Классика Алмазного огранщика: Верхний Срединный путь — Великие книги мудрости, занятие 43

[Speaker 1]
Asinna supassion. Inam guna radhamandala gamne nami. Chodan sakhi chanam na.

Chanchu padu dadhmi gyab su je. LHA GYI CHEN YIN GYI PAS SUN NAM GYI LO LA PHEN CHE SANG GYI DRUG PA SHOK CHOD DANG SOG GI CHOK NAM LA CHEN CHUG PA DU DRAG NI GYAP SU CHI LHA GYI CHEN YIN GYI PAS SUN NAM GYI LO LA PHEN CHE SANG GYI DRUG PA SHOK CHOD DANG SOG GI CHOK NAM LA CHEN CHUG PA DU DRAG NI GYAP SU CHI LHA GYI CHEN YIN GYI PAS SUN NAM GYI LO LA PHEN CHE SANG GYI DRUG PA SHOK SHMOGADY GOGADY Homework time. If Ben's holding his head in his hand like that, I don't think anybody's going to get it.

That's really kind of like pretty easy. I mean, we didn't cover that much. We took a big chunk of what we covered last time.

A major idea of what we covered. Tim always gets my questions. Well, there was only one point in the text where he said it's not real.

It's not definitive. At one point in the text he said, nirvana with something left over is not definitive nirvana. He said, if you think that nirvana with something left over is not definitive nirvana, then what did you say, Ben?

Did he bring up Shariputra? Yeah, he brought up Shariputra. The sutra where I already did nirvana and then I told you about it?

Yeah, he brings up the what he said afterwards sutra, where Shariputra claims that he's achieved nirvana. Thank you. Very good.

And the name of that sutra in Tibetan? I thought the word would be here. Pakpa.

Yes, it's Pakpa. That's the name of the sutra. No, I'm just kidding.

No, it's a good guess because they often start with that. But this one doesn't. At least, yeah, as far as the name that they gave here, it doesn't start with that.

Any other records? I'll give you a hint. Job Jay or Jay.

Got a word, Jay. All right. Did you get it before I put it up there?

You get 100 points. I'm still cheating. Oh.

J-J-J-J-Dol. Points? I thought it was dollars.

Oh, no. I don't have those kinds of things. I got a kid on the way in the other studio.

Which is more expensive? I don't know.

[Speaker 2]
The other studio.

[Speaker 1]
From personal experience, we have our answer. Are those airline points? Airplane.

Airplane. Okay. What does Gautamji say is the problem with the solar school's claim that when Shariputra said he stopped his suffering, that he only stopped his afflictions?

[Speaker 2]
He was talking about... In the sutra, there is a specific word that exactly talks about total, complete, and unfinished suffering.

[Speaker 1]
Uh-huh. You're totally on the right track, but just finish your thoughts.

[Speaker 2]
There's a distinction between the two.

[Speaker 1]
Well, there's that, but that's not what Gautamji says is the problem here. I mean, it kind of relates. It goes into that.

Because we only covered a couple of paragraphs. So it's all bundled together. But he said...

Do you remember this part? Basically, what was he saying? He stopped his suffering.

He only stopped his afflictions. The implication is that... He can't apply the general name suffering to just a piece of them suffering.

[Speaker 2]
That was their nirvana.

[Speaker 1]
I would not have remembered either. Okay, next one. This whole section is explaining how nirvana, according to the lower schools, cannot be attained.

Gautamji makes an argument that even if the body and mind did stop, their nirvana is still attainable. Explain. Oh, sorry, yes.

Their nirvana is still attainable. What?

[Speaker 2]
Are we changing or something?

[Speaker 1]
How do I track if things can't change? Think further along the six flavors. Tantra.

[Speaker 2]
As long as you still hold body and mind, and then you still hold on to me. As long as you hold on to me, then you create karma. And then karma, you cannot stop.

You cannot achieve nirvana.

[Speaker 1]
I'm going to give this girl a piece of cake. She said she'd rather have a hundred dollars. Wow, I already knew she knew it.

That's great. Because you believe that the existence of themselves is going to make you karma. So we'll project the future life.

Cool? Got it. Okay.

Okay. How do you have time to do that? Long nails.

Where's the long nails in there? Long fingernails. So I put your name when you were still alive.

Are you going to be Sanskrit? I don't think we mentioned it. We did.

Real quick. Nice. Dhirganaka.

What's this one? That's not cute. I can just see churu on the end of it.

Yeah, I'd say churu would mess it all up. Anyone? Maybe Jay.

It's not tricky. It's just that there weren't a lot of words that you guys haven't seen before many times. So it's...

How do you achieve it? This means made it happen. Yeah.

Made it happen. No. Not that dry.

It's a name you affixed to something. Yeah, but that's not what it means. That's right.

Hey, I'm just...

[Speaker 2]
Don't ask me unless you're offering money.

[Speaker 1]
All my money. I'm expensive. I'll give you all my money.

Your money is in the negatives. Don't forget it. It's a repeat.

Repeat is what I... And it came up in the section where... Is it correct?

It's repeat? I don't remember. Well, that's what came up in the part of the text when it said, If that were the case, Lord Buddha wouldn't have repeated it.

Wouldn't have said it twice. And this is the term he used for it. Yeah, he wouldn't have applied that term.

[Speaker 2]
Right. So it can't mean... Then he said, like, so...

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, it means to apply a term.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, so it's not a repeat, so...

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, okay. Take the plane, sir, please. Uh-huh.

I've got to figure out where we are. I think we're here, right?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Okay. So just to keep you up where we are...

[Speaker 2]
I'm sorry.

[Speaker 1]
Just because I can see... Are we okay?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Just to keep you up where we are, we're at... Nyang De Mi Thepa.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Why Nirvana would be incorrect, according to you. And it has a... He doesn't obviously divide it into three parts, but I think he does.

Treat it as three parts, although it looks like two parts. I'm just saying it's not comfortable. First one, identifying Nirvana according to us.

Musun, which means munzin, which means to identify what is Nirvana according to us. Then to demonstrate that the other people's version of attaining Nirvana would be incorrect. Okay?

And then the third one is to show that our version of Nirvana is correct. So supposedly, first we're going to talk about... I'm sorry, we're talking about the last one.

Yeah, we are going to do that one. Yeah. Why Nirvana is possible if things are empty.

Okay? That's what we're talking about. We've reached this part.

Okay? If things are empty, Nirvana is possible. They were saying, if things are empty, Nirvana is not possible.

And we said, Nirvana is only possible because things are empty. Okay? Alright, here we go.

Sumba, Rangla, Thepala, Yul, Tse, Pabong, Tse, Tse, Gyu, Tsen, Tang, Denny, Gopal, Jawa, Tse, So, Shepe, Panye, Kyi, Yul, Bu, Tsen, Pao. Yeah. So Sumba, third part.

Rangla, Thepala. We're going to prove that our version of Nirvana is correct. Okay?

This is a difficult sentence. You can get it if you work on it. Up to the comma.

Anyone want to take a shot? From Duche up to this comma. Yeah, the reason why Duche's are not seen.

You want to go that way? No, nobody said direct. No, well, it means the direct perception.

Yeah. During the direct perception of emptiness by an Arya, Duche's are invisible. Okay?

Correct or not? Changing things are invisible. Yeah, cannot be seen.

Cannot be seen. Okay? When you're in the direct perception of emptiness, you cannot see changing things.

Which is why we often talk about how you can't notice the passage of time during the direct perception of emptiness. You could have been there for ten years. You could have been there for ten minutes.

You don't know. Okay? Yeah.

So the Duche's changing things, produce things, are not visible. Misik. Are not seen by the meditation of an Arya, meaning the deep meditation, meaning the meditation of emptiness.

Now, why is that? Okay? What's the reason?

Okay? So that's the first subject we're going to talk about. Then we're going to talk about DE NYID KONPA CHAL BAR CHE SOG THAR NYID KYI YUL TU BRTEN PO There was an expression that says DE NYID KONPA CHAL BAR CHE SOG He has performed the activity of getting used to that thing.

He has performed the activity of getting used to that thing. He has accustomed himself to that very thing. Now, that's an expression, and we're going to show what it refers to.

Is that KON? Is that? Is that?

Past tense, KON. Accustomed.

[Speaker 2]
Accustomed?

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. In this case, yeah. Okay, so first, the first subject here is going to be the reason why an Arya in the direct perception of emptiness cannot see anything which is changing.

Okay, here we go. Yeah, it's going to cover the thing about an Arya seeing or not seeing things that change by pointing out that DRODWA is MISI. What's that mean?

Yeah, Nirvana. DRODWA is a synonym. Liberation is a synonym for Nirvana, right?

Liberation is impossible for someone who talks about things having a nature of their own. So if you are going to say that things have their own nature, you will never get Nirvana. It's impossible.

And those who talk about DONG PA NYID, they, that's a stupa. They can have Nirvana. Those guys can have Nirvana.

Now, he said the opposite, right? If you're always talking about emptiness, you're never going to reach Nirvana. And we said, no.

If you're talking about things that aren't empty, you can't reach Nirvana. Got it? Here we go.

BARE KHYEN CHEN CHUNG BA LA YANG DRAG YE SHES KYI CHUG NA KHYER BA RANG NYID DRAG PANG RUNG GA YANG NYID PANG NYID YOR RO Let's see if we can pick out the Sanskrit. Just for fun. It'll help you later in your life, okay?

AVIDYA is ignorance. KHYEN is what? Pratyaya.

Pratyaya. Okay. Then CHUNG, to come up, is UDPANA, which means to grow up.

SAMYAK? Perfect. And what's wisdom?

It's NYANA. And here's an interesting verb to see honorific. YA'AVALOKITA YA'AVALOKITA, as in Avalokiteshvara, a Guanyin, okay?

So, yeah. UDPANA means came up. VA means or, okay?

VA means or. NIRODHA is a cessation. VA means again or.

KASHCID means somebody. GA YANG I'm sorry. I'll say it again.

AVIDYA, ignorance. PRATYAYA, factor. UDPANA, to occur.

SAMYAK, perfectly. NYANA, wisdom. AVALOKITE, to see.

Like Avalokiteshvara, who's UDPANA, things come up. OR, VA, NIRODHA, things end. And in Sanskrit, you have to say birth or, stop or.

Okay. NAKASHCID means none of them at all. UPPALABHYATTE is obtained, meaning exists.

Obtained meaning to happen. NA, that's a NA. Yeah.

Nothing ever is obtained, meaning nothing happens. LABHA means to be obtained. So in Tibetan, this one is none of them.

Oh, the RUNG is the VA VA. Oh. Okay.

Say again? None of them in Tibetan? Yeah.

Okay. At all. GA YANG is KASHCID.

MI is none. Okay. Cool?

All right. Here we go. This is hard.

Please read. Oh, by the way, I mean, MARE GYEN CHEN CHUNG BA LA If something has occurred growing from Marikpa, okay, with Marikpa as the cause for it to grow, if something has occurred with Marikpa as the cause for it to grow, and if it were seen by pure wisdom, meaning emptiness realization, then you could talk about starting of things, or you could talk about stopping of things. I don't care which one, RUNG.

None of them would be visible. Cool. Okay?

To that Arya's perception. Okay? So here we go.

Go ahead. Okay. Good.

Okay. This is hard. This whole thing is hard.

DU BYED LA SOGS PA What's the second of the links of the twelve links? Yeah, and it's called sanskara. NYID PA DU BYED KYI LAS Right?

NYID PA DU BYED KYI LAS So, he's talking about the eleven. Now take the LA SOGS PA as they do in Sanskrit. The eleven starting with link number two.

Okay? Which means we are excluding link number one. Okay?

So let's consider all the links, two through twelve, which have marikpa as their cause, which is what he said up here in the verse. He said they have marikpa as their cause. And I think here it should have been musu.

And we have to check the carving. So either marikpa has directly musu, caused them, or gyune, indirectly, has caused them. They have provided a trigger.

Misunderstanding has provided a trigger for fresh karma and the rest of the eleven, either directly or indirectly, as the case may be, jirigpa, as the case may be, jirigpa, which is true, right? It only directly causes link number two. And then three through twelve, it causes indirectly.

So this should have been musu, in my opinion. Iyepena. Therefore, we can say that the rest of the Wheel of Life is marikkenchen.

You know, has as its cause misunderstanding, triggered by misunderstanding. Genchen de, chenwa la, when they occur, yan dape pape yeshe kyi, yeah, the pure sight, wisdom of an ayah, in his, in his field of vision, is what it really means. Sipa ngona, in his field of vision, or her field of vision.

The, go to the Mingyur, okay? Is not visible. Okay?

In his line of sight, during his direct perception of emptiness, not visible. And then here's a whole list. Dujes, whether you're talking about the initial growing of things, or whether you're talking about the eventual ending of those things, yang lung, either one you're talking about, he can't see them, because they are tripa.

This means elaboration, but really nowadays I like figment. Figment of his imagination. I have a question about that.

Could you use the word figment without saying figment of your imagination?

[Speaker 2]
I think so.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. It would be a little slower. So in English, figment means totally false.

Like, oh, I saw a purple elephant run to the lounge. That's called a figment of your imagination. So this is an unusual word in Tibetan called made-up, fake, unreal, impossible thing.

But the literal word is like an emanation or something. But it just means totally fake. For the Arya, there's no tripas at all, which means a creation of his seeds, bad seeds or something, that he no longer sees things starting, and he cannot see things stopping, because those are fake details of things that you cannot see when you're in the direct perception of emptiness.

Okay. The Yangru. Yangru.

Yeah. And what it means, it refers to initial growth, tobmarkyowa, or eventual cessation. Yeah.

I don't care what you're talking about. They're all just figments of your imagination, and they cannot be perceived in the direct perception of emptiness. Okay?

Changing things cannot be perceived in the direct perception of emptiness. It's hard. It's really hard.

Okay. Now, he's going to explain it further. Okay.

Please read. Let me combine this into one line. Okay, here we go.

Deni? Deni. Yeah, okay.

So, duje la sopani. Why didn't he say, compose things, or things with causes, and why did he change the spelling of duje? He's supposed to be talking about duje's s, up here, right?

Here. He sold us, yeah, you're right, but let me spell that first. He sold us on thinking that produced things cannot appear to an Arya's wisdom.

But down here, he changed it from produced things to producing things. Okay. Why?

Now you can say it, Word. He's talking about the link now, the second link, okay? So he says, look, the second link, all of that stuff, production of initial karmas, fresh karmas, all that kind of stuff, is marigbetakpa.

It's just made up by your ignorance, okay? When you see a guy making karma, your mind is infected already, okay? You're already seeing things wrong.

So this pratakspa means imputed, or made up by, this is actually not the dog, this is the one that means made up by, okay? I should say, what do you call, fancified. Fancified by misunderstanding, okay?

YIN PAS, therefore, things like the second to the twelfth link are just nangwa to a lochulwa. Good. And this key is disjunctive.

But they could never be sikpa by an Arya's direct perception. And then he gives an example, okay? So, Rab Ribbe, as you know from the final verse in the Diamond Cutter, is a person who has a cataract, this white skin on their eye.

And when they look at the sky, they see a cloud. But the cloud is part of their eye. It's not part of the sky.

That's called Rab Ribbe. And it's found in the Diamond Cutter Sutra, okay? So, if you look at the sky, when you have a cataract in your eye, okay, a cloud will appear to you.

But if a person without a cataract looks at the same sky, minnam. They don't see any cloud. The cloud does not appear to them.

What's the example here? What's the cloud example? Wait, who's the looker?

Who's the looker? Yeah, Arya's direct perception can no longer see Yeah, things. Anything except ultimate reality.

Because they're not making them up anymore. Because they don't have blindness anymore. Because they don't have a spot on their eye anymore.

So they can't even see those things. Because when you see them, you're just seeing a spot on your own eye. And they're seeing emptiness directly.

They can't see those spots. Seems like he's gone too far. Okay.

You okay so far? Yeah, I mean, you know. We're swimming deep.

We're in the deep water. We're in the deep water. I hope we can touch the bottom.

Here we go. By the way, suddenly it all gets easier. Okay.

[Speaker 2]
I've been hearing that sound.

[Speaker 1]
And you're going to miss the hard part later. Okay, go ahead. I have an excuse.

GANG DAG PHAR PA'I YESHE KYI YOD PAR MA ZIG PA THAM YOD PAR MA YIN PAR ZIG PA CIG TU CHUNG Now stop there. And this is a very famous statement. And it's tough.

It's really tough. Okay, so let's go slow. GANG DAG Anything which PHAR PA'I YESHE KYI doesn't see as existing.

Okay, keep it in your mind. Okay, I'll say it again. Anything which the wisdom of an Arya in the direct perception of emptiness does not see existing.

Okay, does that mean they see that it doesn't exist? Okay, I'll say it again. If a guy is in the direct perception of emptiness and he doesn't see that something exists, does that mean he sees that it doesn't exist?

Is it the same thing? I'll say it again. If a person in the direct perception of emptiness doesn't see certain things existing, does that mean they see them as not existing?

No, it's a big difference, right? They can't see changing things at that time, but that don't mean there's no changing things in the universe. They don't see changing things, but they don't see that changing things don't exist.

Got it? And he says, people true. They take it to be the same thing.

[Speaker 2]
Ciktu.

[Speaker 1]
They take it to be the same thing. I'll say it again. The fact that an Arya doesn't see the eleven links during the direct perception of emptiness doesn't mean he sees that they don't exist.

It just means they're not there at that time. He doesn't perceive that they don't exist. Got it?

So don't take them to be the same thing. Ciktu Matruh. Okay?

But didn't he just say that they don't exist because their perceptions are related? Uh...

[Speaker 2]
But to correct you, there's no possibility that they see them, actually.

[Speaker 1]
Right? Here he's not talking about whether they exist, he's talking about whether they are exceeded, that they don't exist. Because they don't exist.

Yeah, good. And, you know, we're not through this paragraph yet. Okay?

So, ciktu tru ne, if you take them to be the same thing, that's not tendo. Yeah. That's not a case of dependence.

Because, bhagpa'i nyamsak kyi masik, if an Arya's direct perception doesn't see something, che mawa ni, when you talk like that, this is umapetawa yanda yin. This is the pure view of the Middle Way. Okay?

And the limbos, opposite. Yeah, the idiots, the fools, don't get it. Don't get it.

Yeah, this paragraph, you've got to sit with it for, I don't know, days and days, okay? But it would be equivalent to saying that just because it wasn't seen, because it wasn't seen by an Arya in his emptiness meditation, it must be the pure view of the Middle Way. If something was not seen by an Arya, that must be the real Middle Way view, because Middle Way says nothing exists.

That's wrong, right? So I think he's playing. I think he's playing here.

He's saying, I'll say it again, the bad guy would say, oh look, this Arya's having true Middle Way experience. Why? He sees nothing exists, which is a false statement.

It's a wrong, I'll say it again. Oh wow, he's having a Middle Way experience. Why?

He doesn't see nothing. Okay? Is it true he doesn't see nothing?

It is true he doesn't see nothing because he doesn't have a cataract on his eye. He doesn't see things anymore that are creations. Yeah, okay.

And don't go around saying fools don't get it, because you're the fool. If you think that's a Middle Way experience, you're the fool. Got it?

I think Gyaltsabje is picking on the other guy. I'll say it again. The other guy said, wow, this Arya's having a Middle Way experience.

Why? He don't see nothing. Wow, he's having a real Middle Way experience.

Why? He don't see nothing. And that's the real Middle Way.

I think he's being sarcastic. Okay? Are you saying he sees something?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. Or are you saying he doesn't see anything? No, he doesn't see anything.

[Speaker 1]
What does he not see, according to us? Things. Changing things.

Right. Because somehow changing things are mixed up with seeing things self-existently in this presentation. What does he see?

He sees unchanging things. Emptiness. Unchanging things.

[Speaker 2]
He doesn't see the object of the imagination.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, now they skip from he doesn't see self, he doesn't see tripas, he doesn't see figments of the imagination where things start and stop from their own side. Okay? But that doesn't mean he sees that nothing exists.

He just doesn't see things that don't exist. Okay? And don't go around saying that he's a real Arya because he don't see nothing.

Okay? Because that's not what it means. Okay?

Got it? He's having a Middle Way experience. Why?

He don't see nothing. Don't talk like that. Okay?

And especially don't go around saying only an idiot wouldn't understand. You're the idiot. Okay?

Got it? I think that's what Gyaltsab's just saying. But we're going to have to sit with this.

Yeah, I don't know. Because they're always infected by thinking that they don't, you know. But that they're like that.

Okay. But it is true then, an Arya doesn't see any changing things. Okay.

Okay. So, now. Let's go deeper.

[Speaker 2]
Here we go.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, let's go again. Go. What's that say?

Well, sorry, I translated it for you already. If something is a correct view, it would be incorrect to say a fool understood it. Okay?

If a viewpoint were correct, it would be a contradiction to say that a fool could understand it. Okay? Let's just keep going.

We can go back over it if you want. Read this one. Let's just do that much.

Okay? Khandel Yena. Yena Yang.

Even if dependent origination existed, even if things did exist in dependent origination, which means changing things, right? Causing things. Then, why would it ever be the case that you would have to see it during an Arya's meditation?

Okay? Kala means how on earth would it be necessary that he would have to see it? Honorific verb, perceive.

Which helps. Helps us. Okay?

Why? Rangshin Yena, Sikkhapa Yenki, Turcha Yena, De Sipa Gyalwa Echa. Rangshin Yena, if something existed self-existently, okay, he would have to see it.

But, if things were turcha, and that's Sugeng's special verb that I say for you, just for you. Turpa. Yeah.

Okay? The short definition of dependent origination? Turda.

Okay? So, if if something were a dependent object, it would be contradictory to say that he saw it. And, if something were a self-existent object, he would have to see it.

But he don't. Aryas, during the direct perception of emptiness, are looking for things that exist self-existently. Aryas are looking for husbands who are didn't-do-anything husbands.

And then they come up with nothing. Okay? But Aryas are not interested in looking at the husbands who did come from yelling at the kids.

That's not their job. Their job is not to see dependent origination. Their job is to see who's not in the kitchen.

Okay? That's their job. Okay.

Say again? No. It's the lack of self-existence.

Say again?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, that's true.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. Yeah, he finds emptiness. He finds that the husband is not there.

Okay. By the way, I don't mind to do this paragraph again next time. But I kind of want to get through it.

Because sometimes you get information later that helps you with the earlier part. Sometimes you don't. Here we go.

Tenne. Not ten. Soup noodles.

Ten. Ten. Where's Serena?

Kho wu gyan nang vipa la... This is hard. The vipa tar nang means what?

Do you know? Tar nang is an idiom. So don't break it down.

Tar nang means false. False reasoning. Tar nang means false reasoning.

Okay? Just forget the tar and forget the nang. It does mean apparent.

But that's not the point. RIG PA LTAR NANG means lousy logic, bad logic. DI LTA BU LA BRTEN NAS Using this kind of stupid logic, which we described here, other people say, Serna, other people say, U MAR PA SKYE LEN MED They take no position.

The ultimate position of Buddhism is no position. And that's an extreme view, and it's a wrong view. These people say, how do you know a guy really saw emptiness?

He doesn't say nothing. He has no opinions about anything. That's a real middle way.

It's very famous. SKYE LEN MED PA If you say that's the ultimate position of the middle way, it's that they don't believe anything. They're way out in the void.

Then, well, okay. KO BO KYANG Then we could even say that the namrit does take no position. Yeah, then we reply, oh, well, then the next cool down doesn't have any positions either, according to you.

If stupid logic and not taking any position is what makes you the highest emptiness seer in the world, then we say middle way people are also the highest seers. Sorry, yeah, mind only's are also middle way guys, because they also take ridiculous positions. Okay, got it?

Let's just keep going. DE SOG ZHIG LA U MAR PA SKYE LEN MED Oh, yeah, those mind only guys. Well, my claim is that they do think that things have some nature of their own.

Oh, they do have positions, because they say that functioning things exist from their own side, and fire is hot. No, you can't say mind only schools take no positions. Why?

For one thing, they say fire has heat inside of it. Okay? RANG BZHIN Okay?

Functioning things have their own qualities inside them. Fire is hot inside it. Don't tell me they don't take a position.

Well, then, middle way guys also are not no-taker positioners. Why? Because they also accept something.

What? TEN DRA Dependent Origination He says, don't tell me mind only guys don't take any positions. Why?

They take a position that functioning things have stuff inside of them. What? Fire has hot inside of it.

Okay, so you mean mind only schools guys do take positions. Yeah. What's the position they take?

Fires are hot inside. Hot exists inside a fire without seeds by itself. Okay, so they have one position.

That means they're not a no-position taker. Right. Okay, well, middle way guys then are not no-position takers.

Why? Because they have one position too. What's the position?

TEN DRA Dependent Origination Okay? Don't go around telling me middle way guys don't take any positions and that's why they're the ultimate school because they're void, void, void, void, void, void, void. Okay?

Don't tell me that. If you're going to say that, well, then mind only school guys are void. No, they're not.

They have a belief. Where's their belief? Fire is hot.

Oh, so they got one belief, so they're not a no-position taker. Right? Right.

So the middle way guys are not no-position takers. Why do you say that? Because they have one belief too.

What? Dependent Origination. Got it?

Don't go around saying ultimate viewpoint is to have no viewpoint. Okay? In that case, third school is fourth school.

Well, so are you disagreeing with that statement in general, or are you just disagreeing in general? I'm not going back that far. I'm forging ahead.

Let's keep going, and then I don't object to going back over this section if you guys want to because we only understood about a third of it. Okay. Go ahead.

. . .

Yeah, I would agree that middle way guys do accept something. What? They accept Dependent Origination.

Yeah, but you can only see Dependent Origination through a mistaken state of mind. Okay? That's the only state of mind that can see Dependent Origination, which is a changing thing.

Okay? Why? Well, our own system is that to a non-mistaken state of mind, which is the Arya's perception, they can't see Dependent Origination.

That's our system. So we said middle way guys are not a school where nobody takes any position at all. And he said, yes, they are.

And we said, no, they're not. They're just like mind-only school people. Are you saying mind-only school people don't take any positions at all?

Yeah. But they do take positions. They say their heat is inside a fire.

Okay, so do they take one position? Yeah. Mind-only guys take one position.

Do they have one correct position? Yeah. So do they have a position?

Yes. Do they take a position? Yes.

Are they the highest school? No. Why?

They take a position. Okay, so then the highest school is not the highest school either. Why?

Because they take a position. What position? They say things are dependent origination.

And then he comes back and he says, no, they don't. They don't take that position. And we said, what do you mean they don't take that position?

He says, they can't see it in an artist's perception. Okay. They can't see dependent origination in an artist.

Don't tell me they take it as a position. Into the highest state of mind in the universe, dependent origination doesn't exist. Okay.

So they, yeah, I'm not that far yet. Okay. So the only unmistakable state of mind, Loma Trupa, is the perception of an Arya.

And it doesn't see that dependent origination. Therefore, my position is correct that the highest position is to take no position. Yeah, it means he says.

He's still him. He's still him saying, don't tell me the middle way guys take a position. Why?

Because they don't take a position. Yeah, they do. They take a position that dependent origination exists.

No, they don't. Why not? They can't.

You can't see it in an Arya. You can't see it. It's a changing thing.

Okay. Therefore, it's not part of their position. This is the dumb defender of the middle way.

The wrong defender.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. No thanks. Thanks, but no thanks, defender of our school.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
Okay. Here we go. Now, this is cool because it ties together Adam's text with Nick's text.

We just studied this. Okay. Let's see if we can remember that far back.

Well, I've got to see who's talking. It's still somebody else talking. So you're fucked up?

Well, I'm not sure. Anyway, let's keep going. I promise to come back if we want to.

You may just want to go on to the appendices. Okay. Well, then.

Nam Rigpa.

[Speaker 2]
Mentalist.

[Speaker 1]
Mentalist. Okay. Those Russian guys told me they want to keep this word.

There it is. There it is. The mentalist school.

They say, co-curse, hidden things, rang san yapa mayem bah. Are not things. Are not archetype things.

Cannot be. No. Opposite of archetype.

Opposite of manifestation. Yeah. This is the manifestation of an archetype, which is a glass.

When your mom told you, this is a glass. You have a picture in your mind, this is a glass. Every time you see a glass, you match it to the one your mom told you about.

So that's called co-curse. And this is called rang san. Okay.

So according to them, yeah, co-curse cannot be rang san. Co-curse cannot be the existence of rang san? Rang san yapa?

Oh, nam rigpa len yang, co-curse rang san yapa mayem bah. There is no co-curse, which is also a rang san. Yeah.

So far, we're okay. There's no hidden thing, which is also a concrete thing. Okay.

Also concrete thing. Okay, got it? Which is to say, an unmistaken state of mind is a direct perception, and it can't see it.

Direct perception is an unmistaken state of mind, and that unmistaken state of mind can't can't see it, can't see co-cures. A direct state of mind cannot see co-cures. Okay?

Alright.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
And by the way, guess what? I don't mind going back over this again next time. And that's true.

No, I mean, you've got to stare at it for a couple of hours, Nick. Don't blame me, okay? I was in the hospital, drugged up.

It didn't help. Go cure your gang. Yeah.

Just because something exists on a hidden level of reality doesn't mean it can be seen by direct perception, he says. We say, that's the same as what you said before. What he's talking about, I don't remember.

Let's go to the last sentence. I promise we'll go back. Because maybe something later will help us.

I'm not sure. Please read this last ... how are we doing on time?

Let's do this one. Come on. I have an idea.

Let's go over this again next time. Okay. If you agree, then if you canceled all the slightly hidden things in the universe, you would also cancel all the things that belong in that category, which includes no self-nature.

So if you canceled all the slightly hidden things in the world, you would also cancel emptiness, which by the way is second-level reality. What's deeper than that? The subtle workings of karma.

If you cancel all the things in the universe which are slightly hidden, you're also going to have to cancel emptiness. And there's nothing, it's impossible that there's something that it would not cover. Therefore, if you cancel emptiness, you cancel all existing things.

And then you wouldn't have anything left to accept, and you would become a person with no positions. I'll say it again. If you cancel things that are slightly hidden, you're also canceling no self-nature.

If you cancel no self-nature, you're canceling all existing things. If you're canceling all existing things, you've got to be a person who has no positions. Yay!

That's all clear. Now, I pretend we didn't cover this section. I suggest we pretend we didn't cover this section.

Oh, we didn't? Yeah, you're right. You mean I have no positions?

Okay, we're going to go back over this again. I went backwards. This is one of those negative progress translation periods.

This is the same principle as when Nick offered me all his money. And I will cover everything I covered. There's some ideas in there somewhere.

Possibly stopped here. Yeah, let's go to Jed's best. Wait, wait, wait Wait.

Wait, wait. Wait. Wait.

I didn't have a bottle of wine with me.

[Speaker 2]
I was thinking about that.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, okay.