Классика Алмазного огранщика: Нижний Срединный путь — Анализ зависимости, занятие 27

[Speaker 1]
YI ZHU SHING MED TOK DRAM RIGA VINAYAKA SANGYE SHING DU MYIT TE WUWAR GYI DRO KUN NANDA SHING LA CHE PAR SHOK YIDAM GURU RATNA MANTRA HAM NIRDHA YAMI SANGYE CHE DANG TSOK GYI CHOK NAM LA JANG CHU PAR DU DAG MI DRAB SU CHI DAG GI CHEN YIN GYI PAD SUN NAM GYI DRO LA PHEN CHIR SANGYE DU PAR SHOK SANGYE CHE DANG TSOK GYI CHOK NAM LA JANG CHU PAR DU DAG MI DRAB SU CHI DAG GI CHEN YIN GYI PAD SUN NAM GYI DRO LA PHEN CHIR SANGYE DU PAR SHOK SANGYE CHE DANG TSOK GYI CHOK NAM LA JANG CHU PAR DU DAG MI DRAB SU CHI DAG GI CHEN YIN GYI PAD SUN NAM GYI DRO LA PHEN CHIR SANGYE DU PAR SHOK Smokini Donkiri Can we just get the homework first?

Yes, oh yeah, you take the plane. I'll try to figure out next text. Good morning, morning, sir.

Yes, sir. Oops, oops, oops, oops, oops, oops, oops. He whispered so that when you got the right answer, we wouldn't know.

Okay, what is the definition of pure karma according to Ketrap Tenpa? Oh my god. Four parts, thanks for the warning.

There are three, four parts. There's also a testament of mine. Yes, the first one.

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.

One of mine, the second part. It's caused by stuff involved with mental afflictions. Deep seeds, for what is involved with negative emotions.

NYIN MONG PA KYI BHAK CHA NYIN MONG PA KYI BHAK CHA, cool. and then motivated by something that's about the end motivated by the mental functions themselves subtle impulse yes, subtle impulse other than the negative emotions and random thoughts whoa wait a minute the fourth one I'm confused about yeah, it's random well, there's no such thing as random it was the it was trying to what's the Tibetan word that you chanted at random? yeah, let me find out the source Sugashi?

Namtok? Namtok, yeah, Namtok Namtok, this one one way, yeah can I put it that way? Namtok can I put it that way, Geshe-la?

whoa, whoa Namtok Namtok what's it exclude?

[Speaker 2]
realization, wisdom

[Speaker 1]
yeah, Topa with an S

[Speaker 2]
right

[Speaker 1]
I wouldn't say random I'd say idea idea, random ideas you can almost say random but why we say ideas because in English you can say he has some idea that I don't like him but it's wrong so idea can mean a wrong idea when you say I have a good idea in English that's a different thing that's usually correct if it's mine but an idea rather than a realization realization is always correct I realized he wasn't my friend but I have an idea that maybe something's going on okay, the next one how many lifetimes does it require for a full wheel of life to complete and how does it work? usually three and how does it work?

how does it spin? by the way, that's in a classic it could be a thousand so, yeah yeah, it can also happen in three seconds yeah, I mean, you gotta be careful but there is a thing where they call it Sesum Dhamma the teaching on the three lives we've had it in one of our texts right, it was I think it was your text it was in front of the first turning of the wheel yeah, how could you say that the wheel of life something like that, yeah okay okay, the next one how do you define the first karma of link number two of the dependence? three parts whoa how do we define the first karma?

first is motivated by the Sakme okay, it comes after link number one and before the rest it's a general type of it's a general type of impure karma and motivated freshly by the first link of misunderstanding which motivated it and in turn triggers a third member one of the top links of dependence which is a consciousness as a result of the last wheel K.J. okay sure does it have to be the last wheel or the result of the last wheel?

[Speaker 2]
which one?

[Speaker 1]
previous wheel result of the previous wheel good question, does it always have to be that way? I don't know we're talking about number two the last sentence the last sentence, huh?

[Speaker 2]
yeah, that's right wow you're not done, right?

[Speaker 1]
no, not yet say again consciousness as a result of the last wheel is that accurate? triggers a third member of the top links of dependence you can kind of say that but you, it may be you can say consciousness considered as a result consciousness considered they do, yeah not necessarily from the last wheel not necessarily that's a long story

[Speaker 2]
everybody's using the template oh, the template I'm not a rebel

[Speaker 1]
yeah

[Speaker 2]
living on the edge except for I had a cause okay

[Speaker 1]
okay, the Tibetan words at another particular time

[Speaker 2]
at another particular time

[Speaker 1]
experiencing other numbers at another particular time Casey born into another life oh yeah at rebirth no, that's not right

[Speaker 2]
that would be Bar C

[Speaker 1]
Casey is at rebirth rebirth at rebirth tell us about that

[Speaker 2]
committed

[Speaker 1]
we don't know that one very well oh, I got one more this is interesting I like this one I like this one there's a nom that means to smell or to sniff but it's not this one it's snow my friend what's ga without a prefix? ka ka ka it's a difficult one

[Speaker 2]
apparently

[Speaker 1]
all right, that's all okay thank you

[Speaker 2]
hey

[Speaker 1]
boys and boys thank you I had fun preparing for it last night late at night late at night yeah, after boys will be boys I never did understand all that boys will be girls and girls will be boys oh my gosh okay, here we go by the way, sometimes I will push it down to the next page just so I can see the whole thing at one time then you gotta remember to push it back you see what I mean? especially when you're translating when you're inserting English it's easier if you push it down so it's all on one page because you can't see the first word and the last word okay Nick's got the plane so gang's driving you know what that means when you say it that way? I hope this works out I don't know what's gonna happen I hope everything's okay if I got it, please Hail Mary that would be wonderful we didn't do this, right?

we did, but you said that we will come back oh yeah, we'll slow down yeah, okay just to repeat okay we didn't do this, right? There are some pieces here that we have to look at. Rangnyi, it is, meaning what?

The second link. This second link. It's long chepar, kunlong chepar.

[Speaker 2]
It's motivated tora.

[Speaker 1]
It's the yenlapdambo, marikpa. And that misunderstanding makes it fresh. Fresh?

He's fresh to his wife, so he knows. Sadu. Do you know what that means?

Fresh means impolite. Don't be fresh with me means don't be impolite to me. It means impolite in your words.

But it was a joke. Anyway, sadu, kune, lang, motivated, duh, duh, duh, su, slangs, right? Here's the present tense, slang.

here's the past tense, salangs, okay, motivated, and so that that looks at the second link from the point of view of what causes the second link, which is the first link, but now let's look at the second link from the point of view of what it causes, okay, the third link, okay, then we have it placed between its cause and its result, okay, rang de tendrel yin la ching yi gyi nang sen tu gyur pe, which is one of the links, one of the twelve links, which is one of the twelve links, gyur pe used as, which is, so please remember, please remember, okay, which is nang sen of a group, okay, a member of the twelve links, okay, and it's a consciousness, and it's a tendrel, yin la, so don't forget that in the study of the twelve links, sometimes the word dependent origination means a link of dependent origination, okay, all right, they don't keep repeating yin la, so it's very confusing, because the whole twelve is called tendrel also, okay, got it, yeah only from context, sorry, je du, as we said, it's a, it's in a cycle, it's a second of the three wheels, so think of the wheels like, like gears, yeah, you know, and then this, then this one, so yeah, normally the first two happen in the first life, misunderstanding and karma, so that, yin la nyi pa, the second link is going on for your whole life, that's the idea, and then it triggers your, what is the picture of the third one?

Yeah, it's a monkey, it means a overactive thing entering your mother's womb, okay, so it means, it means in the second life, in the second turning, okay, first turn, second turn, third turn, okay, then those go up to ten, and then at the end of your life you have certain attitudes about your seeds, which, which arm them, and then they go off at 11, in the third life, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, because 11 is really three, yeah, right, 11 is you coming out, is birth, but as we know in Buddhism, birth means conception, means a monkey entering the womb at three, so really three equals 11, they can't happen in the same life, you see, three is in the second life, and 11 is the start of the third life, okay, so really all of, all of the links are in 11, except for death, or you could say they're all in 12 as you age, so 11 is entering the womb, and then 12, the aging part of 12, it contains 1 through 10, you see what I mean, got it, okay, because 12 is, 12 is a whole lifetime, except for the moment that you enter the womb, okay, and some people would say it includes that, and there should only be 11 links, because you're aging the moment you enter the womb, okay, so anyway, here we go, so anyway, its cause, its result is de du kyi nam she, tendrel kye che kyi rab tu chewa, should be instrumental, okay, and rab tu chewa past tense means distinguished by, distinguished by, how do you distinguish it, well it's distinguished by being a result stage of consciousness, which is triggered by the lower level, okay, and then you've got this very nasty riksu nirpa, okay, of that general type, which means he's aware of an exception, and he wants to cover himself, whether he'll ever mention the exception that led him to put riksu nirpa, sometimes they do, and sometimes they don't, okay, but there seems to be some exception, okay, generally that way, it's like chir or zor, of that type, ne pe sak che kyi le, impyo karma, so mostly that's rab tu chewa, that's distinguished by, what, by being caused by, directly by negative emotions, and not by the deep seeds from negative emotions, okay, what makes it dirty karma, as opposed to clean karma, pure karma, is that it's triggered mostly by active mental afflictions, I hate to say it, negative emotions, as opposed to the deep seeds from negative emotions, it was, if it was mainly motivated by the deep seeds from negative emotions, it would be a pure karma, it wouldn't be an impure karma, in this school, and definitely not the same as pure and impure, which is the subject matter of his book, so sak vimala, what is the opposite of mala, sak che, let's go look, I'm just curious, that's, that's sakpa, mala is sakpa, well here it says sa srava, okay, sa srava, and then a srava is sakpa here, okay, a srava, okay, sakpa dang chepa is sa srava, sa, having, a srava, a very, srava means, you, we had it yesterday in words yoga class, when you spread your legs, prasarita, same root, sir, yeah, to spread, and then sometimes negative emotions are called widespread, targe, okay, anyway, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, let's go here so the percentage sign is a period under the letter before and a hash sign is a long mark and there's one other thing you need to know oh yeah that asterisk is is a accent mark which means shock shock shock oh that's just an abbreviation it comes from the Mahavid Bhatti it comes from the Mahavid Bhatti yeah that's the source of where he found the word yeah so ignore those things yeah don't go crazy it's just an abbreviation why do we have why do we have those marks it's just for a very fast input it's it's so they don't have to push command a hold it down then push a it's it's so they can type faster and then we make a program that changes it to long a so this is called input code and you should learn to read input code okay but it's just much faster you can go like this because you're not holding down two keys at once okay like and if you're gonna input for a hundred years if you can save half of 1% you saved six months you know I mean it's worth it especially if you don't have any budget okay you're not need but do chicken to me all right good such a kid okay we didn't do that no okay go ahead oh who's got the plane Stanley you want to try to crash the plane listen to him and try to correct him not it not an English G you know you may wonder why he's dividing again now he's dividing again he's dividing the second link he's not dividing general karma although it might come out the same by their essence by its essence divided by its essence there are three Sunya okay he didn't put any kind of dung and he didn't put any kind of karma he's assuming his reader will figure out where the three are divided and that's sometimes the case in scripture so it's harder for the translator he you don't know where he's pausing so Terry Kierkegaard what does that mean Terry Kierkegaard chirping which is what it good the day here is the second link so he says I'm only defining I'm only dividing karmas which are it meaning what I just talked about meaning the second link so that's extremely important to translate correctly which are the second link you could you could put in your translation which are the second link you could supply the day you know no I wouldn't which are it you can say which are it but your reader will get lost yeah so don't even dump that on them just say which is the second link which is acting as a second link if it were me I would say which is acting as a second take your bait there's Sunim now especially in a book about karma you're probably gonna have to distinguish between get well and Sunim so some people call Sunim merit which is it's okay okay so merit and what do you call non-merit I mean they call it the merit but that's no well you decide you decide yeah now there's I kind of like just good karma for get well I kind of getting used to using it good karma yeah but anyway you decide something people use merit and they use virtue for get well so we can do that if you want so merit and non-merit but but is there do they ever in Tibet and say like bad karma like way no so they call me a chain in her book right badly done but not really so there's probably so I kind of like gala I kind of like good karma because it's 90% more used than Sunim so I like to save a less common expression for Sunim yeah that's great that'd be great let's do that Sunim virtue Sunim I am but non virtue and then good karma and bad karma for a girl I mean let's try it on and see how it fits and maybe we change it later if we get in trouble because it's all on computer you can go back and change all of it Sunim Sunim I am or your editor can and then what's the third one me away unshifting okay now there's no karma there's no you don't know where to pause you just have to know okay virtuous non-virtuous and and unshifting okay and that's a little confusing because the unshifting is always virtuous it's always good karma sorry oh see if you say dare Kirpa you can say Sunim Sunim I am by and me oh but if you don't say tell you about me oh it's a kind of Sunim confusing it's very confusing and he's gonna have a debate which depends on that misunderstanding later and it's kind of a cheap debate because it's not our fault they made it like that okay you have the plane get your shoes better you are touching your tongue to your lower teeth yeah at the bottom of your top teeth you're saying see see but make it farther back she she shot real shot don't say sir anyway how taboo taboo down down for do pain and Roy not Mingi Pumbaa pinch a killer taboo Niva come Kong key not mean keep Pumbaa pinch a killer taboo some bow nice nice that we would never pronounce much the prenasal on the when it comes yeah yeah that's true okay not too heavy yeah it's probably because you can't you see I mean it's hard to say it's hard to start a sentence with I'm sorry what you never get a prenasal on a second column you never get a prenasal on a okay okay say she need here are here are respective understood respective examples classic example say she means classic example debate then do it this is a heavy one because it's an open vowel then do it no make it Pumbaa pinch a killer double karma which projects the body and mind I like to say it here because it's more clear to the listener if you say it five skandhas okay you can say that I think there's gonna be places where you have to say five skandhas and there's gonna be places where you don't have to say five skandhas and if you don't have to say five skandhas I think it would be much easier for normal English speaker to say body and mind no I mean you say heaps but but he says as obscure heaps is as obscure as skandhas and by the way he is almost derogatory in English.

He's a heap of trouble. Sometimes it means a heap of poo-poo. It's not a great word in English.

It rarely comes in a good context. It's almost always weird. There's a band that has a heap, which throws ahead or projects the body and mind As a result of karma, of a higher birth, dendroi, three higher realms, right?

It's a nickname for the three higher realms. Dendroi, good going, happy going. In the desire realm.

So this depa means in the desire realm. It should have been dukkhamki, or it could have been dukkhamki. So be careful.

Sometimes dukkham is simply referred to as depa, which means desire, and then you get confused. Now let's go to the second one. The karma which throws a body and mind as a result of, as a karmic ripening, you can say, in the lower realms, in the lower parts, the lower birth of the desire realm, is the second one, sunam mayimba, non-sunam.

And then the karma which throws the body and mind as a result of a ripening of karma in the higher realms, dha, kam kong means the two higher realms. It's a nickname. It's a technical term for the two higher realms.

It always means the two higher realms, kam kongma. It should have been dha or something, kam kongma dha. Excuse me?

Oh, literally it means upper realm, and it's singular. So you have to know, in technical term, it always means the two higher realms. But it doesn't say that.

It says the higher realm. So you just have to know. It's never one or the other.

Say again?

[Speaker 2]
Form and formless.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, form and formless. How can you tell it's singular? I mean, just because it doesn't have a noun?

Yeah, dark, especially dark. OK, yeah. It's similar to the case with the ngendro, which is always three, and dendro, which is always three.

OK, so now, I used to get confused. I used to get really confused. I still get confused.

When you say sunam and sunam mayimba, are you talking about karma committed in the desire realm? Or are you talking about karma committed anywhere, which is going to throw a desire realm? You see what I mean?

Can you collect sunam and sunam mayimba in the form realm? Can you collect new sunam and sunam mayimba? If sunam is defined by its result, desire realm, then theoretically, you could collect it in the higher realms.

OK? If sunam is defined by where you commit it, then it could be miyo ele. You see what I mean?

And the way he does it here is he defines it as karma which throws you into desire realm. He doesn't say where it's committed. OK, he doesn't say where it's committed.

So you could have a debate in the debate ground. The general idea is that people in the form and formless realm are just using upseeds, and therefore they have to go to the hell realms. Yeah, but do they ever make any new bad karma?

Or do they make any new good karma? They read holy books in front of Brahma, but they're mistaken holy books. Yeah, so anyway, your author has decided he's going to emphasize the desire realm as the destination.

You see what I mean? Sunam creates a destination in the good births in the desire realm. And sunamayimbha creates a destination in the desire realm, OK?

And then unshifting creates a destination in the higher two realms. He doesn't say where they're committed. And I always got confused.

He's pretty clear. You know, so you could debate whether, what do form and formless realm people make? They must make new karma.

[Speaker 2]
What do they do? So they must make sunam and sunamayimbha.

[Speaker 1]
I think. OK. Yes?

[Speaker 2]
This implicitly says that it's only projecting karma, that we are only talking about projecting karma.

[Speaker 1]
So far, yeah. Yeah, it does seem like that. But I would assert that it's also dzogchen.

I would assert that it's also dzogchen. But he didn't say that. Pumbopenje yena, penje yinpe makhyap, I would say.

If it projects a body and mind, it's not necessarily projecting karma. It's a verb, you see. And when you say projecting karma, it's an adjective.

So you might be able to defend the idea that dzogchen ki laya kanpenje. Oh, wow.

[Speaker 2]
That's bizarre.

[Speaker 1]
OK, go. Wait, who's got the plain word? You got the plain?

Yenlak nyipa dukye ki laya khichog kyi khyepar yukte, gemi ge kangrung yinpe khyap. Yeah, I think I would split these. This section is called khyepar, OK?

This section is always called khyepar, chuky khyepar, the features of what I'm describing. So first you have a senyi. Then you might have a senshi.

And then you'd have a yewa. And then you'd have the khyepar, chuky khyepar. So chuky khyepar doesn't mean extraordinary dharma or something like that.

It just means, let's discuss its typical attributes or features, OK? And that's normally the last part of rangguk, OK? They might discuss other features other than the divisions, OK?

So we've reached the last part of the rangguk, which is the easy part, usually. Yeah, and so I would divide them, you see? I would divide them up like this.

So the yenlak nyipa dukye ki laya khichog kyi khyepar yukte, there are certain typical features of the second link, fresh karma, OK? First division of features, somebody translate it.

[Speaker 2]
Virtue is non-virtue.

[Speaker 1]
It's not necessarily any one of virtue or non-virtue.

[Speaker 2]
Is necessary.

[Speaker 1]
Is necessarily. It's always either good karma or bad karma, which means it's never neutral. No, it's never neutral.

Lumaten. OK? Don't forget, sunam, sunam mayenpa miyowa.

Gyewa, migyewa, lumaten. Yeah, OK? Cannot be neutral.

It's always going to be a good karma or a bad karma, OK? I'll follow the reference to the second link. Which is the second link?

Yeah, only the second link. Don't speak, don't speak. You're not even talking about dirty karma, impure karma.

Then tongpang, gongpang, nyi kayu. Tongpang, gongpang, nyi kayu.

[Speaker 2]
Tongpang, gongpang, nyi kayu. You can have a path of seeing and a path of evituation.

[Speaker 1]
Huh? Kong. It's what the two, both things that you have to see and have to remove.

Yeah, there are both kinds of stuff in this box. Things you give up when you see emptiness directly, forever. It implies forever, right?

And things you give up forever when you are on the path of evituation. And we've said about the milopang. That's all really, yeah.

[Speaker 2]
It's a joke.

[Speaker 1]
There's no such thing. There's nothing that the fifth path eliminates. The fifth path is, you get there when everything is eliminated.

You see what I mean? So you can't say the fifth path works to eliminate something, OK? The fifth path is a result.

It's the destination. It doesn't do anything. You're just there, OK?

It doesn't make you pure, because you're already pure. When you get there, you are pure. That's what it is, OK?

Now, whether there's a thing called sokpong or jorpong, that's another discussion. But I guess there's got to be some stuff you give up. Part of the implication here is that you don't really get rid of any undesirable quality until you see emptiness directly.

You don't really get rid of anything until you see emptiness directly. And if someone said that, then you could say, well, jorlam su, so you do have to go to the lower realms? Or that's not something you want to give up?

OK. What's this mean? Sokpong.

[Speaker 2]
It's the cause of a higher personaria.

[Speaker 1]
A higher.

[Speaker 2]
And ordinary.

[Speaker 1]
Good. So-so-kye-wo dang-pa-pe-gyu-la. OK, it's just an abbreviation.

OK, she got it. OK, it means so-so-kye-wo dang-pa-pe-gyu-la. Didn't you say kipak?

People who saw emptiness, people who didn't see emptiness, both have it. Or yin-ba-kao. So Arya does have second ring.

Apparently so. Well, what's the use of getting to be an Arya if you keep making fresh karma?

[Speaker 2]
Do you think so?

[Speaker 1]
It doesn't matter. Yeah, they have old fresh karma. It's called the innate misunderstanding.

I mean, well, they don't make new fresh karma which can throw a rebirth. Anyway, we have to talk about it. They don't make new fresh karma to take a rebirth.

They make more new rebirths. Those sectors to eight. Seven.

[Speaker 2]
Anyway, yeah, OK.

[Speaker 1]
We'll discuss it later. Kam sum ge ten la yu. Kam sum ge ten la yu.

[Speaker 2]
All three are based.

[Speaker 1]
This ten means body and mind. OK, in the being of. So a person.

Here it means a person. It's possessed by people in all three realms. It's possessed by people.

So be careful with ten, OK? Phil, you have the plane. Be tough.

Make him improve. Be nitpicky. Keep going.

Yeah, sorry. I'm going to go down. But it could go up.

Five minutes, however. This one's hard. OK, Kachi, let's consider chitin, which is going to be a big thing in your text.

Your text is hard. Let's take the karma, which is going to project the body and mind as a karmic ripening of a deva, of a pleasure being. I like to call it pleasure being.

Iron Man. Wonder Woman. Let's take that kind of karma.

Pang ja maya batao. So are you telling me it's not something we should give up? Is it or is it not something we should give up?

Pang ja maya batao. So I'm going down. Are you telling me it's something not to be given up, we shouldn't give it up?

Then we say, chitin. Yeah, chitin. Why you say that?

And he says, ge wa yin pe yin chitin. It's good karma. It's good karma.

Why you want to give it up? Then we say, why can't we say, ge wa mayin? It is good karma.

It is good karma. We can't say tamadrum. We cannot say, I disagree with your reason.

It is a good karma. So we've got to say, just because it's a good karma doesn't mean it isn't something to give up. According to him, we just said that if something is good karma, it is something to give up.

He's interpreting the way we just divided karma.

[Speaker 2]
OK?

[Speaker 1]
OK, got it? Well, that's a good question in the debate ground. Do you want?

And that's going to be a theme which reoccurs in his text. Is good karma something you want to give up? I had a discussion with Ori yesterday.

Kamala Sheila talks about the dharma, leaving it behind, that it's like a boat. Don't take a boat from L.A. to Hong Kong and then carry the boat to Chengdu. You see what I mean?

OK? OK? OK, interesting.

Yeah. She had to teach it, and she was confused. If you're interested, there's three bonds.

OK? When the Buddha in the Dharmakarya Sutra says, give up the boat, leave the boat behind, he either means wrong dharma, like Sankhya system. Seriously, I mean, that's the classic example.

Or he means a dharma, a Dharmakarya Sutra, which you didn't write. Right. Yeah.

It's coming from itself. Yeah, and it comes from its own side. Which you can sit in a dharma class year after year and think that the dharma's coming from its own side.

Or he says, then later you have to give up the dharma which you did write, which means you'll get to a place where you don't need to check Sugeng's text to understand what the three kinds of karma are. You know, there'll come a day when you don't need these books, because it's all here. Not because you don't need it.

OK, got it? Yeah, when you become a Buddha, you can always read them all the time. OK, anyway.

Khyalakye. OK, Madhubna.

[Speaker 2]
Thanks, Mitchell.

[Speaker 1]
They're in Geshe-la's heart. Yeah, Madhubna, if you say, Tag Madhub, which is what? We want to have peace, not the truth.

Yeah, good. If you say, I disagree with your reason, which means the karma which turns you into Iron Man is not a good karma, OK? If you say that, Dattav?

[Speaker 2]
Chudra.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, he's going up. It is, too, a good karma.

[Speaker 2]
It is, too, a good karma. Why?

[Speaker 1]
It's what we're talking about, man. Whether or not that's a legal reason, he's using it a lot. It's like telling your wife, we should go to the restaurant, because it's the restaurant.

But we should go, too. Yeah, it's like that. It doesn't work.

Shinten.

[Speaker 2]
Did we say that?

[Speaker 1]
Did we just say that? I mean, I'm buzzing now, but did we just say that that's Khyalak? I mean, that's...

No, because it's the karma that throws the body and mind of a deva. OK? Now, if we agree that it's not something you should give up, he said, pang chok mei ba thao.

You're telling me it's not something you should give up? And if we say, duh, you're right. It's not something you should give up.

If you say it's not something you should give up, if you agree, pang chok mei ba thao. Of course you have to give it up. Chok wa du nye kyi kyi bu, pang chok mei ba thao.

Because it is something that people who have an aspiration for freedom should give up, makhyap. Just because people who aspire to achieve liberation would give it up doesn't mean that in general it's something you should give up. What?

Just because ultimately you have to give up all kinds of karma doesn't mean you shouldn't do good karma now to get there. OK, got it? That's the argument.

It's kind of a cool argument. It's the snake, the rope that was the root of the tree, remember? Yeah.

Yeah, so for the time being, you have to use things that you're misunderstanding to get there. And it comes to your text big time today. Do the two opponents ever see the example, the Chod Chen, in the same way?

And if you don't, can you even have an argument? Yeah, all right. OK.

It was only two minutes. If you say, consider the Japanese restaurant, we should go there tonight because I like Japanese food. OK, whether it's a good argument or not, we don't know.

But if you don't agree which restaurant he's talking about, can you have an argument? No. If he's talking about the Japanese restaurant in West Sedona and you're talking about the Japanese restaurant in Villageville Creek, can you have this argument?

Well, then you can never have an argument. Then you can never have an argument. Because the reason given is always not accepted by the other guy.

The quality given in the reason is always believed by the other guy not to apply to the Chod Chen. So he's already seen the Chod Chen in a different way than you are.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, so you just divorced the difference?

[Speaker 1]
You just changed from Chod Chen to assertion, from assertion to Chod Chen. No, the quality expressed in the reason which he must accept about the Chod Chen. Mm-hmm.

OK.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, so if you see it differently, then it's not the same object you see.

[Speaker 1]
But you always see it differently. Anytime you have an argument. When you're trying to convince her to go to the Japanese restaurant, she always sees it as the Japanese restaurant that I don't really want to go to.

And you always see it as the Japanese restaurant that she should go to. So if you're not talking about the same restaurant, can you even have an argument?

[Speaker 2]
That's his book.

[Speaker 1]
Wait, we're going later, later, later, later.

[Speaker 2]
OK.

[Speaker 1]
OK, so what we've learned so far is if it's something you have to give up, in the end, to reach Buddhahood, it's not necessarily something to be given up.

[Speaker 2]
Right, now.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, understood now, but nobody said now. OK, got it? In this text.

It's not so hard, you know. Yeah. You have to keep doing dirty good karmas to get to to get to where you're not doing karma.

That's right. Satsang with Mooji Satsang with Mooji It's getting hot. Words next.

Oh man, I cracked your text.