist. Is there conceptual stuff that does exist in the second school? Sorry, in the third school.

Is there conceptual stuff that does exist? Not much, but there's a few things. For example...

I don't know. Someone's name. Well, couldn't you say that everything is when you get right down to it?

That's a higher school. Okay, KUN LTAR Then if you could subtract the non-existing things, the non-existing KUN LTAR from the GZHAN RANGS, from the stuff that is there, what would you come up with? YONG GRUB, which means the sum of the parts, or the answer in the equation.

It's called YONG GRUB. Like something SIDDRA. It came out at the end.

You subtracted things that were never there from things that were doing something and you come out with emptiness. That's their formula, famous formula. The thing they really want to subtract is blue stuff that's outside.

That's what they want us to... That's their RGAGS BYA. That's what they say never existed.

Blue stuff that existed outside. They say when you see blue, you're watching part of your own life. So outside blue stuff for them is KUN LTAR and that's where we are.

Then we're exploring, how does the second school feel about that? What would they say? Blue stuff out there.

Second school. What would they say about blue stuff out there?

[Speaker 2]
It does something.

[Speaker 1]
Of course, it's out there. Of course it's out there. How do you think...

[Speaker 2]
The answer.

[Speaker 1]
What do you think triggers your visual awareness? Something has to set off your visual awareness. If the mind only school was right, there'd be nothing to trigger visual awareness from the outside.

So we don't accept that. Got it? DA LTA RNAM RIG PA'I RNAM RIG PA here he's using a new synonym for the mind only school.

Mentalists. RTEN DE NYID MING DANG DE ZHAG TZAM Would they say that blue exists? Not outside.

Would they say that blue exists? Third school. Yes.

They'd say that blue exists, but it's only established through ming and dak. It's a conceptual thing. It's a conceptual thing.

That's the very popular expression used by which school? Exists in name only. Our school.

Fourth school. It's the fourth school. How do you think the third school feels about this expression of the fourth school?

The fourth school says it exists in name only. How does the third school feel about that? That's fine.

They'd say if you mean it exists only through some scene in storehouse consciousness, we're okay with that. That sounds good. It exists in name only.

What's the name only in the name only for the fourth school? What is the name? The leaf.

The term itself and the image? Yeah, but it doesn't matter. You could call it fish, but it would be the same.

Okay. BSAM DANG So they say, now a question for you guys. In the third school, could something be existing through a concept and still be functional?

[Speaker 2]
Yes.

[Speaker 1]
Still do something. Could a thing be conceptual and still do something? Because in the second school, what's Tiantan?

No. Possible. Never ever.

As my teacher used to say. But what about the third school? Yeah, the blue that looks like it's outside makes you think of...

That's a pretty 1952 truck. I've got a name on it. I'm still trying to figure out how to get around my wife on that.

Of course, I wouldn't want to do that. Okay. So in the third school, can you have a thing which does something and is only nominal?

Conceptual. Yeah, blue. Blue can cause you to write a check.

See what I mean? Right? But it's not outside.

Got it? So it's real, but it's not outside. Okay?

All right? It's functional. It does something.

It makes me write a check. Hopefully. If I can figure out how to get away with it.

Okay. NAM RIGS PA'I MING DANG DE SHAGS PA TZAM LA RGYUN DE SBYOR Now here comes the point that Venerable Utpala was trying to drill into us in the homework. To go deeper, if the blue outside is in the third school, if the blue outside is a creation of your mind, seeds in your storehouse consciousness, can it still function?

Can it still cause something? Can you still have a causing effect with all this stuff? And they say no.

Tsongkapa is like, they have trouble with it. In the fourth school, if it's a creation of your mind, it's totally consistent with it being causing an effect. A person who comes from...

an irritating person who's created from your seeds can also cause you trouble which is created from your seeds. That's okay. But in the third school, they have a little bit of trouble.

Does the blue, which is part of my mind, how do you talk about the effects that it has? How do you talk about the causing effect of the effects that it has? They have some trouble.

They're a little bit shaky. They're shaky on that point. In the highest school, yep, the blue's out there and it's coming from me, and the blue creates a consciousness of it which is coming from my seeds.

A pencil can write on a piece of paper, but I'm creating the pencil, and I'm creating the paper, and I'm creating the writing on the paper, and the pencil has nothing to do with the writing on the paper. Causing effect is fine. It's just weird.

In a world where everything's coming from me, it gets a little complicated. Pencils are not causing writing on paper. I am.

Okay, you okay? They get a little shaky about the causing effect part. Who?

The third school. Okay, all right. Now you're welcome to pick on somebody, Upa.

I have some mixed nuts in this room. I got Tim. I got Master Sven.

I would like Xiaoping, please. I don't know where Xiaoping is. She's somewhere in China.

Okay, I would like Venerable Jigme, please. Yeah, Jigme's here. Hang on just a sec.

We got to get her on the chair here. Xiaoping's online. Oh, Xiaoping's online?

Shh, don't tell. Okay. Oh, she's here.

348. Louder. DE NA GSUNGS DE'I DON DE NYID GANG SDUG BSNGAL RTOG PAR MI BYA'O Lovely, thank you.

DE NA GSUNGS DE'I DON GSUNGS DE'I DON means that statement. The meaning of that statement. Which of the two it applies to?

Which of the two groups it applies to? RTOG PAR MI BYA'O RTOG PAR means doubt. In modern colloquial Tibetan, it can mean a suspicion.

It can mean an ungrounded suspicion. It can mean paranoia. But here he says RTOG PAR MI BYA'O MI BYA'O Don't entertain any doubts.

Please get it clear in your head which of the two groups we're talking about when we talk about all this stuff. Which two groups is he talking about? The objectists and the mind only.

Number two and group number three. Sutras and the mind only. So he says, make sure you understand which group Je Tsongkapa is talking about when he says they have trouble with names.

They have trouble understanding names, how names apply to cause and effect. They have trouble in describing what's the real cup in the world and what's not the real cup. They have trouble.

But get it straight in your own mind which school I'm talking about. Don't confuse the two schools. They have differences, big differences.

In the same way that they have differences with the fourth school. And viva la difference. Geshe Michael, can I ask a question about that?

Is it to not entertain doubts about either of the two when Je Tsongkapa speaks about them? Or don't confuse, not doubt, but confuse yourself about which one thinks what? The kong, the force of the kong is don't get confused in your head about which school we're referring to when we make statements here.

Keep it clear in your mind that there's two different schools we're talking about. And don't mess up separating them when the time comes to separate them. For example, how do they treat cause and effect?

Or how do they treat wrong tense? Or how do they treat functional things? Try to keep it clear.

Try to keep it separate in your mind. When you keep it separate in your mind, then you're a better Buddhist. Because you can use it in your real life.

All right, I think we should make Venerable Jigme do one more because the last one was too short. Yes, please. You do the cursor?

And I'll do you. Okay. Okay.

Where are you? What did I say? I can't remember.

You said check. Did I really? Oh, okay.

Yeah, this cursor and talking at the same time, it's too early. It's like chewing gum. Yeah, it's too early in the morning for all this.

Are you talking? You're so early. Nice.

Great. Thank you. I'll give 100 bucks, except to work.

The key part here is, ,GZHEL BYA GNYIS PHYIR SOGS The key part here is at the end of the second line, ,GZHEL BYA GNYIS PHYIR SOGS It's a quotation. He's referring to a verse. Because there are two objects of consideration, dot, dot, dot, there are two kinds of accurate perception.

Nice. 100 bucks for you. Collect it from Venezuela, okay?

Don't forget. If you forget to collect it, it's not my fault. I won't forget.

No, I won't forget to give it to you. I was giving a talk in Japan and some older guy came up to me and said, ,GZHEL BYA GNYIS PHYIR SOGS you owe me 50 bucks from five years ago. I'm like, that's your...

All right. Wait, don't leave yet. ,GCIG GZHAN NA Well, if you ask, what does that mean?

Don't confuse the schools that we're talking about. He says, well, what do you mean? About what?

He says, GCIG. GCIG means what? What do you mean I shouldn't confuse them?

The Doris say, the Dodepas, The Sutras? Yes, they say that the ne or the yul which you doke with a da. The location of the object that you.

The object which you label with a term. Good, the object that you put a label onto, like the way that they put a price tag on something in a store, okay? The object which you put a label onto, rang tsen kek.

They refute. Yeah, there's a school that says, come on, if it's just labeled, which means it's not real, how could you call it a cup in the world? Who would think that?

Who would have a problem with that? The second school. The second school.

They're like, kung tak, you see? You take the third quality from, or the second quality from the Mainomi school, which is labeled stuff, and you export that to the second school, they're like, hey, that doesn't fit anything. What do you mean labeled?

It's just like, I'm talking rang tsen, I'm talking real cup in the world, and you want to call it labeled? How do they call it labeled? It comes from a seed in your storehouse consciousness.

Who says that? Third school. Third school wants to label the cup, the whiteness of the cup, for example, as coming from a seed in storehouse consciousness.

And second school says, labeled, forget cup. Labeled, forget cup in the world. Those are contradictory.

Got it? Cool. Nice.

Yeah. Fourth school, everything's labeled, plus the real cups in the world. All right?

They're real because they're labeled. Got it? Okay, got it?

And they say rang tsen gyi drubpa khek na. So Geshe-la, does that rang tsen gyi drubpa mean existing by its own characteristics? Yeah, but it's the short form of rang tsen.

Okay? Or rang kye tsen gyi gyu drubpa. Yeah.

It's just another word for rang tsen here. Okay? Well, and that's what he's playing with, right?

Because rang tsen to the sutras means something particular. Yeah. And the other schools are using rang tsen to mean...

I hear you can think of it as rang tsen. Khek is a form of the verb. Gag.

Gag, like gag ja. Okay? Don't get confused.

You can say khek, you can say gog, you can say gag. You can say ngok, ngak. Okay?

Or you can say khek. Khek is a soft passive. Khek.

Okay? Khek na. YOD PAR SBYOG MIN ZHIG PA If you say that a thing is the creation of names, in our school, SBYOG MIN ZHIG PA.

SBYOG means establish it as being real. Then if you say the cup is a result of naming process, in our school, there's a problem with calling it real. Whose school?

Number two. School number two. Don't go calling it rang tsen if it's labeled.

There's a problem in our school with that. All right? And by the way, you're getting an excellent, you're getting a very excellent introduction to the schools.

And the schools are usually presented as historical things that happened, but really in the deepest presentation, the thing that separates the schools is their presentation of emptiness. And that's why they're important. That's why they're not bullshit.

That's why they're really important. Because they are lesser ideas of emptiness. All right.

ZHES PA NI. ZHEL BYA'I GNYIS PHYIR GSOGS KYI GANG YOD ZHEL BYA'I GNYIS PHYIR means direct perception establishes vang sense. Deduction establishes chit sense.

I'll say it again. The foundation concept of the second school, the opening lines of the Pramanavarttika, there are two forms of perception because there's two forms of reality. For rang tsen, for real stuff in the world, we have what kind of perception?

Direct sense perception. Direct sense perception. And for concepts, we have logic.

Now I'll give you 24 years of logic. That's how the Pramanavarttika started. Got it?

Then it's like 20 years of logic to establish things that you cannot see with your eyes. DRUG PA'I PHYIR SOGS KYIS SKABS SBRGYUR RTOG DE'I PA RANG LA BYAG PA'I RANG BZIN DE LA MI CHE STE What does the RANG LA BYAG PA mean? Well, this is, let's see, what did I say?

This is not the renowned manifest object of the sutras themselves. Not really.

[Speaker 3]
From its own side, it announces itself.

[Speaker 1]
You could say that, but you could say as they interpret it. RANG TSEN as they take it to be. RANG TSEN as the second school takes RANG TSEN to be.

That's what it means here. RANG LA BYAG, how they advertise it to themselves. Okay.

All right. And here goes an interesting one. So now I would like Xiaoping to read.

Yeah. You are free. Yay, go have another beer.

Watch that video. Watch that video. Okay.

Okay. RTOG DE'I PA'I RNAMS KA RNAMS KYIS MING SGRUB PA'I ZHI YIN PA'I NGOS PO MING RTOG PA'I DE SHA CHA NI PHYIR SOGS KYIS KHABS KYIS RANG TSEN MING KYANG YOD PA SGRUB LA Nice. Standing must be whispering in your ear, I think, Xiaoping.

Why are you wearing a coat in Shenzhen? Oh, it's cold.

[Speaker 2]
We just arrived in Beijing, just now. Oh, it's cold here.

[Speaker 1]
Okay, welcome to Beijing. RTOG DE'I PA'I means the Sutras, right? Now, according to the second school, is empty space what you call empty space?

No. I think they would say yes. Let's say it again.

In the second school, is empty space what you call... Is space what you call space? Yes.

Yeah, but is the fact that space is called space, is that a changing thing or an unchanging thing? In their school. Unchanging.

Yeah, unchanging. It's an idea. The fact that space is called space is an idea.

It's not a functional entity. It doesn't do anything. So NGOS PO MING RTOG means the second school would not agree that the fact that space is called space is a functional thing.

DE'I ZHEL BYANG NYID CHER SOGS KYI SKABS KYI RANG ZAN Therefore, the fact that space is called space cannot be what is referred to in the opening lines of the Pramanavarttika as the SRANG ZAN in the opening lines of the Pramanavarttika. The opening lines of the Pramanavarttika say, if you want to perceive normal functioning things in the world, you're going to need direct senses. If you want to perceive concepts, you're going to need indirect perception, deduction.

So to us, second school guys, the normal stuff in the world, the SRANG ZAN, mentioned in the opening lines of the Pramanavarttika, which are confirmed by sense perception. If you say they involve naming, if you say they exist through naming, we can't call it an object of a sense perception. Cannot in the second school.

In the third school, you can get into kundtaks. In the fourth school, you can get into all reality coming through me. But in the second school, once it's named, it can't be a normal cup in the world.

Once you say it's creation of names, it cannot be a normal cup in the world. Space, therefore, cannot be. Empty space.

Space as the absence of things. Not space as outer space. All right.

But, there's a but. Who's going to read the but, Venerable Upala? I would like Rebecca to read, please.

Come on. She's got to get her way up here. Do do do do do.

Do do do do do do. Do do do do do. Okay.

All right. Venerable Upala. Unkyang.

Unkyang. Namkha nam khe.

[Speaker 2]
Ming jukpe. Sher nam kha. Rang gi ne tsuk gi.

Wang gi. Jukpar ndo. DE PHYIN DE LTAR MA GRUB NA NAM KHA'I YOD PA'I NJOG MI SHES SO Lovely.

[Speaker 1]
The question now that we're onto is, what's the status of named things in the second, third, and fourth school? In the fourth school, everything is named. We can't hear you, Geshe-la.

In the fourth school, everything is named. In the third school, some stuff is named. In the second school, what's the opinion?

This is what we're going to cover here. Unkyang, can space be the thing that you call space? In the second school, can empty space be the thing?

Can you refer to empty space as space or not? Yes. Of course you can.

You have to. Does it create the empty space? No.

It's just, you can call stuff stuff in our school. We're okay with that. Even weird stuff like empty space, you can call it empty space.

Now, question. Does the word space, does the words empty space apply to empty space naturally in the second school? Yes, it's established due to the very way that it is.

Yes, no problem. Naturally. If you don't call space space, what do you call space?

Space is space. You can call it space. It's okay.

It should be called space. Space deserves to be called space. That's their idea.

Nadesa is an idiom that you guys may not know yet, but it means by the very nature of things. Is it natural to call space space in the second school? Yeah, no problem.

You got to call it something. You could call it fish or green drink, but let's call it space. Whether that name applies to it naturally, we're not talking.

We're not discussing. But can you call space space? Yeah.

Nadesa kiwang gi dupar du. In the second school, the word space applies to space naturally. It should be called space.

Space should be called space. Got it? In the higher school, no, you could call it fish.

You could call it pizza. You could call it anything. But in the lower schools and the source of much conflict in the world, no, it has to be called space.

You can't call it pizza. All right? Dupar, they believe that some words apply to their objects naturally.

They should. Should apply to their objects. They believe the use of a name to a thing is natural to them thing.

They wouldn't say a rose by any other name is the same. They would not say that. Deytar margrup na.

If that were not the case, that the word space applied to space naturally, they wouldn't know how to joke the yupa of numbers. They wouldn't know how to establish the existence of space. Yeah.

If the name space does not apply to space naturally, I don't see any other way you can posit or you can say that space exists. There's second school. If the word space doesn't naturally apply to space, I don't see how you could describe space.

That's second school. Second school is a part of our own brain, right? You got all four schools in your brain.

The second, third, and fourth are kind of quiet. Isha Michael? Yeah.

Hasn't he thrown us a curveball here by choosing an object, an unchanging object like namka, which in the second school does not exist by name. Even in the second school, namka is a deceptive object. Talking about it truly deserving a name, is that a problem with an object that doesn't truly exist in the second school?

I think they're just trying to come up with a cheatsent to talk about. That's what I think. I think they're trying to talk about a cheatsent.

Even cheatsents deserve their names. Of course, cheatsents deserve their names. Cups in the world deserve their names.

Cups as ideas also deserve the name cup as idea. I just said that.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, so a thing that doesn't exist by definition deserves the name that doesn't exist by definition, deserves it though by definition.

[Speaker 1]
In their school they all exist by definition. Well, yeah, you can say that, but don't pick on them. All right, let's make her do one more, Rupala.

Okay. Please, Rebecca.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
Take us to Nirvana. Okay. If I could, I would.

Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. I'm going to push it down. Okay.

Oh, nice. Okay. RANG BZAN GYI THON KHA'I LAM PAR SONG BA'I THON THA'I NDI THOG PA BZHIN TU GNAS BYAS BAR YOD DO Okay, nice.

By the way, at the end, our author, K.W.J., is saying this is an extremely huge point. MA'I MAHARTA MA'I MAHARTA This is a real killing point. This is a super important killing point.

He says, and to grasp this is extremely important. And then our carving said THOG, which means realize wrongly Oh, to imagine wrongly. which is a big THOG PA without an S.

And it should have been, you know, K.W.J. is not going to say this is a grand understanding. He's not going to say this is a grand weird THOG. You know what I mean?

And I'm like, wait, something's wrong here. And I checked the scan and it was, you know, one of the scans is correct. So it should be S.

It should be R-P-O-G-S. Which means this is a huge idea. This is a huge idea.

K.W.J. is saying, look, this is a huge idea. And it's a difficult idea. And it's long.

You ready? Here we go. We got time.

NAM KHA When you take NAM KHA, is it RANG BZAN? Is it a cup in the world? No.

No, it's not. It's conceptual. Space is a concept.

You can't perceive space directly after you imagine it. Good. Empty space.

Not referring to the blue sky. NAM KHA DANG There do exist unchanging things in the second school. A few.

Like empty space. Empty space. And they might choose another unchanging thing, or something we all hope is unchanging.

Nirvana. Yeah, nirvana. Nirvana.

Now, to what extent do they exist through their names? To what extent do they exist through their names? In name only.

According to the fourth school. Even according to the third school, when they talk about the three qualities, kunthar. Named.

To what extent in the second school do these rare, unchanging objects exist through name only? And he chooses another one. And I'm tempted to think he's choosing unchanging things.

What's his second example of an unchanging thing? Nirvana. It's interesting.

He's throwing empty space and nirvana into the same bowl. He says, let's talk about unchanging stuff that we have trouble describing. Does it exist in name only?

In the second school. Space, empty space, and nirvana. Now, a clue might be, can you refer to empty space with the word empty space?

Yes or no? Second school.

[Speaker 2]
Yes.

[Speaker 1]
Can you use synonyms? Like sakpa sepa nirvana. What's sakpa sepa?

The end of defilements. End of impurities. The end of impurities.

He names a synonym for nirvana. Let's mess with it. Can you call empty space empty space?

Yeah. Can you call nirvana the permanent ending of all impurities? Yeah.

But if it exists in name only, shouldn't it be a different thing? According to you higher school stupid guys. Then you higher school guys, you have problems with synonyms.

If it only exists by name only, and I don't call it nirvana, and I call it the permanent ending of all impurities, isn't that become a different thing? If it exists in name only, hasn't it become a different thing? Because I'm using a different name, and you say it's just in name only.

Got it? sakpa sepa sok gi min khan la jukpay ne su The thing that the name refers to, which is either space or nirvana, etc., do they exist rang gi ne tsuk gi wang gi jukpa? Do they exist in and of themselves?

Ne tsuk means in and of themselves. Wang gi jukpa. do depa du Yeah, it's okay.

Let's say, that's okay. Second school, do they exist in and of themselves? It's okay.

Are they rang ten? No. No, they cannot be because they don't perform a function.

They say rang ten, cup in the world, and something which does something is synonym. They say chi tsen cannot perform a function. Concepts cannot perform a function.

We had that in Adam's text. do depa dupa de la do depa rang gi rang tsen gi ming ma tak yang Can you refer to empty space and nirvana with the name rang ten? No.

Can they be a cup in the world? No. Can you refer to empty space and nirvana as a cup in the world?

In the second school, no. ming ma tak yang You cannot refer to them with that name, but semsangpa tar na, according to the... Mind-only school followers.

But it's more subtle than that. Right. sangpa tar na do depa They say that what's really going on with the sutras is that.

Perfect. Nice, nice, nice, nice. But if you want to know the third school's take on the second school, what's the third school say the second school believes that the second school don't know they believe?

Okay, got it? About means, about applying means. That they've fallen into believing that they're a manifest object.

Yeah, so now we're getting the third school's interpretation of what's going on in the second school, which is getting more subtle. semsangpa tar na do depa According to the Mind-Only School, the sutras, de la rang tsen gyi dung kye langpar song kye langpar song means, by implication, they should have thereby implied that nirvana and empty space are rang tun. According to us, given all their beliefs, they must be believing that empty space and nirvana qualify as cups in the world.

According to the way the third school sees the second school. The third school sees the second school accepting something that the second school doesn't believe they're accepting. That something which is creation of names can be a cup in the world.

As empty space and nirvana. According to the third school, the second school must be thinking that these two examples of unchanging theoretical things, empty space and nirvana, must be actual cups in the world. Because they're named in normal fashion.

How's that? Okay. Anyway, so Khedrup Jai says, and he started out by quoting Tsongkhapa, this is a very massive idea that you guys have to understand.

The way the third school interprets the second school might be different from the way the second school interprets the second school. Because the second school doesn't even understand how they interpret things that exist. If the second school were honest, we'd understand that when they say something exists in name only, they still believe it's a cup in the world.

According to the third school. Got it? Okay.

Good? Okay. It's very subtle.

Whoa. We got... Negative three minutes.

Yeah, there's a good place to stop. Can you translate 354 and 355? Yes, please.

Nice class. Interesting. What's happening is we're getting a review of emptiness from different schools, and that will prevent you from making mistakes about your idea of emptiness.

Okay? That's the point. We're not just arguing useless stuff.

Somewhere in your heart, you are a second school. And in another place in your heart, you are a third school. And nowhere in your heart are you really fourth school, or you wouldn't be here.

What's the date today? The 11th. 11-11.

All right. We'll see you guys on Monday. Oh, discussion.

Sorry. Venerable Utpala will start with you, and Grandpa will shut up. How on earth can I use all this stuff in my real life?

And then please lead a discussion with the other people after you give your opinion. Okay, here we go. I have no opinion.

Please, someone share with me your opinion about how you might use this in your real life. And I've been thinking about this for a week. Anybody here want to come up?

Good luck. I'm very interested to hear. Unshare the screen.

Unshare the screen, sorry. Okay. Any volunteers in this?

There are many scholars in this room and up on the mountain. Okay, well, I sort of think that, you know, I go about in the world, and I have ideas in my head when I communicate with other people about what it is that I'm trying to communicate. And other people may have different ideas about what it is that I'm trying to communicate.

So, basically, communication is impossible. That proves what I always thought about interpersonal relationships. Okay.

Anybody else? Come on, you guys. Anything come up in your mind during this class, besides cinnamon rolls?

[Speaker 2]
Yesterday, Earl and I had a conversation. Earl, I see your face, right? We had this conversation on the phone yesterday.

We had a yoga class I had to go talk about Viveka, and we were desperately trying to figure out how to apply it to people's lives in their yoga class.

[Speaker 1]
And we were talking about the difference between the way we expect to see things and the way we experience things.

[Speaker 2]
And how those are two objects, like the way a yoga pose felt to me 10 or 20 years ago, that's still stuck in my mind when I'm feeling how my aging body is experiencing a yoga pose.

[Speaker 1]
And please notice the air quotes, in for real, how I'm really experiencing the yoga pose now, as opposed to how I should be feeling it if I had eaten fewer burritos, or how I used to feel it. And then we got into this discussion about whether the imaginary yoga pose that I'm not feeling, that I think I should be feeling, is not real, because I'm not feeling it. But then the real yoga pose that I'm really feeling right now is also not real, because I'm imagining some...

My yoga pose is not real. Can a lack of a yoga pose, can the lack of yoga pose be real, exist by definition? I guess, and I'm struggling with this question, and this was a wonderful class for me that I'm going to be...

My ears are steaming. My brain is steaming. But that there's something about our struggle between expectations and reality that has to do with two different objects in the world.

And if I can learn the difference between what I'm imagining and what is, then that's probably my only hope to heal my body, to take care of myself, to take care of my friends and children and yoga poses. You imagine a hairy mushroom next to you? That's what happens when you go spelunking, Ezra.

Okay, we got an opinion. Sugeng. Yeah, hi Venerable.

I'm just thinking in a simpler term, is that considering the discussion between second school, third school, and then about the third school opinion of the second school, I think, for me, what I got from this session is that it's good to open our options, be open for options and get feedback from all angles, especially from those who are more experienced, wiser than us. As in the second school, considering the opinions from the third school, which is supposed to be higher and more sophisticated. So I think this is very applicable to myself.

And especially when you don't think that they're higher than you. Yeah, that's true. Because they don't.

That's true. And we may not know that they are higher than us. And by being open to their opinions, we will open our horizon and we can grow much further.

Thank you, Sugeng. Anybody else in this room? Anybody?

Olga, you want to come in? Quick, quick, quick. I got Olga coming up.

Slowly. The old people move slower. Hi, everyone.

[Speaker 2]
I think starting from some previous classes that a lot of this discussion and debate has to do with defining the definitions or other undefined definitions. It seems sometimes that people are talking about the same thing, but just use their own words. And then they start arguing, arguing about the same thing.

Each of them is trying to prove the same thing to themselves, to the opponent, and not understanding it just because they use different terminology. For example, what do each of these people understand by the word real? It's very, very different in the minds of different people.

Function, what is functioning? What is coming from me? What is concept?

And things like that. If we define it prior to starting any debate, then maybe the point of the debate goes and we will have less conflicts and less arguments.

[Speaker 1]
Okay. Great. Anybody else?

We got Lindsay's coming up. Yay. Olga, we're having...

I'm so impressed. Talk loud. All right.

Yeah, I wanted to say that sometimes in my head there's a resistance to learning about the other three schools, like the mind only and everything. And I think part of it is, I'm like, well, there's infinite possible ways to misunderstand. I don't need to listen.

But I think what you said at the end made me realize that maybe it's like I specifically need to look at these three because I need to work on those things. And that it's like being narrowed down to help me with what I'm having an issue with the ways that I don't understand all the time. Yeah.

I think I would put it as there's no coincidences according to Buddhism. There's a reason why you were in this class and you were supposed to learn something about, maybe about different opinions about the same thing. Cool.

Venerable Upala? Anybody online? Anybody online?

Ella, would you like to please speak? Oh. Hi, yes.

I'm actually more fluent through my fingers. But basically, this information is useful for me when I run into a problem that's upsetting because it's probably because I'm looking at it wrong. And if I look for a worldly solution, it's not going to fix it.

But if I try to find the higher school understanding, it usually almost immediately dissolves at least the upset. And then you can deal with the problem. Great.

Thank you. I think there's a big difference in this. And today it was a big difference between once you say that something exists in name only or it's a creation of names, then how real is it?

Can it still be real? I think there's something big there, some big topic there. I think what's unusual in today's lesson is that the lower schools have been forced into talking about name only.

And they're not totally comfortable with it. Anybody online? Can I say something?

Hi. Oh, Berta. Well, what it's done to me, this class, is that it has helped me lay a stronger foundation of the other schools.

Because obviously I strive to go to the higher one. And I try to locate myself in which school I am in each situation. And I think it just made a more solid foundation on each one and made me just stop and think a little bit more, which I think is just helping me to really try to achieve better to go to the higher school.

I think we did a meditation before we did class today. So we try to do on Saturdays, we do a little meditation together. And rather than...

We were talking about how do you respond to a person that you have a problem with? And we were talking about trying to see them as coming from you. But I think the exercise that Khyabje is doing here is, okay, I know you're all fourth school people.

I know you believe that every irritating person you meet is coming 100% from you. But would it be useful to pretend sometimes how a lower school person might think? Because you might detect a little bit of lower school person inside of you.

You see what I mean? Are you actually believing that some of what irritating stuff coming from other person is coming from other person? You see what I mean?

So would it be useful sometimes to go to the cafe and meet an irritating person and say, let's pretend I'm a second school. Oh, some of their irritating stuff is coming from them. And some of it's coming from me.

And then you suddenly realize you've been second school all along. Something like that? Sugeng said cool.

Rosa said depressing. Okay. Which means it's all just names only.

All right. We are seriously going to the cafe. What else we got?

We're out of time. Do we have the Peachtree World News standing by to receive us? Yeah, we're up for it.

Great. Daniel, thank you so much. Gishi and Michael, thank you for an amazing class.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, it's wonderful to be able to talk at the end together. It's a wonderful addition. It seemed like we all desperately needed to do some processing after that class, and I'm glad that we got a little time to do it.

Utpala, thank you for your meticulous preparation in advance of that, not just translating, preparing your materials, but obviously thinking about it a lot in advance adds a lot to the quality of the discussion.

[Speaker 1]
Daniel, would you take over for us? Yay, that was awesome. Thank you very much.

Thanks, Ben. It's nice to see you and hear you leading sometimes. It's awesome.

So for today, we're starting out on a new segment. It's going to be a continuing segment during the Shenzhen Tower classes. We had a little segment on one of our previous shows, a couple of them, where we were getting to know more personally some of the organizers.

So we had Tim on and we had Rob. So now we're going to go one by one through all of the Mixed Nuts translators, and it's going to be our who's who of the Mixed Nuts translator segment. And for today, we have Sugeng.

Sugeng is going to be joining us. He's our first honorable guest, and we want to find out who is Sugeng. So we have a few questions for you, and we want all of the Mixed Nuts Shenzhen Tower audience to get to know you a little bit better so you're not just a handsome translator face.

We actually get to know. So I'd like to start off just by asking you a few questions, Sugeng. So where are you from?

And what's your original language? I was born in Indonesia, but my original language is Hokkien. Some people call it Taiwanese, Taiwan Mandarin.

Yeah. And then, yeah, so that is my origin, and that is my mother tongue. That's great.

And I hear you're actually quite the translator even before joining the Mixed Nuts. How many languages can you speak and translate into, Sugeng? Well, I speak, of course, Indonesian.

Yeah, Geshe-la helped me to count, and he counted six. Six languages. Yeah, Indonesian, Malay, Chinese, English, Japanese, and what is the other one?

Autonomics, yeah. Nice. Okay, awesome.

And so where are you living now these days? Are you traveling a lot? Where's your...

I hear you moved to the center of the universe recently. I am in the center of the universe now called Rimrock. That's awesome.

So you and your lovely wife, Shunchen, if you haven't met her yet, she's his better half, and she's amazing. And so you guys recently moved closer to be with Geshe-la, right? Definitely.

We want to become Rimrocker. That's right. You guys have your exclusive club now, the Rimrockers, right?

[Speaker 3]
Rimrocker club, yeah.

[Speaker 1]
That's awesome. So let me ask you a little bit about the translation work you've been doing. Which texts have you translated so far, and what texts are you working on now?

Okay, I am pretty honored to be given the involvement to do the book on the Wheel of Life. So we have completed the first one, which was written by Kedrop Tempah Dargih about 500 years ago, and that is completed. Now we are into the second one on the same topic, and this time round is by Master Vasubandhu.

And yeah, if you want to hear more, I would like to say that the master actually came out of the closet and he was like jumping around, challenging people's idea about the Wheel of Life itself. Awesome, excellent. So that's cool.

So which one of these texts have you found that you're more attracted to so far? Both are very attractive. So the first one is giving the foundation.

The second one is challenging you to use the foundation that you learned from the first one to go deeper and to understand much better what we have in the concepts that were introduced by this Wheel of Life. Nice. And so where were you, or do you remember what you were doing when you first realized that you wanted to be a translator of Tibetan?

When did that happen? How did that happen? I think when we started on the first link, and Geshe Michael was saying, it's not, it's not, I forgot the term.

It's not that term, but it is misunderstanding. What do we normally call? Ignorance.

Ignorance. I was so intrigued by that. Okay.

I have been hearing that it is ignorance, but now Geshe-la is saying it's not ignorance, but it's misunderstanding. So I was kind of intrigued and really wanted to know deeper why it's not ignorance. I thought ignorance is bad, but here I'm learning that misunderstanding is bad and not just a normal misunderstanding, but the misunderstanding of me and mine, which is specifically bad.

And there is a kind of misunderstanding, which is not the cause of the first link. So that was when I really got attracted into this topic and I really wanted to go deeper and really wanted to understand. And another thing that really caught my interest is that if you know about the history of how this world was drawn and those people who received this will and understand the meaning behind the will actually can get into the direct perception of emptiness.

I was kind of, okay, I have a chance. If I really pay attention seriously to the message, to the messages in the will, I have a chance to get into DPE very soon. And then the fact that we are sharing this out with the whole world, that means everybody who had a chance to read and understand this book will get into DPE together.

It seems like a shortcut, you know? That's my feeling. Wow, and then that was the text that was hand-selected for you.

How cool. Yeah, I'm very grateful forever and feel very honored to get you, Michael. That's pretty amazing.

So I have one more question. What is it that you're most proud of in your life? To be able to live in Rimrock.

I call myself a Rimrocker. I think I'm very proud of that, yeah. That's wonderful, awesome.

Well, it's really nice to get to know you personally. We're very blessed to have you as one of our translators and I'm really lucky to have you as a friend. So thank you for all your hard work.

We have you still on. Now we're switching gears. Okay, so we hear you have a project that you want to remind all of our viewers about coming up in Kyoto.

Yes, coming up in Kyoto in December is SCIM Alumni Association Reunion. We call it SCAA or we call it SCA, SCA Reunion. And this is due to space limitation.

Basically, we are full house, but we are opening up the waiting list now because we don't know last minute circumstances. Circumstances might change and people might not be able to go. So we hate, we don't want to waste those space.

So we have a waiting list. So if you have attended, if you have come to SCIM before, even for one term, you are considered alumnus. So please watch out for the...

Yeah, Juan helped me to put up this flyer. So we have a Telegram group. We have WeChat group.

Please scan and join us. And then we are constantly sending out information. So everyone, if you have been to SCIM, you are part of us, please come into the group.

And then this year we have limited space, but hopefully we have more budget next year. We can get a much bigger space and we can accommodate for everybody. Yes, that's awesome.

So as Sugeng said, even if you can't make it to this year's alumnus reunion, you should definitely get the QR code and sign up so that you can receive ongoing information. This will be an annual event. And then you can get more information on how to support the association through the years so that next year's event can be bigger.

And also as Geshe-la has said, that large universities like Princeton, they have groups like this that are designed to help keep the university strong, bring new ideas, help with funding, and get together to host other events. So, and this really is a historic mixing of minds that's been 10 years in the making. So it gives SCIM a sneak peek behind other events that are also going on simultaneously.

So we look forward to seeing you there. Sign up. Yeah, one more thing.

If you are coming to Kyoto, even if you don't have any space, even if you're on waiting list, please don't forget that we have another program going on from 5th, no, from 6th, no, from the 6th to 11th. Yeah, if you don't know what the program is, come and find me. I'll give you more information.

Okay, December 6th to 11th in Kyoto, Japan as well. So it's another program. Awesome.

All right, well, thank you, Mr. Six Languages. Sorry, 5th to 11th. The 5th through 11th in Kyoto, you get to meet Mr. Six Languages himself in person. So don't miss out. Thank you. So we're going to go right over to our next segment, which we have with Green Stretch Pin.

Are you guys waiting there? Somebody from Green Stretch Pin? Hello.

Hello. Oh, we have two somebodies. Yeah, look at that.

Anna, Tom, Aisha, three somebodies. Oh, I see a little Kiri. Yay.

Hey, guys, how are you? Great. Great to see you all.

Cool. Well, keep us up to speed. What's going on in the GSP world out there?

Oh, just that we have an ability to be online. We have a website that we finally are connecting with people. And so that's a big news for us.

It's like our idea of an online office, like a live office. And in a good office, you always can play music. So we got the ability, the permission, to share music on the website also.

[Speaker 2]
And then in that website, we'll be sharing ideas about GSP, what GSP is all about, and also news about what's going on all over with the project, especially in Mexico right now.

[Speaker 1]
All right, great. So I'm not sure if we have the info for the website yet. You guys, we can put the web address in the chat.

Tracy McKenzie is asking for it. She says she's so happy.

[Speaker 2]
Hasa's got it. But we also had a video to share the website, some examples of it.

[Speaker 1]
It's a live website. So when we go on the website, we're actually there. When you visit our website, you can see it.

You can meet us, talk to us. So we have a video about it. Hasa can't share it.

We have it ready to share also. Okay. Do you have that one?

Yes. Are you going to be sharing, Anatole, or you want me to share? I already uploaded it.

Either way. No, but the video. The video you can share, right?

Yeah, I can share it. Okay. The website is in the chat.

Thank you to Venerable Utpala. And here is the video. Thank you for joining us.

It's been a while since we've been back on this show. Facebook. But we're over on Mixcloud.

That's where you can hear this wonderful music. Okay, so we'll go ahead and start. And we're just having a little stretching break.

We'll be back. Take it to the mind of GSP. Anatole is an incredible yogi.

He's never done it before. He's a great yogi. He brings all of it.

[Speaker 3]
Everything he does. He's so good at it. He's so skilled.

Wow, he's so brave.

[Speaker 1]
He's such a good person. Those pictures. He's all over Mexico.

That's awesome. The photos from the last two days.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, we started in a new elementary school. And our teacher that is guiding the new schools around Tenosique and Tabasco, she is a great teacher. She started out with a new school with 400 kids.

And they were so excited. They were so happy. So we are very happy that we're expanding to more and more kids.

[Speaker 1]
We just picked up 11 new blenders to help new programs.

[Speaker 2]
And new schools.

[Speaker 1]
Hey, awesome. One school at a time. Look at that.

That's awesome. She's helping us to contact the director, the mom of Vitamix, the lady who owns Vitamix.

[Speaker 2]
So she's going to help us to reach more schools with more good blenders. To make more smoothies.

[Speaker 1]
That's awesome. Well, thank you guys for all your hard work. That's pretty cool.

I love the music project. Thanks for sharing. And if you don't have any other last words, then we'll actually send it over to Dr. Word for his Intro to Tibetan class. Oh, sorry. There's a link. Yeah, there is.

Perfect. Check it out. Here's a QR code so that you can take a stretch break when you're feeling too busy.

Monday through Fridays in November. You're going to be broadcasting to different cities all over the world. So here's the QR code.

If you guys like some of that music you were listening to, you can get some incredible playlists from Anatole's wide variety of music that he likes to play. So thanks a lot, guys. We're really excited to have you guys on as usual.

And we can't wait to hear about the next 10 schools you guys get into. So thanks a lot, guys. Hey, thanks so much.

Thanks to everyone who's helping and sponsoring. Yeah, thank you for all the sponsors. Have a great class with Word.

Yay, Dr. Wordsmith. Are you ready for action? I am, sir.

Thank you so much, Daniel. Excellent. You take it away.

Thank you for teaching. All right. Have a great day.

We'll see you guys next class. Bye.