Бен Крамер — Книга 2: Драгоценность истинной мысли (Геше Йеше Вангчук о Дхармакирти), занятие 19

[Speaker 2]
I wasn't expecting that one.

[Speaker 1]
Amazing.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
Thank you. Hey boss. Hey, Nick.

I think maybe he went to get Ezra to help with the class. I think he's probably sending Ezra off to school. It's that time.

If it was me, it's because I'd be meditating. He just performed for us, Geshe-la. Who did?

Ezra. Oh, I didn't hear it. Yeah.

I missed that too. Did you get him off to school? Hey, we need the sound, Ben.

[Speaker 2]
All right, one more song. Good, yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Speaker 1]
His first three chords were like a Radiohead song.

[Speaker 2]
Don't forget your wah-wah pedal. Yeah. Bye, Ezra.

Have a beautiful day. Give me a kiss. Go, go.

[Speaker 1]
Okay, have a good day at school. Glad I'm not the bus driver.

[Speaker 3]
Okay, bye.

[Speaker 1]
Dr. Homer, you were going through the 12 weird activities of a real monk or nun. Yes.

[Speaker 2]
However, you wanted to have Nick and I talk for a moment about the Tohoku Project.

[Speaker 1]
That'd be really cool if you guys have, you have it ready? Yeah, I can share my screen.

[Speaker 2]
It's slightly from the cuff, but sure.

[Speaker 1]
Okay, so please let us know what you're talking about.

[Speaker 2]
So the living room, oh, there we go.

[Speaker 1]
Where'd it go?

[Speaker 2]
We envision the project like the inside of a house.

[Speaker 1]
The square footage, while modest. Here's the input of a catalog. This is the Tibetan collection.

This is called the Tohoku Catalog of Tibetan Literature. And this is the input of one part of the Tohoku Catalog, which is the Tibetan collection. So let me just back up for a second.

And just for those of you who don't know, there's one very famous, there are several catalogs of Tibetan literature, which is what we Mixed Nuts are working on translating. Classically, there's three great collections, which are written in that language. The Kangir, the Tengir, and what we call the Sungbom, which is the collection of works written by Tibetan authors.

And ALL, which was formerly ACIP, has achieved something incredible already over the 30 years of their existence, which is to have input the entirety of the Kangir, which is the word of the Buddha, and the Tengir, which is the commentaries written by great Indian commentators, like Chandrakirti and Dharmakirti, and all these other heavyweights who we've been talking about a lot in the Mixed Nuts. And so in our database, what's now the ALL database, we have also had the fortune to input a massive amount of works written by authors from Tibet. And it's a little bit less, it's not quite as perfectly organized as the Kangir and the Tengir, which is kind of a fixed set of books.

With this, there's a lot of work out there by a lot of different authors. I think it was today Geshe Michael mentioned that it's actually the largest body of spiritual literature in the world, which I had never thought about before. But when you said it, I was like, oh my God, it has to be, and it's probably by far.

And that's amazing. Anyway, we had to choose something, a way of structuring what we're doing. And this book, this catalog here is a record of, so, okay, this is an amazing story.

There was a monk.

[Speaker 2]
Nick, do you have the PDF also?

[Speaker 1]
Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
It's so pretty with all the Japanese on it.

[Speaker 1]
It does. Where it went on my computer is the mystery. Here we go.

Can you see that?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Okay. This is the, there's some, probably Japanese. Yep, Japanese.

This is the actual catalog. This is what it looks like in there. This is the Kangir books, I believe.

A method of preventing smallpox.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, good.

[Speaker 1]
We should get that. Yeah. This is Bhutan.

Look at the top. Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Okay. So this is the Tibetan one. I opened the right one.

Oh, maybe we should see if there's one for COVID. So this is what the catalog looks like. And the way they got it, it's amazing.

A Japanese person went to Tibet. I understand that he, so a lot of people think that Geshe Michael is the first Western Geshe, but I think that this Japanese, he's the first American.

[Speaker 2]
Right.

[Speaker 1]
But there was a. Eastern Geshe. Oh, yeah.

And he's not Western. He's foreign. He was the first foreign Geshe.

A Japanese monk went and I guess pretended to be Tibetan. And that's a bit. Pretended to be Chinese because Chinese were allowed in the.

That makes more sense. I would have thought they would have been able to guess by his accent. Although I have to say, I would never guess that Seiji is not American.

He's perfected his accent so well. Anyway.

[Speaker 2]
So he snuck out with a lot of books. A lot, a lot of books. And, and those all made it to a library in Japan, where they probably may well be and have been.

And Geshe-la, you saw the library, right? Each book had its own little locked drawer where it's been locked since 1902, for all we know.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. It's a total of about, they have 5,000 catalog numbers, as you can see here. So it's a total, it's thousands of locked drawers.

Yeah. So, so this cat, they made a catalog of the books that he brought back. And it looks like there's like, I don't know, 7,000, 8,000 numbers.

And we use their, their catalog numbers as our catalog numbers, where they exist. So if there is a Tohoku number for a book, we use that as our ACIP or ALL catalog number. So, you know, we've been for a long time trying to complete the cataloging of the database that we've collected over the years.

And one thing that Geshe-la Michael mentioned to Adam and me and Ben several times is, you know, we've got to finish the Tohoku. So Adam went and wrote a program and, and compared the texts in this catalog to what we already have in our database and found, generated a list of, I don't know, hundreds, several hundred catalog numbers of works that, that are in this catalog that are not yet represented in our database. So I think most of you know, but just real quick, when you see us in class, like come across an idea that we're not sure about, and then you see Geshe-la Michael do a search, he's searching the database of literature that we have collected.

And every time you see black bold text in the book, that's what, that's the notes that he found from another, you know, text in our database and, and searched it immediately using the Gopher program and found immediately like the concept that he was looking for and just pastes it right in. And then he has a catalog record pastes in automatically also, so we can easily make the bibliography. Anyway.

[Speaker 2]
I just like, I can, Nick, I just like, I, you, you, I think you can't stress enough that on top of having a very smart Geshe nearby, this is something, this is one of the main things that makes our translations of a higher caliber than anything anyone else could possibly provide is that we have this unbelievable database that has never existed in history. The technology there's never been a technology like this in history. It used to be that if you wanted to research a book, you had to find it on the shelf.

In the case of Tehoku, you would have to find the lock drawer, find the guy with the key, open it up and start lift page through page at a time. And, and now for the first time ever, this largest spiritual body of literature is searchable. And there are, you could, you could talk in terms of three great achievements in the history of ALL.

Okay. And two of them are done. Okay.

Number one is the complete collection of the direct word of the Buddha done. Anything we want to know anything he said it's, it's there. It's there in the database comes up virtually instantly.

Okay. We did it. ALL did it.

Okay. It's all collected. Number two.

Okay. The complete collection of the Sanskrit masters commenting on the direct word of the Buddha. Okay.

Done completed. Okay. There is another great collection and it's much larger.

This Japanese master, right? Described as a Chinese person sneaking into the Tibetan monastery grabbed the very best books, the creme de la creme, as it were of the, the cream scraped from the cream of the finest works of Tibetan masters writing in common. And it's, these books are miraculous.

And because this language was tucked away at top an isolated mountain kingdom that nobody knew about for a long time, the world doesn't know that these extraordinary masters were writing philosophical works on the level that no one has ever seen in this world. And, and in many cases still has not seen in this world. And of course the work of the mixed nuts is to reveal that, that work to the world.

And and these books added to the database the creme de la creme that got brought to Tohoku university in Japan. And they built this catalog around. We are now circling towards the final stages, maybe in a year or so of completing this third grade achievement in the history of LL ALL of having available to us.

Every time we have a philosophical question, all of these masters will be sitting on our laptops, sitting on our doorstep, waiting to answer questions for us.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. And so we found when we ran a comparison to see what we've got, we found that a good what's not represented in our existing database. We already have at least half of that stuff already input, just sitting in our own catalog data, waiting to get put into the database.

So what one of the things that that Ben and I and Adam have been doing is plugging away, you know, text by text catalog, Tohoku catalog number by catalog number, you know, finding it, splitting it out, you know, giving it an English title. If it's you know, if it needs one, giving it a catalog, you know, giving it all the appropriate information and then finding where we're going to put it in the database. Like if it's a text on valid perception, if it's a text on middle way philosophy.

So we're one by one expanding the database. And our plan is that by the end of the year, we will have included every book that's in this great Tibetan catalog.

[Speaker 2]
We have another extraordinary advantage, which is Adam Andrade, who we lean on heavily for this task, who spit out a list of everything that we were missing so far, who is combing through all of the data that we have input. We were really good at doing input. And we struggled to have a large enough team, a sophisticated enough team.

I think Geshe-la had to educate us for a while before any of us would have sophistication to be able to comb through books and see exactly what we have and where it fits in the database. And finally, I do believe the bottleneck is broken. And Adam, just over the past, what do you think?

How many in the past handful of weeks or handful of months, how many texts do you think you moved into the spreadsheet for us to prepare for the catalog?

[Speaker 3]
So this morning, I just finished up Bhutan Rinpoche, which is like 206 new books. That's since, I think, April, the last week of April. Amazing.

[Speaker 1]
Wow, finishing Bhutan, that's a huge deal.

[Speaker 2]
Who was the guy who compiled the commentaries on the Buddha. And we finished the first Big Lama. Almost finished with the second.

Almost finished with the second. We finished Gelsubje, who was not completed in the database. We had a lot of works by Gelsubje, but we didn't have all of his advice in translating our work.

So we're suddenly moving at a steady clip and hope to be finishing this project soon.

[Speaker 1]
So Ben, can I ask you a question?

[Speaker 2]
It's an easy one.

[Speaker 1]
When you say, okay, yay, we've got this text, we found it, and now we put it in the database, does that mean the world has access to it at that moment, or what is the process between adding it?

[Speaker 2]
Well, thank you for asking. It does. It means precisely that.

It is available to art. The fantasy is that, I mean, you know, I'll say frankly, I love my teacher. I love my teacher.

I'm very grateful for my teacher. And I can't even begin to explain to you all the ways that my teacher has cared for me. And so my teacher is special to me.

It's not just all the things that my teacher has taught me, but my teacher, okay, personally, my teacher has cared for me personally, spiritually, linguistically, philosophically, and in worldly ways for so much of my life you can't believe. But also my teacher is special. I don't think that just in a way that anyone could understand, the only person in the history of the world, period, who has had the capacity to spend all day every day surfing through the waves of this vast canon.

No one has ever done it. No one has ever. It's just a fact.

It's just a fact. You know, it's his good fortune. It's our good fortune.

Hopefully he's not the last to do so. Yes, Utpala, this database is available to the world. Let him be the first and not the last.

Let him be the first and not the only one in history. Let him be the first one to master the act of surfing through this vast catalog. So far, I think he's still the only one.

But we're trying to prepare a future in which this is. And it is now. As we make it available, it's available immediately.

We are making all of that material available to the world immediately. And now we just need more translators and more smart people to learn the skill of riding these waves. Geshe-la, would you add anything at all that you see fit in the context of this discussion?

Or it doesn't have to be.

[Speaker 1]
Two ideas come to mind. One is that the gold clubs around the world, and we have some of those guys are here today, around the world, there are people raising money for this project. This project so far took about $7 million, $10 million.

That money came from all of us. We were just raising the money. We went to work.

We raised it at the diamond business. It's all for free. All of the material is online for free.

I'd like to thank everyone on this call and all the gold club members, especially places like Russia, Ukraine. They've been working very hard for many years, Peter and Maria Myrtle, to raise the money to give away these books. Those guys are amazing.

The Tohoku catalog is... By the way, don't be... The numbers are misleading because they skipped some numbers.

I think 4,600 to 5,000 something. That's just the beginning. When Ben and Nick say they're going to finish the Tohoku catalog, I hope, within the next year, that's like the first few thousand books.

Then we have 290,000. After that, we have to find them and we have to input them. We're going to need help from all over the world.

Without the fundraising that you guys do, the gold club, we can't run this project. DCI, SCIM, they have given big donations. This last week to the ALL project.

They help keep it going. Everyone who's involved with DCI, if you're involved with SCIM, you're involved with YSI, you're involved with the gold clubs. Everybody's helping.

I'd like to thank them all. Also, big help from China Soft Power Project. They're also helping big, big time.

Thank you for that. Thank you. I think we should probably get to Ben's class.

His text is going to take another 51 years. Thank you for that presentation. It was very sweet.

Thank you for starting the schedule. Maybe next time you can show us how you catalog, how you work with that spreadsheet.

[Speaker 2]
Quick homework. What do the three forms of the practice of eating in a single sitting have in common and what is different between them? And then what's the Tibetan name for the practice?

There is a practice in the 12 practices. It's called eating in a single sitting. Your light just went green.

You're going to be the one.

[Speaker 1]
With regard to the seat, to water, and to food. They are equivalent that they're related to not more than eating, not more than once in a 24 hour period.

[Speaker 2]
Right. Yeah. Right.

They're all the same in that way. What is it in relation to sitting and water and food?

[Speaker 1]
Oh, that you make a determination. This is it.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, this is it. I'm done. Okay.

So in all cases, you eat once a day and you think, you think that's it. Okay. Done eating.

You may do it at one of three different times, either.

[Speaker 1]
Before you get up. Or as you get up.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, that's it. Okay. Or.

[Speaker 1]
Your mouth with water.

[Speaker 2]
Done. Or.

[Speaker 1]
And as you swallow your last bite, although you probably want to wait till. After you swallow.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. Well, you just have to think it.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Done. Yeah. Great.

Sure. Cool. I like it.

What's the name of the practice in Tibetan? Cool. Of course.

Great. Cool. What sorts of food may be appropriate to eat in the latter part of the day, or even more than once.

Within a 24 hour period. And what is the term used in this context for 24 hour period.

[Speaker 1]
Pizza. Just told us a little while ago, we could have chocolate chip cookies later in the day.

[Speaker 2]
For example, I think. That is a specific example here, but give the general concept. That allows us to eat.

Exclusively chocolate chip cookies all day.

[Speaker 1]
As Anna says in the chat. For medical uses.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. Right. Yeah.

Basically. I mean, really. Anything that is appropriate to your personal.

I mean, medicine was the specific example, but I guess really any other food or sustenance, which would be important for your personal health. Can and probably should be eaten anytime. And as often as is appropriate to your personal needs.

What's the Tibetan term used in this context for a 24 hour period. Shock cheek. Yeah.

Whoa. Right. Cool.

Great. Which is like means like a day and a night. Essentially.

So we're calling it 24 hour period because we're translators. Here we go. Soft pitch.

Easy, smoothie. What sort of material should monastic robes be made from. Tibetan and English, please.

True. Law is. Yeah.

Cool. Yeah, great. Yeah.

Right. Great. Chief tool.

Sorry. There we go. In Tibetan, just kidding.

Someone who didn't didn't see it someone who doesn't know answer. Quick.

[Speaker 1]
Cool. Okay, great.

[Speaker 2]
Cool. Let's. Surf over here and pick up where we left off.

Did we do this one already. We talked about dumpster diving already. Okay, so now we're on to Dumba.

Here you go boss. Staying in a cloister.

[Speaker 1]
Make a request that when we do our homework like this that we still read the Tibetan, and then read the English so that way the people who are participating can understand what's going on, it's more difficult to follow. When we just jump right into your translation. Just a suggestion.

[Speaker 2]
Sure. Yeah. Okay.

You check me. Don't. Don't.

Don't. Don't. Don't.

Don't. Don't. And I'm not going to read the English because it may well be wrong, but guess I'll piece it together for us.

Boss I think you're muted. Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. Hang on, let me, let me read it. Nice.

And yeah, good. The only suggestion I have is the word cha which is not familiar to me I had to study it a little bit. It means to set up a residence, or to set up a place.

[Speaker 2]
Cool.

[Speaker 1]
And I just want to brag about when we built Diamond Mountain, when we bought the land, we purposely made it far away from the nearest city. In fact, you have to drive, what, 45 minutes to find a grocery store. So, and Gyangdrag Chik is 500 dom, 500 arm spans.

Yeah, so it's probably about a mile. And the idea is that you shouldn't have, you know, yogis and yoginis of this kind, shouldn't be close to a city, shouldn't be close to a town. And it was very hard to find a place like that.

And, and we did and Diamond Mountain, I know it's a hard place to stay sometimes but there's a reason for that. We wanted to find a place that was far away from cell phone towers and, and, and cities. Yeah, I like the translation it's perfect.

Okay. Yep.

[Speaker 2]
I guess we've covered it before and I apologize for being a space brain, but I saw it, but of course it's not a mile like I'm looking at now I said a mile and now I'm second guessing should say like a mile or so.

[Speaker 1]
That's fine. You could say, I think a mile is fine. Okay, it's very similar it's 5200 feet or something so.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
Six times 500 is 3000, that's about the okay. Okay. Probably there'll be some big Vinaya fight about it later.

[Speaker 2]
These, I recommend reading together because if you read the first one without reading the second one then you're in for a surprise when you get to the second one. I think.

[Speaker 1]
Okay, so please read the Tibetan and I think Venerable Upala can check you.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, good. Very good. I think the translations are perfect.

Let me see it is sleeping in the tree. This means dancing could replace a tree. And nowhere else.

Yeah, it's beautiful. It's kind of cool right. Yeah.

If you think about it. I, when I read this 12. I feel like that's what a monk was really supposed to be or a nun was really supposed to be.

And Lhaggap, the only tricky thing in the second one is the ma after deng. And you have to phrase it properly. You have to say deng ma yok.

Because deng ma does mean a covering. So if you phrased it deng ma yok pe, it's translated. So you translated it correctly.

But if you, you know, the normal cadence would be deng ma yok pe, which would mean you have to set up a cover over again. Or you can't build a lean-to. You can't build a hut.

You're supposed to sleep out in the open air. I guess you have to see the stars or something. And that's, it's difficult.

It's a very difficult practice. Yeah. Okay.

Which word is this means? Oh, ni. Ni is this.

The ni, that's a good question. The ni is this means. Okay, good.

All right. I like it. Keep going.

It's a good translation so far. So far.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, well, we'll see. Yeah, there are problems. That's okay.

We'll get to them, I promise. Upala still, if that's okay?

[Speaker 3]
At your service.

[Speaker 2]
Thank you. Okay. Okay.

Okay, thank you. Gong ne. Totally.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, good. Sokpo, the only place you see it is in the chicken posture for taking vows. But I would read it here to sit without extending your legs.

Okay, I think I would read it that way. It means across your legs in some way. Okay, I would read it that way.

I don't think you're supposed to squat. I don't think that's what it's supposed to say. Yeah, so greater misimmersion, mispractice.

So I would say sokpo means to sit with your legs crossed in some way.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
In the greater practice, yeah, you never lie down, right? Yeah, all day and night. Good.

Yeah, good. Yeah, good. GZIGS PA LA MI BSTAN PA SOGS PAR DUG PA DANG GNYIS PA NI GZIGS PA SOGS PAR DUG PA DANG With your back, but never to the right, to the left.

Forward. GNYIS PA NI GZIGS PA SOGS PAR DUG PA DANG GNYIS PA NI GZIGS PA SOGS PAR DUG PA DANG But you never... Okay.

GNYIS PA NI I think gong ne is a cushion, and specifically a pillow. So this spelling, SANG SNGAGS TU SNGAGS SANGS NGES, means a pillow. And normally, SGO NGES means a pillow that you lay your head down on when you sleep.

But I would read it here as a cushion. So you sit with your legs crossed. I believe it would be, you don't use a fancy cushion.

And you try to be a tough guy, okay?

[Speaker 2]
Okay. But that, it does, you know, I just, I thought go because it, you know, it can mean head and then it just doesn't that seem to, I'm confused because that, the pattern of the three seems like. Yeah.

Left, right, front, back. Why suddenly a cushion? Then what the heck?

But the last one doesn't mean don't lean. You can lean against any of those, but not forward.

[Speaker 1]
Or you could phrase it differently and say, but you cannot put your head on any kind of pillow. Okay. You could phrase it that way.

SGO NGES LA MI SBYOR Okay. You know, so I guess, could you rest your forehead on something and take a snooze? And there are yogis in Tibet who try to keep this practice.

They sleep in a box and they try to not to lean their head on something.

[Speaker 2]
So it could. I'm so sorry. Could NGES or pillow in this case be like the equivalent of a den just only applied to the head?

Like, could it be a general word for any den for the head?

[Speaker 1]
I think you could say that, but in that case, he would have said den, I think. I think he specifically wants to mention a pillow. Okay.

I don't know if it... It probably means you don't rest your head on anything and that would cover the front waist.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. Okay.

[Speaker 1]
I would read it that way. That's cool.

[Speaker 2]
Cool, because who the heck leans forward anyway? It'd be sort of strange.

[Speaker 1]
Maybe if you wanted to sleep and you were in a box or something like that. But the point is you don't lie down and stretch your feet out, which is... I think it's successive and I think you wouldn't practice well.

I think you would hurt yourself. So you have to be careful with that. You'd hurt yourself if you go sleep out in the open also.

So I think you have to be wise. I've met Westerners who read these and then they tried to do them and they just wasted a few years.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
Comfortable modest house.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. I'm going to move this to make it easier.

[Speaker 1]
Albuquerque.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. Oh, okay. Well, we'll see.

[Speaker 1]
Choose somebody to check you.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. Gyelse?

[Speaker 1]
Yay. Okay. Thank you.

[Speaker 2]
Thank you. Okay.

[Speaker 1]
It's perfect. I love it. It's perfect.

I don't see any problems with it yet.

[Speaker 3]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, and just to say that in the old days in a graveyard they didn't... You might want to call it burial... carnal, charnel ground?

Anyway, in the old days in India they just threw your body out on the top of the ground. So it would kind of mean that you're kind of taking clothes off a dead body.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Which is kind of stinky.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, right. Burial grounds isn't really much better because it still implies that they're... but it's a little bit more...

at least... but charnel ground is a pretty weird term in English.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, it's supposed to be having burned already or something, but...

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, right.

[Speaker 1]
You could just make a footnote maybe. But yeah, it's not that you dig up a coffin or something like that.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, uh-huh. It's a little less ghoulish. A little.

[Speaker 1]
The family would get upset with you.

[Speaker 2]
Yes. Yeah. That does sound upsetting.

[Speaker 1]
But it's a good translation. It's a good translation.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. Kelsey, would you keep on me?

[Speaker 1]
Yes.

[Speaker 2]
Thank you. Cool.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, I like it. It's good. Okay.

It's great. I just draw your attention to DING. DING.

Which is a verb that means to take grass or leaves and... How do you call that? Lay them out on the floor.

Something like that. DING means... DING is also used for flagstones.

When you ding flagstones down on the ground. So anything that you lay down and spread out on the ground, that's called a DING. Okay, cool.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
No, no, no, no, no.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. I have run my term gauntlet and now I get to hand it over to you, boss.

[Speaker 1]
Hey, good job though. That was a good job. And that was a tough assignment.

[Speaker 2]
Thank you. Thanks for your help again, Nick.

[Speaker 1]
Thanks for all the kind words you did. Okay, here we go, Yeshe Wangchuk. All right, now we're on to this one.

I think we're still in the biography of...

[Speaker 2]
Oh, Dignaga? Well, that's an interesting question. That's up to you.

We're in both. We're in a biography of Dharmakirti and we're in a biography of Dignaga, whether we're in Bhutan or Geshe Yeshe Wangchuk.

[Speaker 1]
You want to go to the text? I don't... Oh, we are in the text, right?

[Speaker 2]
I don't know. Yes. Yes, we are.

Okay, that's true.

[Speaker 1]
Let's go to the text. Let's get on the text because we got to do some text.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
So, please read. And... Haso.

You get the haso.

[Speaker 2]
Hello, everyone. My name is Tse-Ma. Hello.

Hello, everybody.

[Speaker 1]
Thank you. All right. What's a sumpo?

[Speaker 2]
What is a sum-tsom?

[Speaker 1]
It means the books he wrote.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. Oh, good.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. mum-bo.

[Speaker 2]
Boy, did he write a lot.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, but to just list the major ones, or to list the ones that are DRAWA with SEMMA.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, yeah, that relate to the study of accurate perception.

[Speaker 1]
Good, yeah. We got MIG PA LTAG PA.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, an analysis of objects of perception.

[Speaker 1]
Nice. And also the RANG DRAW.

[Speaker 2]
The auto-commentary to that work.

[Speaker 1]
Yay. Then we got SEMMA DRAWA.

[Speaker 2]
The Sutra on Accurate Perception, which is not a sutra, but is another name for the compendium of accurate perception.

[Speaker 1]
Which is the one he started...

[Speaker 2]
On the cave with the jock.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, that's the book he started on the cave. RIGS PA'I DGOS.

[Speaker 2]
Is it through the door of logic, or the door of reasoning?

[Speaker 1]
The door of reasoning, exactly. Then he wrote a RANG DRAW to that door.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. Oh, okay, he wrote an auto-commentary to the compendium.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, good. Then he did a very interesting DUS SUM THAG PA.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, an analysis of the three times, an analysis of the past, present and future.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, that's a sexy book. I mean, that's an interesting one. Then he wrote CHOG CHUG KHOR LO.

This is kind of... It's actually a chart of... So KHOR LO here kind of means a chart in which he analyzes the different kinds of CHOG CHUGS.

Relationship between one and three, right? In a logical statement.

[Speaker 2]
KHOR LO, is he calling the wheel of that, or just like we're in the sphere of discussing the...

[Speaker 1]
You can translate it as the wheel of the relationship between the reason and the subject under consideration. But it's actually kind of a... It looks like an astrological chart or something, okay?

Mind map of reasoning. Yeah, it's a mind map. That's a good translation.

Okay, keep going, handsome. And who's checking you? I forgot.

Okay, handsome, let's go. You can translate this.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, this master was his... This master's master was... NGYI GYEN, Master Vasubandhu.

[Speaker 1]
And of all the lobas of NGYI GYEN...

[Speaker 2]
Of all his students, Master Thich Nhat Hanh was... His special... He had a special mastery around accurate perception?

[Speaker 1]
YAL TZU DRAG means that he gained a reputation. Everybody considered that he was KEPA LA'I YIG NYIN AN TSE MO.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, greater than... Yeah, smarter than even Vasubandhu on the topic of accurate perception.

[Speaker 1]
Good. About logic, they say he became a greater master than his teacher, which is a very rare thing to say in the scriptures. Okay, good.

Okay, keep going. And choose somebody to torture you.

[Speaker 2]
Let's see. Rob Haggerty.

[Speaker 1]
Yay!

[Speaker 2]
Let's do it. Cool.

[Speaker 1]
It's good to see you, Haggerty, by the way.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Thank you.

[Speaker 2]
Good to see everybody, too.

[Speaker 1]
Excited for sore eyes.

[Speaker 2]
Indeed. Thank you so much for watching. I hope you enjoyed it.

Thank you so much for watching, and if you have any questions, feel free to ask them in the comments below.

[Speaker 1]
Okay, good. Who was the lob med soul of Chokla?

[Speaker 2]
The root student, the main student of Master Dignaga was Lopam Wangchukde, as far as I know. Ishvara Sena.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, Ishvara Sena. And he sent Sema Kundu from Chokla.

[Speaker 2]
Sena, I'm just guessing to mean learn, receive.

[Speaker 1]
Honorific of Thupa. Honorific of Thupa.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, yeah, I heard. Great.

[Speaker 1]
He listened to...

[Speaker 2]
the teachings, the compendium of accurate perception directly from Master Dignaga, who was its author.

[Speaker 1]
Now, here's an idiom. SKYE LEN DZIN TZAM SKYE LEN DZIN TZAM DZIN TZAM means the finities of your position that you take. The line of your position.

And his SKYE LEN DZIN TZAM means the point where he took his position was perfect. His SKYE LEN DZIN TZAM, his take on the scriptures and his beliefs about how to interpret them was tumble with Chokla.

[Speaker 2]
Even Stephen was as good as...

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, he was on the same page as far as what he accepted, what he didn't accept. He was right on the same page as his teacher Dignaga. KYANG But one day he was sipping with some muddhiks.

[Speaker 2]
He was arguing with some non-Buddhists or debating them.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, and he shore his SKYE LEN.

[Speaker 2]
I don't know, what did he do with his... What's shore?

[Speaker 1]
Lost it? Yeah, this is an idiom in a debate. SKYE LEN SHORE means he lost his original position.

[Speaker 2]
Uh-oh.

[Speaker 1]
His original position cracked. That's called... SHORE means to slip on the ice or lose a baseball game.

[Speaker 2]
Sawidamcha.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, and his Sawidamcha slipped.

[Speaker 2]
Uh-huh.

[Speaker 1]
And then he was forced into a position of saying that the Dakyan Dakitseni was not Tsul Tsul.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, but six, that they're...

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Speaker 2]
To a correct reason.

[Speaker 1]
He was forced into a position where he didn't say the definition of a good reason is the three relationships that we talked about last night, but rather he was forced into a position of saying there were six relationships that had to hold, okay? Quite charming, yeah. This little note in the middle is...

[Speaker 3]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
There's an irritating thing that... I don't know how long it's been going on, but many of the texts that we use, somebody has been putting zeros in front of numbers, like zero, one, three, zero. And you could write a little routine.

Adam could probably do it where zero followed by any one of the nine digits should be ignored, should be erased. So I'm afraid to write that macro. I just go through and take the zeros out manually, but it's a lot of work.

Sometimes they have 200 of them. Okay. Maybe you guys could write a macro and make sure it doesn't screw up anything else.

We're out of time. All right, good. That's a good place to stop.

They're going to talk about the three extra relationships that Ishvara Sena was forced into positing because of his debate with the non-Buddhists. And then they're going to talk about why it's wrong. And I never got it straight.

And if you want to take a shot at it, Ben, it's in the next paragraph, and it's very interesting.

[Speaker 2]
Okay?

[Speaker 1]
When you perceive the juk je che, do you have to see that it's part of the tun chok and mi tun chok? It's the field of similar cases and the field of dissimilar cases. And it's a very interesting argument.

Okay?

[Speaker 2]
Just say that again. Would you just say... Yeah, yeah.

[Speaker 1]
It has to do with tun chok and mi tun chok.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
So when you, for example, when you're analyzing whether sound is changing or not, in your mind, how many other examples do you have to think about before you can see the truth of something? Before you can draw a generalization, how many specific cases do you have to think about to check the generalization? If you say all functioning things are changing, is it the case that you actually go through a bunch of functioning things in your mind until you...

You know you go through three or four, five in your mind, and then you say, oh, that's probably true. It fits three or four cases I can think of. That's called tun chok.

That's called the group of similar cases. So what's the status ontologically of the group of similar cases? How many similar cases do you have to think about to draw a principle?

And that isn't that fraught with danger that you might make a mistake because there could be cases that you didn't think about. So how is it that the human mind draws conclusions by subconsciously checking similar cases? And that's called tun chok.

Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
It's a very interesting question in logic. Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, cool. Thank you, boss. Sashi.

[Speaker 1]
Sashi, to you. I'll see you guys. I am doing my yoga.

I'm just doing it in the evening and sometimes I go to the gym instead because grandpa needs to do that. Okay, so. I am doing some kind of yoga.

I had a nice class with Anatole. Thank you for teaching. Okay.

See you guys.

[Speaker 3]
Thank you, Yeshua.

[Speaker 1]
Thank you, everybody. Stay here for class with Juan if you want to do yoga now. He'll teach a really fun class.

And I just want to say these have been fast and hard classes so far. Thank you to the translators. You guys interpreting into foreign languages.

You guys are amazing. They're real heroes here. And to the tech crew, thank you so much for all that you guys are doing to get the videos up for us right away and just doing such a clean and beautiful job.

Thank you. Thank you. Okay.

See you guys.