Сугэн Ши — Книга 2: Колесо жизни (первый принцип и подразделения зависимости), занятие 40

[Speaker 3]
How are you? Who is it? What are you doing?

Here we are, waiting for you. I didn't know you work here. Here and everywhere.

[Speaker 1]
Yes. Here, building something.

[Speaker 2]
Little by little. Hi, Nick.

[Speaker 3]
Hey.

[Speaker 1]
I'll stay co-host. Okay, got it. So many questions.

Hey, pal.

[Speaker 3]
No me escucha. He says hi back. Where is Shanti?

Sleeping.

[Speaker 2]
Oh. I won't jinx you.

[Speaker 1]
So are we all ready? Can I start with the homework, Nick? I think it's a good idea, Shugang.

Let's do it. I love it. Let's do it.

Thank you for loving it. I mean, I love it. I think it's hilarious.

No, no. I mean, thank you for loving the homework. Well, I don't love your homework yet.

I love your idea. You don't love the homework yet? We'll see, maybe.

That's too direct. The homework, like, takes me out to dinner, plays some nice songs.

[Speaker 2]
We love you, Shugang. That's as much as we can offer.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, yeah. All right. Okay, so what did Master Vasubandhu explain as the reason for failure to understand what came before and so on?

So does anyone remember having the habit of what and the belief that what?

[Speaker 2]
No. It's because no one wrote a commentary to his book.

[Speaker 1]
Okay. Yeah, so I think— Wasn't it the habit of Jigsa, like, Jigsa Watawa, like, having the habit of having the destruction view or something? It's more like having the habit of holding things as themselves, coming from themselves, you know.

Yeah, can be. Can be Jigsa Watawa. And then the belief— What is the belief?

What belief? What is the wrong belief? Hi, Geshe-la.

Hi, handsome. So, belief of what? That things have their own nature.

Belief that actually just acts— the belief that acts as the obstacle to freedom. Yes, oh, thank you. Okay, what are the three versions of holding that things have self-nature?

So holding that things are what? Holding that things what? And holding that there are what?

Unchanging. Things are unchanging, yes. Function.

Function, things function, and there are? Agents and consumers. Agents and consumers.

Oh, yeah. I sort of chose something else. Good.

Let me present. I call it—the word's embarrassed. Does it pass the waitress test?

It's not any worse than agents and consumers. Okay. I don't know if it's— it's not very clear.

Not very clear, too. But, okay. Givers and takers?

Doers and takers. What was the Tibetan? The Tibetan.

Oh, oh, oh. Chepapo and Sawapo, yeah. Oh, doers and eaters.

Yeah, yeah. Doers and eaters were the original. Shall we?

I mean, if it was me, I'd like eaters, but— Yeah. Eaters. Just because I like eating.

Sounds like a restaurant. Okay, all right. Let's stick with eaters for now.

I don't know. Don't listen to me. Okay.

Doers and eaters, okay. Anyway, okay, let's continue. Thank you.

I'm really getting into this class. What are the four different things that block us from getting free of those wrong holdings? Failing to understand how to practice.

I was guessing. How to have protection? Number three, yes.

Seek protection is the first one. Failing to understand what it is we need to see. Yes, and then this is protection.

Failing to understand how to get rid of what goes against the practice and how to do, what to do to oppose it and what uses it. How to develop the antidote, yes, and finally, failing to understand the lack of pride about the antidote to the realization. Pride, yes.

It's like exceeding pride about being able to use the antidote to the realization. Yes, thank you. Thank you.

Geshe-la, the term is called exceeding pride, the term that was used before.

[Speaker 3]
Yes.

[Speaker 1]
Okay, Tibetan. Gekchepa. Blocker.

Obstacle. Obstacles, blocker. Obstacles, yes.

Impediment. Impediment. Yes.

Okay, let's put two around. Gepapa and Sawapa and then we discuss about this. I don't know.

Say again. Gumpeng Ngangyal. I think this is exceeding pride.

The one that we discussed, exceeding pride or super pride. All right. Okay, now next is my attempt at translation.

You all see my screen? Did you find Gumpeng Ngangyal in somebody's... It has a special meaning.

Yeah, it's the special pride, exceeding pride. There you go. Yes, I summarize here in the footnote.

Nice. These are the seven. I put it here in the context of our discussion.

The pride that we want to get rid of is the fifth type called exceeding pride. Which is... Describe it.

Yeah. Even though we have yet to achieve a certain high quality, we think to ourselves, I have reached it. Yeah, so this is the footnote.

Do you think it has any special relevance here? Towards the misunderstanding, right?

[Speaker 3]
Can you make it a little bigger, Sugeng, please?

[Speaker 2]
Oh, okay.

[Speaker 1]
Where I said Kamakilian. Yeah. That is your term.

Kamakilian pride. He discusses it. Not that he had it.

Yes. Do you think there's any reason why he singled out that pride here? That's my question.

I mean, I was just thinking about it this morning, and this seems to be a bit... This seems to be very subtle, you know. Sometimes I think it's good that we know the antidote.

And we know the... Sometimes it's good that we know... Sometimes it's good that we understand this part, how to develop the antidote.

How to develop the antidote towards those that goes against the practice. But I think the subtlety comes in when we are too proud of this ability. Okay.

And we have not really... Well, we just know in the sense of knowing, but not really doing it yet. So I think this is related to the part that, hey, besides knowing it, we need to do it.

And then once we do it, of course, we will not have this so-called pride. I mean, this is how I would see it. Okay.

It's some kind of deluded pride about using the antidote. A deluded pride. I mean, I'm just...

I don't know. You see, he has... How many different prides are there, again, seven or nine?

I forget. Both seven and nine. So, out of those nine or out of those seven, why did he choose this one?

That's what I'm saying. I just wonder if you had any insight into any... He didn't say pride in general.

He said specifically pride that thinks you achieved something that you didn't achieve. I think because... Yeah, I mean, I think this is because it's very subtle in this case.

That's why he purposely pointed this out. He pointed this out. Maybe I need to...

Well, I think maybe I need to meditate more on this one. Yeah, just think about it. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Hasso says maybe the author had problems with that one.

Okay, yeah. Oh, yeah. I mean...

Brother, pretty well. Oh, the brother, okay. Yeah, all right.

Okay. Thank you. Your mic is a bit soft.

Are you connected well? It might be the popcorn in my mouth. I think it's on.

Let me make sure it's on. Hang on. Okay.

Oh, it's not on. You're right. I see.

Is it on now? Hello. Much better.

Okay, good. Sorry. All right.

So, we finished the part that you translated, right? No. I finished...

Yes. We finished here. Stop here.

So, I continued from this part. Okay. Okay.

Depe Duchenne, I'm thinking of the past moment. Yeah. Good.

Do you think there's a... Do you think Tok Tok is a mistake, or you think he did it on purpose? I've never seen that.

I mean, it's possible. Yeah. What do you think?

To me, because it's repeated, so the chance is that it is on purpose? I think it might be on purpose. I mean, I can't confirm it, but we don't have the censor.

But it's talking about things in the past that you misunderstood. I don't know, somebody hurt you, or somebody did something to you. And I guess you did Tok Tok it, right?

Yes. You tend to think over again and again for years, right? Yes.

And then questions whether it existed before. Yeah, that's perfect. The translation's quite good.

Yes. Yeah. Thank you.

Somehow I found there is a pattern of this to this pattern of this and so Yeah. Yeah. Good.

That's good. That's fine. Yep.

It's funny my thinking of the future wrongly. Yeah, it's perfect. Fine.

Good translation. Thank you. When you don't make a mistake, but I can probably find them.

Good. Okay. I didn't even get to read the sentence.

You're so fast. Okay. Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. Thinking wrong about what's inside and usually it means inside of you.

Later he's going to talk about more detail and then he's going to talk about misunderstanding outside things. So this does talk about inside things. So it's wrong thinking about what's inside of you.

It's the wrong it's thinking wrong about the question how is it? It's thinking wrong about the question who is here? That's good.

It's thinking wrong about the question who will come, right? And it's thinking wrong about the question of where did these thoughts come from? That's nice.

And where will we go after we die? Yeah, good. Nice.

Very nice. So far, good. By the way, this is a...

This part is not super difficult. It's like when you get here you feel relaxed a little bit. NANG NI SHES PA What does it mean?

Good. Okay. That sentence is fine.

What does it mean to misunderstand the inside? Yeah. Did we read this part together?

Oh yeah. No, haven't. Why don't we start with NANG GIS DU BYED RNAMS Okay.

NANG GIS DU BYED I'll emphasize you just because I'm so nice. NANG GIS DU BYED RNAMS LA TSUL SHING MA YIN PAR BDAG TU YI LA BYED PA'I MI SHES PA GANG YIN PA'O Yeah. DU BYED just means inner things here.

Inner... Inner... Right?

DU BYED generally means a cause. Right? What's...

Is it a link? I don't think this is a link here. It isn't a link, but is DU BYED in general a link in the real life?

Uh-huh. Oh yes. Link number two, right?

Link number two, correct. Yeah. So, thinking about factors inside of ourselves, and it's just vague, we don't know what he's talking about.

Right. Where you think of them as being me. Okay?

Thinking of factors inside of yourself in the wrong way, and that is thinking that they are focusing on them as if they were me. YI LA BYED PA means to focus on them, bring them to mind as if they were me. Okay?

Okay. The next one is easy if you want to read it. PHYIS MI SHES PA GANG ZHES NA Yeah, what does it mean to misunderstand outside things?

Yeah, what does it mean to think... What does it mean to not understand outside things? We finished inside things.

Yes. Right here. SEMS CAN GYI DRANG SU MA RTOG PA PHYIS NUS DE RNAM LA CHUL ZIN MA YIN PAR DAG KHYIR YI LA BYED PA MI SHES PA GANG YIN PA'O Yeah.

He says, SEMS CAN GYI DRANG SU MA RTOG PA I'm not talking about other living beings. When I say misunderstanding the outside, I'm not talking about other living beings. I'm not talking about anyone who is counted among other living beings.

That's the DRANG SU. I'm not talking about anybody who is counted among other living beings. Rather, I'm talking about outside factors.

It means outside changing things that you think about the wrong way because you DAG KHYIR YI LA BYED PA you focus on them as being mine. Good. And that's a kind of misunderstanding.

Misunderstanding the outside things that are not other people that you think are mine. That's what it means to misunderstand the outside. It doesn't mean other people.

It means outside things. And especially the ones that you think you possess. And you misunderstand the nature of possession.

Nature of possession. And then he says... Can you read the next line?

PHYI RANG RNAM MI SHES PA GANG ZHES NA Yeah, what does it mean to... What? To fail to understand the inside and the outside.

[Speaker 3]
Good.

[Speaker 1]
I would put it more strongly. I would say to misunderstand. Misunderstand.

Yeah. Because that's the topic we're on. Yeah.

Okay. Yeah, I think because we... Just before this series of Mi Shes Pa, the series of Mi Shes Pa, I think we sort of came to a conclusion to...

Or rather we sort of differentiated from the Marikpa by saying that failing to understand. I like it. I think you're correct.

Let's say fail to understand. I like it. Let's use that.

Yeah, I understand. I understand your misunderstand. Okay.

Now, Shengyi Gyugi, you want to read this one? Yeah. Shengyi Gyugi, NU BYED NAM LA TSUL ZHIG MA YIN PAR RTZA PA DANG MI RTZA BA DANG THA MA'I BAR RTOGS PA'I MI SHES PA GANG YIN PA'O Yeah, this is probably RTZA BA.

Oh, the first RTZA BA should not be RTZA PA. It should be RTZA BA. The second one.

Good. Nice. No space.

Yeah, okay, good. Fail to understand. Yeah, okay.

This is tough. RTZA BA means friends. You're friends.

DA SHES or RTZA BA means friends. Now how are you going to translate this? By the way, it's failing to understand situations in the minds of other people, which means you have an imagination, RTOGS PA without an S, right?

You imagine that among the people around you there are RTZA BAs and MI RTZA BAs and THA MA'I BAR. People that we like, a friend. Yeah, a friend.

And then enemies. And then THA MA'I BAR means... Here it means, yeah, in between.

In between. For a hundred dollars, there's a sin in the Vajrayana which uses this word, which is said to be more serious than killing a person. Treat yourself as normal.

I think Kramer did it. Yeah, Kramer did it. You did it by a split second.

It's like one of those races where they have to use the camera. What did you say, Dr. Kramer?

[Speaker 2]
THAMS MA'I RNAM ZHES Seeing things as they were ordinary.

[Speaker 1]
THAMS MA'I RNAM ZHES THAMS MA'I RNAM ZHES To see things as ordinary. Somebody says, Why ZHES?

[Speaker 2]
Why ZHES instead of ZHES?

[Speaker 1]
Z-H-E-N To be attached to it or to believe in it. This is an extremely important word in Vajrayana. THAMS MED means just normal.

Like, oh, did you see that guy in the restaurant? I thought he's a special person. Maybe he's a Buddha.

And you say, nah, he's just a regular dude. That's THAMS MED. THAMS MED NANG GZHAN In Vajrayana, it's considered worse than killing a person.

It will hurt you more than killing another person. That's cool. All right, situation in the mind center.

Hang on. Wow. Yeah, not thinking Soshin Yimba.

You got to put that part in here. Oh, yeah, I'm going to insert these symptoms into the... Oh, okay, okay, okay.

I got it. Let's go on. You can do that housekeeping later.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, housekeeping.

[Speaker 1]
Okay. I will do the housekeeping later. Okay.

Why is this section so sexy? You didn't sell your book. You guys have to learn to sell your books.

Yeah, this is still part of the misunderstanding. And Master Vasubandhu, or rather Buddha, actually, was giving us all the examples of the... all the objects of misunderstanding that will...

I think that will lead into this misunderstanding. And I think there are about 14 or 15 items. What about the closet?

Say again? What about the closet? Closet?

Yeah. Somebody's coming out of the closet here. Oh, yes.

Master Vasubandhu is coming out of the closet. But I think all these are... Well, I mean, all these are from Buddha, but Master Vasubandhu was explaining one by one all these examples.

All these... By the way, if you search for 15 inside of square brackets in this document, you will hit the Sutra section 15. And you should be doing that on every single one of these.

So, search backwards now. Oh, I can't. Hold on.

Let me try 14. Oh, yes. Here it is.

There you go. In the bold is the original Sutra by Lord Buddha. And then now we're getting the interpretation of it from the Master, from the undisputed Master of Amidharma, is showing his real school.

He could care less about Amidharma. He's a minority. He follows his brother.

So he says, I'm going to teach you this Sutra sections, one by one, according to my brother's book on the Yogacara Bhumi. Yogacara Bhumi. Levels of yogic activity.

And so every time you come to once again, you would learn more if you search backwards for that number. And you'll see the original Sutra. Because he's following the Sutra.

Very, very short Sutra. It's like a page or two pages. It's a Sutra on the Wheel of Life, or dependent origination.

And now he has written a commentary that will be 700 or 800 pages in English on a two-page Sutra. All right. And so anyway, what does it mean if you fail to understand karma?

Good. LAS MI SHES PAR GANG ZHES NA Please read the next section. LAS DANG DE YIN DREG BU LA YANG PHYIN PHYI LOGS THU TSUL ZIN MA YIN PAR RTOGS PAS MI SHES PAR GANG YIN PA'O Yeah, what does it mean to misunderstand karma?

It is failing to understand... What it means is, it's the form of misunderstanding. MI SHES PAR Then read backwards.

Where you think about LAS and its DREG BU. Karma and the result and the consequences. Yeah.

PHYIN PHYI LOGS Miss wrongly. Yeah. Tell me why he added the word YANG here.

For two dollars. One dollar. Fifty cents.

Twenty-five cents. You pay me. A crowd or something.

Somebody tell me why he put the YANG. Come on. Even...

I know what it means. I want to know why he put it there. The original sutra says LAS MI SHES PAR.

Oh, well... Even misunderstanding karma or even that things are results of karma? Yeah, he asked a rhetorical question, right?

What does it mean when the sutra says, you don't understand karma? And then Vasubandhu says, it's thinking about karma and also, by the way, it's results in the wrong way. That's what the YANG means.

Also, by the way, it's results. It means I'm adding the results of karma. It doesn't mean you just misunderstand karma.

You misunderstand what it creates. So Vasubandhu is glossing the sutra. Okay, cool.

That's why the YANG is there. Yeah, okay, good. By the way, what's the difference between TSUL SHIN MA YIN PA and CHEN CI LOG PA?

Anybody, $20. CHEN CI LOG PA is asked backwards. It's stronger.

It's just stronger. Yeah, CHEN CI LOG PA is much stronger. Someone's trying to help you for years and you're convinced that they're trying to hurt you.

That's called CHEN CI LOG PA. Someone's trying to help you for years and they irritate you, but you understand they're your friend. That's called TSUL SHIN MA YIN PA.

You're thinking of them the wrong way or you're thinking of them the opposite wrong way. Okay, got it? Did you say $0 for that one?

Well, it just ended quickly. I think it was very close to you paying me. I'll put $20 on that.

No, no, no, I was just kidding. Okay, next one, you guys. SANGS RGYAS MI SHES PA GANG ZHIG YANG Let's go back to 16.

Search for 16. Sugeng, what I'll always do, I'll click... Yeah, go backwards.

Backwards. That's it. Now, the full sutra, and it's a tiny sutra.

It's a few pages. It says, what does it say? SANGS RGYAS MI SHES PA GANG ZHIG YANG TSUL MI SHES PA GANG RGYEN DON MI SHES PA GANG So, the failure to understand the Buddha, the Dharma, and the Sangha.

Yeah, the three jewels, basically. Now, skip ahead to our mind-only comment. Where's the other two jewels in this first sentence?

It's below. Yeah, he's going to cover them one by one. Yeah, so he says...

Yeah, what does it mean when you say you fail to understand the Buddha? Here's what it means. Okay, please read.

SANGS RGYAS NAM NI YANG CHUB YIN PA RI YI LA MI SHES PA'AM PHYIN CHI LOG TU YI LA SHES PA'AM PHAG MED PA'AM THES MTSOMS SA PA'AM KHUR SPAN BDEBS PA MI SHES PA GANG YIN PA'AM Yeah, and by the way, KHUR PA can be KHUR PA or KHUR BA in this case. KHUR BA You can say BA or WA, it doesn't matter. Okay.

What's YI LA SHES PA'AM mean? It means to think in a certain way. It means to bring it to mind in a certain way.

Okay, so YI LA SHES PA'AM means to consider the Buddha... I'm sorry, to fail to consider the Buddha as Changchun. Yeah, you have to fail to consider the Buddha as Changchun.

When you think about the Buddha, you don't think of an enlightened person. Okay, when you think about the Buddha, you don't think of him as enlightened. That's called YI LA MI SHES PA'AM.

Or you even CHIN CHI LOG TU YI LA SHES PA'AM. You think like the totally wrong way, like he's not enlightened. The first one was you don't think about him as enlightened.

The second one is you decided he's not enlightened. Okay, that would be CHIN CHI LOG. Ask backwards, completely backwards.

Okay, or to take the Buddha's BAG MED PA lightly. Okay, BAG MED PA means... Carelessly.

Carelessly. Yeah, what's the example you guys? The bashful bride.

Yeah, BAG MA means a bashful bride. BAG MED PA is an ancient common word for lack of consideration or something like that. You're careless around the Buddha.

Like you talk lightly about the Buddha, or you carelessly treat statues of the Buddha, things like that. They get worse and worse here, by the way. What's the next one?

TET TZO. You have TET TZO. Doubts, having doubts.

Yeah, I don't know if he got enlightened or not. I'm not quite sure. Okay, that gets worse and worse.

I would say, what do you call it? LOG PA'I TET TZO. Yeah, wrong doubt.

And then KUN DANG. Look down. Or you say...

Discount. Discount. Yeah, you say he's probably not enlightened.

Okay, so they get worse and worse here. Okay. Now there's three lines of stinky stuff here.

Three lines of stinky stuff. What do they define? Three lines?

Starting with SANGS RGYAS. Oh yeah, and then the DAL MA in the SANGS RGYAS. Go back up.

Go the other... There you go. What he described in three lines, he described all kinds of lousy attitudes about the Buddha.

Why is he talking about that? That he was going to talk about failing to understand the Buddha? Yeah, that's what the sutra means.

All the sutra said was, you fail to understand the Buddha. And then Vasubandhu's commentary says, you don't think about him the right way. You think about him the wrong way.

You're careless about respecting him. You even doubt him. You even put him in doubt.

That's ignorance, or that's misunderstanding. The Buddha is, because if you understood who the Buddha was, you'd be down with your face flat on the floor. Okay, cool.

All right. All right. Okay.

Now, anticipatory translation. What's going to happen? He's going to apply those three lines into the DAL MA and the SANGS RGYAS also?

Well, first there's going to be a question, which is, what does it mean in the sutra when it says CHOS NI DAL MA? And then there's going to be something stinky. Okay.

Here we go. Here's the stinky part. Please read.

CHOS NI LEGS PAR GSUNGS PA YIN PAR YID LA MI BYAS PA'AM SRID BYA BA SNGA MA BZHIN NO Yeah. Yeah, you YID LA MI BYAS PA. You don't think about how LEGS PAR GSUNGS PA the CHOS.

So, not feeling to understand that DAL MA has been well-spoken. DAL MA is a well-spoken thought. Yeah, failing to understand that the DAL MA was well-spoken.

Failing to understand that the DAL MA was well-spoken, etc. Okay. Now you got to go back to the Buddha and take out some stinky things there.

For the example, No, I wouldn't copy it. I'm just saying, you're putting it down. You're giving doubts.

You're careless around it. You think about it the totally wrong way. You see, he wants you to fill in the same stinkies.

The four stinkies. One, two, three, four. Four more stinkies.

He only gave you the first one. Five stinky, Geshe-la. Total, I said.

One, two, three, four, five. Yeah. He mentioned the DAL MA, and then he said etc., right?

Okay. Yeah. Okay.

Okay, good. As before. Now.

Please read. Gendun... Yeah, alright.

Gendun mishepa kangshena. What's that mean? Oh, if you ask...

Yeah, what does it mean to misunderstand? What does it mean to fail to understand the Sangha? Gendun mi lekpa drukpa yinpar yi la mi chepa am.

Yeah, that... They are practicing well, okay? Lekpa drukpa means they are practicing well.

They are the people who are practicing well. Classically, the Sangha jewel is who?

[Speaker 2]
Aryas. Aryas, yeah.

[Speaker 1]
So if you don't think they're practicing well, or you decide they're not practicing well, or you act careless towards them, or you even decide that they're not practicing well, okay? Then you are not understanding the Sangha. And by the way, Vasubandhu's commentary, the structure is what, Sugeng?

The structure? Yeah. What's the structure of his whole commentary?

It's easy, it's predictable. It's a commentary on the Wheel of Life. Yes.

So what's the structure of his book? All links, each of the links. Yeah, he goes through the 12 links.

And he's very heavily weighted on which link? The first one, the misunderstanding. Which is classical for all commentaries on the Wheel of Life.

But, I have to say, he's also very heavy on the second link, which fascinates him. And I haven't seen that with other authors about the Wheel of Life. He's really interested in how you make fresh karma from non-understanding.

So we're about to get there, actually. We're almost done with the misunderstanding link, first link. And then it's going to be much faster through the rest.

Okay, let's go. All right. ,DUG BSNGAL MI SHES PA GANG ZHING LA, Translate.

How about failing to understand about the suffering? Yeah, now, I'm going to tell you something. He's leaving something out.

He's leaving three things out. If you can guess, I'll give you a hundred dollars. The other three of the four truths?

Dang. Can't you guys have some compassion and make a mistake so I don't have to think? What's wrong?

I'm sorry. No, I'm kidding. Hundred dollars, you got to collect it from my bankers, okay?

You got a choice, Xiaoping or Ellie, okay? All right. ,DUG BSNGAL MI SHES PA GANG ZHING LA, Yeah.

What does it mean when you fail to understand suffering? Yeah. As far as the higher truth, Arya truth.

,DUG BSNGAL LA DUG BSNGAL DU YI LA MI BYAS PA, ,SNGA MA BZHIN NO, He's got the first stinky and you can fill in the other four stinkies. ,DUG BSNGAL LA DUG BSNGAL DU YI LA MI BYAS PA, Well, I mean, why do you say, ,DUG BSNGAL DU YI LA MI BYAS PA? It means you don't think of suffering as suffering is your first mistake.

Ah, it's not thinking. Of suffering as suffering is your first mistake. Of suffering.

Or other stinkies. Suffering, oh, okay. Yeah.

Or you think about it wrong. You think about it carelessly. Or you think about it, you disagree, etc.

Okay? Ignoring the suffering as a suffering, okay? The same for other ones that we had, okay?

Four. Four. Four.

Four. Four. Four.

Four. Four. Four.

Four. Four. Four.

Four. Four. Four.

Four. Four. Four.

Four. Four. I will search backwards for 18 in square brackets just to make sure what the sutra was talking about.

YUL MI BYED PA DANG YUL LAS YANG DAG PAR BYUNG BA'I PHYIR MI BYED PA DANG Yeah, that was confusing. YUL MI BYED PA means what? Not understanding the causes.

Yeah, and not understanding... go backwards. It's CHOS, not understanding the things which BYUNG BA, which create, occur or come up.

Oh, come up, okay. Arise, come up. Perfectly from causes.

Oh, yeah. YUL LAS YANG DAG PAR When Vasubandhu first got to this section, he said it all relates to the SRID PA'I YANG LAG BCU NYID. In the next sentence he says, back then on that page, he said when they talk about not understanding causes, and not understanding how causes and their results flow, what the Buddha is referring to is cause and effect as expressed in the Wheel of Life.

Independent origination. Okay, good? SRID PA'I YANG LAG BCU NYID.

He's talking about the twelve links in the Wheel of Life. So, again, he's already explained all this. Vasubandhu has already covered this.

Why is he repeating himself? I think he just wants to emphasize about his only email. He covered it according to his own school.

And now he says, I'm going to cover each of the twelve again according to my school. So, what school? So, mine only?

I don't know. Because, well, what he promises here is that he will cover it according to his brother's famous book, the Yogacara Bhumi. And that Bhumi Shastra commentary is five different books.

It's huge. It's massive. It's thousands of pages.

So, he says, why don't we go see what my brother would have said about this? That's why he's explaining each section twice. We're inside the brother right now.

Yes. Exciting.

[Speaker 2]
Wow.

[Speaker 1]
By the way, when Vasubandhu explained it, this reference to cause and effect, he said it relates to how the wheel spins. Now let's see how his brother explained it. By the way, you can go read this in his brother.

I mean, we don't have time, but... Okay, here's what his brother focuses on in the same sutra section. Nice.

And you translated it pretty well. His brother, where does his brother take misunderstanding cause and effect? He doesn't say, you don't understand how each link triggers the next link.

He says, you misunderstand causation in the sense of a creator. That's a whole different take on this sutra. Two brothers who are responsible for 60% of the Geshe course, between two people 2,000 years later, they don't gloss the same sutra sentence the same way at all.

Vasubandhu says, when I say you don't understand causes, I mean you don't understand cause and effect in the wheel. And his brother says, no, no, no. To say you don't understand causes means to point to things that could never be causes and say those are causes of the world.

For example, a creator. For example, a creator. RGYUD MED PA, to say that there was no cause.

Or, here's the worst one, RGYUD MI BTON PA, to say that a completely irrelevant entity could cause anything in the world. A creator, who's not changing, created the world. That in itself is insane.

It's crazy. To create something, you got to change. That's called RGYUD MI BTON PA.

It means impossible cause. The first one was, RGYUD MED PA means the world had no cause. The second one is, oh, it's created by some dude who never changes.

Did he change when he created stuff? No. Well, how did that happen?

Did he move? No. Okay, anyway.

WANG CHUG, what's that? The big guy? WANG CHUG.

[Speaker 3]
Ishvara.

[Speaker 1]
It's what in American English we call God. Creator God. The God who created heaven and earth.

LA SOGS PA RGYUD YIN PAR To believe that he's a cause of things, or she. It's SOGS PA RGYUD YIN PAR. That's thinking the wrong way.

And Geshe Michael objects to what in the second lines again? Explain. Why did I put that correction?

Although I would never know if it was correct.

[Speaker 2]
Cause you can't talk Mayan with a saw at the end.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, you can't. Well anyway, to believe in a creator, is that an idea or is that a realization? It's an idea.

It's an idea. When you put an S on it, it means you figured out that's the truth. It doesn't belong here.

The S doesn't belong here. Somebody messed up. I don't care who it was.

The guy who dictated or some wood carver 800 years later. Somebody has done it a few times in this book. We should throw them off the roof.

That's my solution. I can't. Almost.

Anyway. Okay. Okay, good.

I think we didn't finish the last piece of that. What was that? Yeah, that's Mishepa.

Okay, good. That's what it means to not understand causes. For whom?

[Speaker 2]
For a creator.

[Speaker 1]
For Arya Asanga. For the brother, for the half-brother. Which one had a father that was royalty and which had a father that was a Brahmin?

His father was a Brahmin. Yeah, it seemed like that was the story. Asanga came first, right?

[Speaker 2]
I think King was first.

[Speaker 1]
I don't know. Asanga is the royalty. I don't remember, personally.

If I had to guess. No, I think Asanga is the royalty and then Vasubandhu is the Brahmin. I think so.

I'm going to bet that way, but it wouldn't be bad to check it. Okay. All right, let's go ahead.

RGYUD JI LTAR BAR RGYUD LAS YANG DAG PAR BYUNG BA'I PHYIR LA YANG DE BZHIN NO Oh, RGYUD JI LTAR BAR RGYUD LAS YANG DAG PAR BYUNG BA'I PHYIR I'll challenge you. What is he referring to when he says RGYUD LAS BYUNG BA'? Let's forget the YANG DAG PAR for now.

What does RGYUD LAS BYUNG BA'I mean? Past tense. BYUNG BA'.

BYUNG BA'. RGYUD LAS BYUNG BA'. The consequence after the cause?

Yeah. RGYUD LAS BYUNG BA'I PHYIR. How do you translate it?

RGYUD LAS BYUNG BA'I PHYIR. Past tense. BYUNG.

Things occurred after the cause? Yeah, the thing which came from the cause. What's that?

The result. Yeah, he's just talking about the result. Look, if you want to know what it means to misunderstand causes, it's all wrapped up with that creator god thing.

If you want to talk about how people misunderstand what came from causes, well, same thing. Same thing. That's all.

He doesn't mention the word DIM BU. He's just being coy. He says the thing that comes from the cause.

Same thing. If you think the cause showed up because of the creator, or you look at the cause and you think the creator was behind it, either way, you misunderstand causation. Got it?

Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

All right, now he's going to cover two Sutra sections. If you want to help us out, you're going to look backwards for 19. So, DGE BA MI DGE BA.

Misunderstand what? The virtuous and non-virtuous. Yeah, and what was 20?

What was 20? Kanamatoa. Yes.

Yeah, the virtuous and mislead and non-mislead. Yeah. What was the one before, DGE BA MI DGE BA?

DGE BA MI DGE BA. I think I misnumbered them here. Let's look at 20.

Oh yeah, this is 20. I think I misnumbered them. Let's talk about good deeds and bad deeds.

If you don't understand good deeds and bad deeds, or you don't understand... Now, Sugeng, as a translator, how are you going to distinguish between MI DGE BA and KANAMATOA, and DGE BA, which is KANAMATOA MED PA, for your listeners tonight, or today, or wherever it is where you are. It's two minutes, guys, just saying.

Okay. I suppose the audience here says, Sugeng, if in section 19 he talks about good deeds and bad deeds, then what's the difference between that and section 20? DGE BA MI DGE BA, we use virtues and non-virtues, whereas KANAMATOA we say mislead and lead.

That much is clear. But why did he throw in KANAMATOA and KANAMATOA MED PA? I think it's on emphasis.

By the way, right under there is the definition of KANAMATOA. Oh, yeah. That thing which wise people recommend is KANAMATOA MED PA.

And that thing which wise people say, don't go there, man. That's KANAMATOA. So it's a little bit different from DGE BA and MI DGE BA.

KANAMATOA means wise people wince when you do it. Okay, that's KANAMATOA. MI DGE BA means, God, he screwed up again.

Okay, all right, different, right? Okay, let's jump ahead to your section. How much time I got, Nick?

One minute. Yeah, we can do it. Did you jump ahead?

No, hold on. Yeah, jump to the next 19. You have to remove the closing brackets, Sugeng.

Oh, yeah, closing bracket, right, yeah. You want to search for just... That's true.

Thank you. What interesting thing happened when he got to his brother's opinion on these two separate ways to say bad things? He combined both.

He used KANAMATOA to explain. Come on, it's all the same. Whether you're talking about wise people, you're stupid, or you're just stupid.

It's the same thing. Let's treat them together. What did his brother say?

DE DAG KYANG DGE BA NI KANAMATO'A MED PA GNYIS PA'I PHYIR RO Look, his brother said DGE BA is KANAMATOA MED PA. Good deeds means things that wise people would not criticize. And then in the next sentence he says, bad deeds means things that wise people would criticize.

And that's all his brother has to say about that line from the sutra. Okay. Should I pull back the definition before here?

To maybe to... About KANAMATOA? Yeah.

About the wise people. I think you have to find a way to say it in English. By the way, there's a translation fallacy.

There's a mistaken translation method where a young translator thinks they have to find a single word for another single word. That's a fallacy. English is rife with phrases, or two-word verbs are the most powerful.

Go in, go over, go away, go around, go through, go with. English uses two-word verbs as new verbs. You see what I mean?

And if you're the kind of baby translator who says, oh, there's one syllable in the Tibetan, I need an equal syllable in English. It's maybe not there. Then you're going to come up with some scholarly word that doesn't pass the waiter test.

Got it? Okay. Big difference.

It's fun to sit with somebody SIG DANG and add different prepositions to verbs. Go away, go in, go to, go to hell, go... Like that.

I mean, go with a different preposition is a different verb. You see what I mean? Just be aware that I believe that for Karma Torah, there is no single English word that you can find.

So you asked me, Geshe-la, should we remind them that it means that the wise would criticize you? I'd say, well, find me a little phrase that says that and use it over and over again. Okay, thank you, Geshe-la.

Hi, Shinten. Where's your son? Oh my gosh, there's the real brains in the family.

This is the youngest. When your parents have a kid, all the brains come out into the kid. Did you know that?

That's why your parents can't figure out anything. Okay, thank you, Geshe-la. Monica had her first grandson last night.

She's in heaven. Okay. Thank you, Geshe-la.

Seven minutes. Yes, sir. Technically two minutes, but if now you want to...

Do you want to take the seven? We'll do the five-minute break at the end of the next one, and we'll do seven minutes now. All right.

You keep me on track pretty well. All right, see you in five or something like that.