Стэнли Чен — Книга 2: Красноречивые слова о сути океана высшего знания (Гьялцаб Чже о «Своде высшего знания» — Абхидхарма-самуччае), занятие 27

[Speaker 2]
Look at that handsome fella.

[Speaker 1]
How old were you in that picture, Stanley? I don't know myself. Nicholas, ni hao.

Ni hao, ni hao. Zheguo shi shi ma. Bi.

Zheguo shi bi. Hey, hey, did you wrestle, did you wrestle any sharks? No wrestling, no sharks, thankfully.

I think Maui was good for sharks. I think it is, actually. We swam with some giant sea turtles, which was amazing, just by chance.

[Speaker 2]
I don't know.

[Speaker 1]
I'd stay in the hotel swimming pool. Yeah, we did a lot of hotel swimming pool, too. Amelie loves snorkeling, it turns out.

Oh, good. Yeah. That's very good for kids.

Yeah, it was amazing. It was really beautiful, actually, to get her in there. And today was her first day of kindergarten, so very exciting.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, my God.

[Speaker 1]
I was in the cafe, and there was a lonely couple sitting at a table, looking like they lost their dog, and it was Anatole and Aisha. Because they didn't have Kiri around. It's like, what to do now?

They were all sad. I told them they could wash dishes, but they didn't want to. I bet they would love that.

Speaking of kindergarten, thank you for teaching us translation. Today, we have two very exciting classes. Mr. Stanley, who's going to take us through some Abhidharma, and then Mr. Mi, and we're going to work on Master Nagarjuna. So looking forward to these classes. Thank you so much. Hey, I'm going to do the homework thing.

Welcome to Abhidharma. I'll try to finish in five minutes. There's a suggestion that we all limit our homework time.

We don't extend too much and cut off the class time. So if you cannot answer, I'm not going to wait. Amen.

Yeah, OK. What is the misunderstanding about me when it's related to the first hip? Because we were talking about five hips, and there's a misunderstanding of each one.

The body, the parts of my body. Yeah, what's wrong with our body related to me? Me is not found in the parts of our body.

Too many waffles. Yeah, it's related. Basically, we were talking about the example of seeing without eyes.

And then the misunderstanding is when we use our body like one of the sense powers to see things. We thought it's me seeing as the seer. But it's really just coming together of the eye sense powers and its visual object, the pen.

And then the eye consciousness, the visual consciousness happens. So it's not me seeing. It's just the working together of the sense powers and their objects.

If that's true. Oh, there are some. Yeah, it's some Chinese reference from the Abhidharmakosha.

Basically, it's saying that all consciousness comes from the sense powers and their objects. If that's true, how can we use the same idea to apply on the letter two. Sorry, three.

Heaps of feelings, discrimination, and other factors. Like how do we misunderstand in terms of either three, the other three hips. Like when I feel bad, I say I feel bad.

I am feeling bad. Yeah, exactly. Yep.

Basically, yes. It's not you who are feeling bad. It's the heap of feeling.

Yeah. Doing their work, basically. Okay.

And anyone want to try the third hip? Yeah. Yeah.

The heap of discrimination. So what's wrong with saying I love I love it. I don't like it.

Yeah. You think you are the. In this case, we call it the name.

This heap is famous for giving names to things. Yeah. In this context, and also discriminating things.

Yeah. So it's not you who like this person or not. It's just your hip.

Their hips. Hips don't lie. Yeah, I was thinking about that song too.

In English, does it sound different when you say that hip and this hip? Yeah. Yeah, okay.

That's okay. Okay, just checking. What about the other factors?

That's difficult. The heap of other factors. What does it do mainly?

And how do we misunderstand? The cool part is this one in the last class, Geshe-la taught us that this hip is about collecting karma. It's to do things.

So this hip is the karma collector. Like all the mental functions. We talked about the faith in last class.

The mental function of faith. If you have that, you are collecting great karma. And also we talk about attachment to things, which is the opposite of good karma.

So it's not me who is the collector of karma. It's your hip. Cool.

Yeah, it's cool. It's really cool. That's amazing.

Yeah, and there are some references. And it does say that in the text. Okay, this is a secret question.

Compare it to FSD. I don't know which FSD. Yeah.

Seiji should know. Yeah. Why?

Seiji said FSD means full self-driving. Oh. It's the car which drives itself.

You want to say something? It's the car driving itself. So how do you compare this to the car driving itself?

That's nothing to do with the car driving itself. Right. So that's not.

It's different heaps of the car. Yeah, it's the sense. We can't hear what someone says in the room other than you.

Right, right. I'm going to repeat. You're lucky.

So it's like the car Tesla driving itself with FSD. It's not that there's a separate driver sitting in the car driving. But instead, it is all the major parts of the car doing their work, like the operation of the sensors, the cameras, the processes, and the accurators.

People tend to say that all the Tesla is driving itself. Just as we say, I am seeing, I am thinking, I am feeling. In reality, there's no I or the driver of the car, like behind the processes.

Yeah. Okay. So now it comes to the student translation.

Okay, can you read? Yes. Okay.

Okay, good. Okay. Yeah, the only question I have is means experiencer.

Okay. When you say it means experience. So supposedly it engages in a subject independently or something on its own.

Okay. And then you mistake it for being a self-nature because it seems to be working as an agent, as an independent agent. So we're trying to stop that misperception.

Yeah, good. What's temba? No, I just mean we present this in order to stop that wrong idea.

But what is this?

[Speaker 2]
It's teaching.

[Speaker 1]
I would say that teaching on the heap of consciousness, the fifth heap. The fifth heap, okay. The teaching on the fifth consciousness, the teaching on the fifth heap was presented in order to stop these misperceptions.

That's all. Okay. Okay, cool.

All right, next paragraph. But the rest is good. Yeah.

The second section has two parts. Okay, good. And we went and got, you know, as usual, we went...

He just says the second part has two parts. Right. And he doesn't help.

He's not very helpful. So we went and looked it up. We always look it up.

What is the second part? Right. We're going to discuss the gyusen.

Gyusen, the definition? And then going back, the reason why the categories are exactly ngepa chok gi. Oh, exactly 18.

18. Oh, okay. Yeah, so part two that he doesn't mention is why there's 18 of the categories.

Okay? It's interesting that he goes 5, 18, 12. Yeah, yeah.

And we got to talk about that. He's stubborn about that. So there must be some reason.

All the time, I think we have so far it's like that. Yeah, yeah. Five, 10, 12.

You think he should say five, then divide that, you get 12, divide that, you get 18.

[Speaker 2]
Right.

[Speaker 1]
So we're going to have a question, which is actually two syllables. And then we're going to have the answer to the question. Okay?

So he's promising a question and an answer about the exact number of the categories to a person, or categories of existence. Cool. That's why we called Stanley's first book Everything in the Universe.

Which is a great title, I have to say. Okay. All right.

Then one, oh, two more. Okay. Okay.

You want to have someone else read and check them? Yes. Anatole, please.

Yes, yeah. For now. Okay.

You want to hang here and try to, let's try to get him to translate. Okay. So dangpo means what?

Dangpo means first, right? First syllable. Chi chir.

Why? Why? Yeah, and by the way, he's quoting the root text by a sangha.

Oh, okay. The root text by a sangha says chi chir. Why?

Oh, okay. Okay? And if you don't know, you don't know.

So he's saying why did a sangha say why? Oh, oh. Chi chir means why are there, why is it 18?

Okay. Why? Do not, if you abbreviate, or if you group them, you get yuls, wangpos, and namshis.

Objects, sense powers, and consciousness. Yeah, good. Three.

So you're going to have times three, something times three. Okay. To get to the 18.

Sorry. Three times three. But then he raises that question.

He says, so obviously sense power, object, and awareness of the object, there's three. Three times six. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah. Times six should be 18. Yeah.

And then he says, but if you think about it, he says, if you really divide things up, the mik and the renawa. Eyes and ears? Ear.

There, ni, ni. I'll have two of them. They come in pairs.

Oh, that's what you mean. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So 18 is not enough. Oh, okay. He says, so you go to 18, but why don't you go to add one more, add one more.

This one or two? You should add three. You should add 21.

Okay. He says, why not go all the way and divide them? Ni, ni.

Ni, ni. Ni, ni means two each. Some of the sense organs have two orifices each.

I see. Yeh pei. That's mangwa le chok ge.

More than 18. More than 18. Yeah.

That's more than 18. So why do you say it's only corner 18? Okay.

Why do you say it's fixed at 18? Okay. Okay, cool.

That's why I don't understand. It's more than 18. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

The last part. He says you really split it out. It's more than 18.

So why did you stop at 18? Oh, okay. Also, the last line is a question, too.

Why do you... Oh, I see. Why did you stop at 18?

I see, I see. Okay. Cool.

And he has a reason, by the way. Okay. Okay, who's going to read next?

Peace. You have to do two. You have to do two.

Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Second? Yeah, what's the second point?

Okay, let's see. So the second point he's going to talk about, I believe the second point he's going on to the 12th. Oh, really?

Oh. Okay. But I think he's going 5, 18, 12, and I think his second point has to do...

And he's talking about the kei-che and the kei-cha. I believe he's talking about a justification for 12 because six of them act as kei-chas, and six of them act as kei-ches. Oh, cause and effect here?

Yeah, the objects stimulate the... Right, the awareness. Mainly the senses because they're leaving out the consciousnesses.

So here's the big deal about Abhidharma. Okay. You have six senses.

Each one has an object, a sense power, and a consciousness. Right. But when you reduce it to 12, the question that's always been in my mind is when you reduce 18 to 12, are you taking out the six consciousnesses or are you taking out the six sense powers and combining them somehow?

Okay. So objects plus... Sense powers plus consciousness.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Right. Or are you leaving out one of them? Oh, yeah.

Are you leaving out all the consciousnesses? But that doesn't cover everything anymore. That doesn't cover everything, and they're supposed to be comprehensive.

So he says the 12... I think he's onto the 12. The 12 is determined by objects which stimulate and things which are stimulated.

Okay. So stimulator would be colors, shapes, sounds. Okay.

And then key jar, that which is stimulated would be the sense organ. And we don't know what happens to the consciousness. Oh, okay.

You know? It's a mystery. Okay?

When you go to 12, you drop the sense consciousness. And he's finally going to give a good explanation of it, and I've never seen that in the Vaibhashika versions. You see what I mean?

So the mind-only version of Abhidharma goes deeper. He's already going deeper. He's like, I'm not satisfied that you reduced the 18 to 12.

What did you drop, and why did you drop it, and where did it go? And why is it still comprehensive? Okay.

So I think that's cool. Cool. So we're going to present an argument of why 12 is comprehensive.

Oh, okay. And then we're going to explain in brief why it's accurate, ngepa. 12 is accurate.

I see. It's comprehensive, even though we took out 6, and it's accurate. Comprehensive in the way that it still covers all reality.

Okay, okay, right, okay. Yeah. Okay.

Cool. Okay. That's it, Geshe-la.

And it is a good question. Your text, in the early months, it was impossible. There didn't seem to be much logic to think.

Now I think, to me, he's getting logically sane. Okay. Why?

Okay. All right. Here we go.

Back to work. Back to you. Yeah, before I start the class, I'd like to announce some good news.

This is two extremely heavy books. I didn't even know if you could pick up one. And this is Seiji Arao Takahashi's Deathless Nectar for Helping Others.

And it's complete in 700-and-something pages. So half of it's in the first volume, half of it's in the second volume. And it came back from the printer last week, I think.

Lindsay is working in her garage in 115 degrees, you know, and packing all these books. She has a full-time job. She makes more money than any of us.

And she travels all the time for her work. And on top of that, late at night, she puts on rock and roll. And I saw her in the garage.

She didn't know I was there. And she was working in the garage. And I'd like to give her a hand.

And I'd like to give Seiji a hand. Where'd he go? Yeah, where's Seiji?

I'd like to congratulate him on this book. Okay. And this would make a great Gbox program.

It would make great classes. If he could teach some extra classes about this lojong. This is the mother of all lojongs.

And it's important enough to consider a separate school, like Mind Only or Middle Way. You see? That's how we chose the translators.

We chose the 12, because lojong plus lamrim is a separate school. So this is the, I think you can say this is the best work ever finished on lojong in modern history. And we just got through praising you.

Yeah, I finished. But, and I look forward to Seiji teaching it. We had some very, we have a Gbox program.

Translators are encouraged to go out. Nick's been teaching his books a lot. Hasso was out teaching.

Adam was out teaching in Kyoto with Hasso. And you should, you really should teach it. My plan, my ultimate plan for my life isn't complete until you start teaching.

One, the first step is to translate them. But then you have to go teaching them. And if you don't teach them, then I'm, you know, I feel kind of like I didn't do what I was supposed to do.

So, okay. Mazal, Seiji, sometimes teach it somewhere. Okay.

All right. We'll give you a grant from this DCI company. You can take that copy, right?

There's a small error on the spine, but you'll figure it out. Okay. We're fixing it.

By the way, Lindsay, they can fix that with little decals. Okay. All right.

All right. Here we go. Where is that?

Hang on. Okay. Close it again.

Is it good? Oh, yeah. Is it good?

[Speaker 2]
Yes.

[Speaker 1]
Enough? Yep. Okay.

We're done.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
So, I'm going to ask you to read the, I added something here in the book.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
And this is the root text. And, you know, if we're feeling ambitious, we can try to include the root text. But I don't know if it would be strategically smart, because it's very long.

It would triple your book or something. So, anyway, that's your book. So, I'm going to ask you to read the root text for the next section.

So, this is the commentary by Gyaltsachiri. Gyaltsachiri. On Asanga.

Yeah. Jay Rinpoche's student on Asanga. But he doesn't quote the original text.

So, I inserted it. Oh, I see. So, here we go.

Who's going to read? Seiji. Seiji.

Oh. Since we missed you. He did something.

Yeah. That's the Mexican. Yeah.

But I can't turn this. So, it'll be okay.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
Okay. Good. Keep going.

Good. So, in his own text, Asanga. That's the question.

And here you see a very ancient form of the word 18th. Okay, it should be chu-ni, right? Ten, eight.

But this is an ancient, ancient form. And it got corrupted to chopke. We don't say chu-ji-chu, we say chopke.

So this is the very, very, like 2,000 years old. You won't see it, almost. You never saw it in the last 10 years that we've been having these classes.

Yeah. Yes. So how do you pronounce this one, cha-ge, or chop-ge, or what?

Chop-ge. I don't think you'll get criticized if you say chop-ge. But I've never heard people say it.

I think people... Good question. But they do pronounce the prefix chop-ge, which is unusual.

So I think this is divided into two categories. Okay. Shina asks, why are there kams chop-ge?

18. Why are there 18 categories? And then he gives a very intriguing answer.

Okay. It basically says there's the body and there's what it holds. There's the body and what it holds onto.

And let's only consider that which is past and that which is present in six different doorways. Let's consider only two things, past and present, for six doorways. Total?

18. 12. 12.

Oh, yeah. Sorry. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Okay. So let's go. We'll keep going.

Okay. Who's going to read next, then? Lindsay, please.

Midnight rock and roll. I assume it was rock and roll. She had the earphones on.

[Speaker 2]
It will remain a secret. Oh, okay.

[Speaker 1]
Chop-ge. Here's like only six entries on. Chop-ge.

Chop-ge. Chop-ge. Okay.

Okay, nice. Why are the kalms fixed at Chop-ge? At 18.

Yeah, why are the categories fixed at 18? Well, start with the yul druk. The six objects of the senses, okay?

Things to see, hear, smell, taste, touch, like that. Your nung chupay. Then those things which you experience can be considered depa or tatarwa.

The objects of your senses can be considered depa or tatarwa.

[Speaker 2]
Past or present.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, past or present. Like when you're looking at the microphone, it's possible the microphone is a millisecond behind, or it's possible in some way it's somehow in the present moment. But definitely we can...

Not see the future. Yeah, we can say, let's not include the future microphone, because that's too theoretical. So let's deal with stuff that just went by, or stuff that's there now.

Those we can divide into the six objects of the senses, okay? And that's going to be important when we get to the 12. Depa, nyerwar chupa.

We enjoy them, we experience them. And who does the experiencing of the six objects? The nung chep druk.

Yeah, the six consciousnesses, yeah. And lu dang yong su suwa nyi kyi ne kyi go ne dzinpa la. If you talk about their position on the body, and yong su suwa, how they capture objects, okay?

Nyi kyi ne kyi go ne dzinpa. If you kind of focus on the physical location of the senses, you can say six senses. You know, you can point here and say one, you can point here and say two, you can point here and say three.

So I think you don't have to say there's mung, then six. Yeah, you don't have to say there's seven because you have two eyeballs or something. Okay?

What's the agyemang? Because they have a... They are, they are of their location on the body.

Okay. And because of, you can operate with a single eye. Oh.

You know, one eye can perceive objects. One ear can perceive sounds. I see.

Okay. So as far as position on the body, you could have a, you could lose an eye and still see. I see.

Okay. And your ears could still hear. Okay.

Okay. With a single ear. And so kind of from, from a physical standpoint, let's say there's six.

I think we don't need mung, nyi go. Yeah, we don't really need to say there's seven or eight because most people have two working ears or something like that. Right.

Okay. I think six is enough. As far as perceiving things and as far as location, general location on the body, we can say six.

Okay. Okay. And if you said nyu, then six.

Can I ask this? Yeah. I mean, nyu, you wouldn't capture all the possible sensations.

Okay. If you said, let's ignore your nose, you know, then smell would get locked up. Smells weird.

So he says, you know, you can work with six and, but I wouldn't go, you don't need to go more, but I wouldn't go less either because then you wouldn't smell anything. Okay. Okay.

So he says, six is okay. Six times three is okay. Eighteen.

Okay. Eighteen datus, eighteen categories. Okay.

Who's going to read next? The handsome guy with the blue tie. Wow.

He's a handsome guy. Yeah. The same argument.

I think they go to, if you're talking about how we perceive things, right? dzinpa la sok, dzinpa means your physical, yeah, your physical holding of forms. You don't need more than six.

As far as what you hold onto, there's not, you don't need more than six. As far as the different kinds of objects. Yeah.

And in this, there's two ways to translate sok, rupa, and how do you have to translate it here? I'll give you the two choices, then that's the answer, right? Physical form or visual form.

Visual. Here it means, so rupa, form, can mean visual form, or it can mean all physical stuff. It can mean either one, but when you're talking about the sense organs, it has to be, you have to translate it into English as visible form.

When you're talking about the five heaps, you've got to translate it as physical form, as opposed to the four non-physical heaps. Right. You see, okay?

dzinpa sok duk le mang mi guh. So when you're talking about objects of sense perception, you don't need more than six. Mang mi guh.

And nyun na min du. Yeah, less than six is also not. Less wouldn't cover it.

Right. Yeah, less than six wouldn't cover it. nyer chuh rang gi tsen ne kyi drukpa na.

Nyer chuh means things to be perceived. Nyer chuh rang gi tsen ne kyi drukpa na. Things to be perceived.

Do they exist by definition in this school? Are they real? Are they real?

Smells, sights. In my own view. Yeah, so I'm not sure.

Okay, okay. They exist. They do exist.

They do exist. They're real. They're real.

When you smell something, you hear something that's real. Okay? So if you're dealing with the real, So, if you're dealing with real sense objects, what's the sense object that's disqualified when you say real in the Abhidharma system?

Sound? Outside? That's a good guess.

Outside sense objects? Imaginary colors and shit. And the example is in a dream, for example.

You see purple, but it's not real. Okay? So, he says here, Ranggit-sengyi drupa, real colors, not the ones you see in a dream or something like that.

To perceive those real colors, you don't need more than true consciousnesses. If you add mental colors, like in a dream, then it gets complicated. Then you're going to need extra sense organs or something.

Right? And then, nyung na, if we had less objects, if you only had five objects, min du, it wouldn't cover human experience. It wouldn't cover non-dreaming human experience.

Okay? So, it has to be six. Okay?

Good? It's the thing you see when you're high by drugs, are they considered? They are considered mental and...

Oh, it's real or not? In this case? No.

Not real? In fact, in this school, remembered colors wouldn't be real. In Abhidharma school?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Oh, okay. But also colors in a dream are not real. Okay.

Okay. Keep going. Who's going to read?

Aisha, please.

[Speaker 2]
It's okay.

[Speaker 1]
So, now I want to go back to the root text, okay? In the bold. All right?

He said... Here, see? He said, de pa dang pa tar.

So he went back to the root text and he didn't tell you he went back to the root text. So who's the root text? Arya Sangha.

Arya Sangha. He mentions in his root text at this point, de pa and tar tar. The experience of the past and the experience of the present, nyerwar chokpa, objects, experiencing objects, colors, shapes, sounds in the past and the present, okay?

He talks about it. Then this is what Aisha read. He said, de pa sung dzinpa.

In the case of the past, we are dzinpa, present tense, holding, sung, that which was held. Okay.

[Speaker 2]
Holding that which was held.

[Speaker 1]
We are holding that which was held. Like, I don't know. Oftentimes, you can say that the sense powers are a millisecond behind.

By the time you're aware of a color, that particular color is gone. So when you talk about past, perceiving past colors, you're talking about holding something which was held. He's being cute.

The past means holding something which was held. Okay. And the tar tar wa is talking about, in the act of shimba, can mean present participle, ing in English, holding to a color in the present moment, okay?

So he says, when we're dealing with sense perception, let's talk about things that were just there, or let's talk about things that are there, okay? Therefore, the root text says, de tar tar, past and present, she mu kyi. And this is the disjunctive kyi, means what?

It's not possessive, it's not apostrophe S, it's but. So sometimes at the end of a sentence, kyi means but. But, okay, you can hold the past, you can hold the present.

Kyi, but, maomba, semba, nyepa me. Nyepa me means it's too theoretical to deal with. It might happen, it might not happen.

You know, the Abhidharma guys don't want to include it because it's too possible that it will never happen. You see what I mean? So they call it, ma nyepa, means it's not concrete enough.

Something you might see tomorrow, like your paycheck go up, it's not concrete enough to talk about. Okay, ma nyepa. Therefore, pe ma ma.

We don't mention it, we don't talk about it. We don't talk about future sense objects, because they might happen, they might not happen. They might blow up the world.

We don't. Okay. All right.

Okay. Who's next, Danny? Edmund, you want to try?

Yay, Edmund. Nice to have you guys here. It's really nice to have you guys here.

It's really helping the Peachtree sales. And the gas station, the whole department. They're working really hard.

They're working till midnight getting Dragon's Head ready for classes. Thank you very much. Thank you for coming.

Ma nyep. Chu. So po ni.

You're correcting. ye pe ram chir nam se pa sum ki nem pa ya kyu pe nin pa sob te nyer che means experiencer if it has an o, it's the agent, experiencer tso o means, you know lam sum nam sum? pre, principal, past yeah, so tso o means main the main experiencer in the universe is tso o feelings, either mental or physical feeling feels good, feels bad ok nam min dang yu kyi long chu nyeru che chu nyeru che pe che ram it experiences things through nam min yeah, karmic ripening ok, like things come to you me and Robin had a pleasant couple hours each in the dental chair and that's a nam min, that's a karmic result of hurting somebody in the past so that ripening comes but you could also say you have a long chu, you have an experience of the object you can say the pain ripened on me in the dental chair or you can say he stuck that needle in and I felt it you see what I mean? You can say it either way long chu nyeru che ching and then I nyong war I had an experience he stuck his needle in or from the inside my past karma decided to do something and then I nyong war, then I experienced it then he says sepa sum say sepa sum so if you go to Sugeng's text which is the great benefit of having 12 translators you are covering all major schools and you don't appreciate it but sepa is which link?

eight yeah, good, gyepa sepa gyepa sepa, chupa sepa so sometimes it's called initial desire or something like that desire is starting, sepa and there's three classic examples in the Abhidharma when you talk about the eighth link there's three classic examples he mentions them here, he doesn't list them so I'll list them for you I put it here at the end here okay and it's going to be a footnote or something there's three kinds of strong desire sorry, beginning desire and then strong desire and these are very fascinating to me because link number 10 is when your karma ripens yeah, link number 10 is when it gets ripened it's coming out of the ground okay and then link number 2 is when you put the seed in the ground link number 2 is when you put the seed in the ground link number 10 is when the first sprout starts to come up so a woman getting birth like that that's 10 something this is monkeys grabbing stuff and stuff like that guys drinking their pee so anyway the point is that the desire which triggers karma the desire which causes karma to open has two versions one is early desire when you first plant it and then there's an advanced desire and I think it's fascinating that what ripens desire what causes the desire to be strong enough to open a karma is misunderstanding the seed that's amazing that's amazing to me if you misunderstand a watermelon seed it will ripen faster that's like weird you know so anyway that misunderstanding technically has three divisions and he mentions it here so I thought I'd it's in the bold do you want to read the bold print? yeah and these are three classic I mean someone could write a graduate paper about it but you know it's certainly a deeper topic there's certainly something deep going on here when they talk about the three types of the eighth link the eighth link which means craving craving something has three different types one's called sepa su means the three categories of sepa the first one is called du se and it means all craving in the desire realm the craving of all beings in the desire realm is the first kind of craving okay then si se and si se means see sepa is a difficult word because it means sansara so people have mistranslated it or didn't understand it when you talk about desire in the upper two realms which is mainly superhero desire it's Superman and Spiderman you know it's whenever you say higher two realms in your mind you have to think superheroes you have to think these impossibly handsome little guys who die and go to hell you know alright but all desire of superheroes is the second type of sepa it's called si se which means craving for their life because they have more to crave Brad Pitt has more to crave than Gershwin Michael you see what I mean okay so that's called si se so first is du se craving in the desire realm second is si se craving for your existence as a superhero and these guys play marbles with planets you know they're not like Spiderman really they play games with planets okay si se and then there's a very interesting third sepa called jik se and this is the specific terror that a person feels at a specific moment in their death and they think now I'm falling apart and we've all been through it countless times we can relate when I talk about it you can relate because on one level you remember that there was a feeling in all your past lives at the very end that you're falling apart and you won't be there in five minutes and there's a special fear and a special craving that comes from really reaching the end you're like the doctor he died you hear the doctor and you're like oh my god I won't be here in two minutes and that special fear has a separate name in buddhism it's like si se jik se I'm being destroyed I'm losing me and we all go through it and that's why people fear death so much I think, that's one reason because it's terrible, it's a terrible feeling can I say it's like it's a fear of losing or you don't want to lose it and you crave for it I think you could write a whole essay about it, it's a whole interesting thing technically it's defined as the emotion that I'm disappearing oh okay it's a complicated emotion it's very interesting and we've all been through it many times and that's why we're so afraid to die okay so anyway so I just gave you the three kinds okay, he just mentions them in passing sepa sum kyi nyenwar chok jar gyur pe basically these are the things that the three kinds of craving feed on objects in the lower realm objects in the upper realm and that special object called I'm still here okay alright that spreads out in all three realms yeah it does apparently it's even stronger in the higher realms oh okay because they haven't had any challenge to their health yet okay we got one more sentence good question why do we suddenly jump to feeling? because we were talking about like objects yeah he's talking about the objects of experience oh and then that's called nirchat and then he says the main object of experience is feeling and in fact to distinguish between the feeler and the feelings is one of the most difficult things in scripture in buddhist scripture to distinguish between the instrument of feeling and the object of that instrument is very difficult it's really really difficult I feel good, who is I? you see I mean it's very difficult I feel good, your feelings feel good you see what I mean it's very difficult to separate your feelings from I that's a whole that would be a whole interesting graduate thesis he says nirchat soni the main experiencer of the world is sarva, it's feelings okay feelings are experiencer in this case? in this case it is but it's ambiguous it's a difficult word in english it's difficult are feelings the object or are feelings the subject?

I feel good anyway sarva, we say I we relate so much to feelings that we call them I I feel good you don't feel good, your nerve endings feel good okay either we are experiencing a karmic ripening as a feeling or we are experiencing the object of one of our senses as the object that we are feeling nyongwa means you undergo your experience, and it's a very difficult word it's a very very difficult idea you experience your experiences or something like that, so nyongwa is very difficult, sometimes nyongwa is the definition of sarva experience is the definition of feeling oh the experience

[Speaker 2]
yeah

[Speaker 1]
it's very delicate and then he says you could say you live in the three kinds of craving okay that we just talked about and that's what you experience so he's trying to distinguish between experiencer and what they experience oh yeah, it's confusing and the experienced things he's kind of favoring this idea that they tend towards past or present and not future so you can worry about your future right, but when he's talking about experience objects of experience he says in Abhidharma we mostly stick to past and present objects because the future is so undefined, it may never happen, the thing you're afraid to feel in tomorrow may never come, yet we still worry we don't yeah we can go on, I think we have a few minutes we need a fast reader Rob Rob Rob Amory Amory Amory No you're tell them Yeah, nice reading, nice reading.

Ro Troi Ningpo, taste has no essence of being delicious, tro, okay, taste, what you taste has no essence, chung se may kyang, but it does seem like that, okay, nangwa nyi, when something tastes a certain way to you, that's a feeling. He uses the word for taste. To describe how feeling feels its feelings, feeling tastes feelings.

You can say undergo, experience, and we say experience our taste, okay, he says there's nothing there to taste in the core, in the core of things that you experience, there is no taste, but you think you're feeling good or feel bad. There's no good or bad at the core, but the feeling is good or bad, you feel good or you feel bad, but there's no core. The core of the object?

Of the object of the experience. The experience, okay. Taste, he calls taste, but that's rasa in Sanskrit, which has many, many connotations.

How do you taste your life? How do you feel about your life? Okay, nangwa nyi tsultrim, then he uses the word sarwa in the sense of category, which is very difficult.

It's unusual. He's kind of, we've only had it a few times, but he says there's three fundamental types of feeling, right? I feel good, I feel bad, I feel mean, okay, and then you can divide those into five by dividing the good and bad into physical and mental.

Neutral is so neutral, they don't count it, they don't divide it. Okay, thank you. Okay.

All right. According to the object you're experiencing, you can say that the six consciousnesses are experiencing their object. So, nyer chu means to enjoy their object, to undergo their object, but he's saying it's difficult to divide that from feeling.

You know, did you see a white color on the wall? Yeah, but it's hard to separate that from feeling about the white color. Wow.

The experience of white and feeling white is difficult, very close, hard to distinguish between each other. I want to go one more sentence. Yeah, I was going to request, actually.

He slips into mind only for a sentence. Okay, okay. We might as well go with him.

Cool. So, who's going to read? You want to semantically do it?

Yeah, so you see, in the mind only school, you have eight consciousnesses. Right. You have the six sense consciousnesses.

Then you have messed up consciousness. And then you have foundation consciousness. And then the sangha steps to the side and he says, I wonder if we could talk about feeling as far as foundation consciousness, because we've been focusing on the six sense consciousnesses, which are accepted by all schools.

But he says, what if we look at feeling, does your refrigerator have feeling? Does the storehouse of your karmas have feeling? And he's kind of just, what do you call it?

He's musing. In English, he's like, hmm, I wonder if your foundation consciousness has feeling. Okay, so he goes there.

And I think it's sexy. He says, kun shi kor na, in the realm of your eighth consciousness, which is your refrigerator consciousness, sor wa yu, there is a sensation. They do have sensations.

In your refrigerator consciousness, where all your karmas are stored, there is feeling going on. But we don't call it nirchu. We don't call it an experience of the world.

Do you have feeling going on in your deep down seed-storing consciousness? Yes, but we don't call it perception of the world. We don't call it a perception of the world.

We don't say you are nirchu. We don't say you are experiencing the world, but you have feeling. There is feeling going on, but we don't call it a perception of the world.

Okay, then we're hoping he's going to clarify. Right, please. Then he says, kor na means in the realm of foundation consciousness, in the refrigerator consciousness, you only have sor wa dang nyong, neutral feeling.

Does kun shi have feeling? Yes, but not good and not bad. It is so primitive that it can only feel neutral.

But feeling neutral is a feeling. You know, do you feel good or do you feel bad? I feel kind of...

Yeah, well, that's a feeling. That is a feeling. You're not dead.

You're feeling neutral. That's a feeling. He says that's the kind of feeling that kun shi has.

Your storehouse consciousness does feel things, but only as, hmm, that's okay. You know, it doesn't feel good and it doesn't feel bad. Okay.

We usually say that this consciousness is aware of things. Yeah, so it has to have some kind of feeling, probably. Because of that.

And that has to be neutral. And then he says, and then we can finish and I'll sit down. And moreover, that dang nyong feeling.

That neutral feeling. It's misawa. It's unclear.

You say, how do you feel? I don't know. Kind of in the medium, in the middle.

Not only is it neutral, it's vague. It's unclear. But he insists that storehouse consciousness feels...

Well, nothing more than... Neutral. Nothing.

No good, no bad. Nai mei means nothing more than in-between feeling. Sometimes I call it in-between feeling.

Okay. Does your kun shi have feeling? Yes.

What kind? Nothing more than medium feeling. And that's vague.

That's all. Is there a connection for also good and bad? Say again?

Is neutral the foundation for also good and bad? This word neutral has three or four classic different meanings. Wow.

It can mean karmically neutral. But here it means neutral between good and bad feeling. Okay.

But it can also mean equanimity in the sense of the four immeasurables. So the same word can have three totally different meanings. And here it means you feel balanced.

You don't feel good. You don't feel bad. But you do have feeling.

You are aware of feeling. It's just neutral. How you feel when you're waiting for someone to show up in your car or something.

One last question. Does this talk about a seventh consciousness? Having feelings.

Yeah, he does in the next sentence. Can we... He goes to nyu nyi.

Yeah, yeah. You can translate that for next time. Okay, okay, okay.

And so can you translate the next four sections? Four, okay. Yeah, and it is his next question.

Okay, oh, cool. Do you have feeling in messed up consciousness? That's number eight.

I bet it does. Number seven. He's going to answer.

But he doesn't answer it in one sentence. Okay, I'm going to eat feeling. Carrots.

Why they put carrots in? My only chance to eat something illegal before long time. Angela.

I'm going to stop the sharing. Oh, sorry. Stop this one.

Okay. Okay, how do you feel? Okay, so we just finished a very interesting class of Abhidharma.

Somebody said they feel confused. Yeah, I can totally relate. We have about six minutes before the exciting world news.

To talk about how we can apply this in our real life. Basically, in this class, to give you a one minute wrap up. If I remember, we talked about, oh, yeah, we are talking mainly talking about why the 18 categories are set with the number of 18.

Why cannot, why can it not be more or less? And we break it down into three groups. We talk about why the sense powers should be no more or less than six.

And we talk about the objects should also no more and less than six. We didn't talk about the awareness of six yet, I think. But and then the last section of this class, we would draw into this feeling or experience of life thing.

Which is very confusing and interesting. And I hope we can learn more about it in the next class. But we learned that this is a real mind only class text, because we start to talk about my only concept, like the foundation conscious, related to the 18 categories.

I think it's the first time we kind of combine this concept together, the 18s and the my only foundation consciousness, the refrigerator. So what do you feel? How can we use it in our life to solve problems or make dreams come true?

Any thought? OK, and then, please, you can come here. Yeah, yeah.

Thank you. Thank you. I'm kind of thinking the topic we discussed, it says there's only past and present.

Right. I'm thinking of that because the day before we watched the sketch, guys in the check-in set, our team was talking about, actually, we're watching the star from many, many thousand years ago.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Actually, we are walking far in the past. But to me, after I hear this, I'm thinking, is there any, according to this concept, is there any present moment? Because as long as we sense anything, it's a millisecond away.

So I'm kind of thinking that how we treat some, for example, if we see something back, even we yell back to the husband who yelled at me, then actually I cannot do anything at all. Because when I yell back, the husband that created my negative emotion has already gone. Yeah.

So in this case, I'm kind of thinking of when it's kind of very good for us to deal with, especially when I'm having, for example, a difficult situation. It's like yelling at the shooting star.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
It's kind of, if you explain it for a longer, longer, for example, when you're watching the stars. But in theory, it's exactly the same. Right.

Yeah. Even now we're talking, you're listening to me, the past me talking. Yeah.

Yeah. That's also cool. Thank you.

Yeah. It's brilliant. Yeah.

In the class, Geshe-la mentioned that there are the present and past objects. But after he explained, I wonder if we ever have a present object. Every time we experience, those objects could be gone already.

Yeah. So that's a good thing we can think about. And it will change how we react to things.

If we think about the past and present. Like Edmond mentioned. Anyone else have anything?

Anything now? Anything in the past? Okay.

The rocker.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
I was just thinking about how you're talking about how it's difficult to separate I from your feelings and how much of our lives and our worlds are our feelings. But when you ask people, you know, what are your goals? What are you working on?

Most people will say something about their career, about their relationships. We don't always realize how important the feelings and that kind of subjective experience of things are. But once you realize that you can start to work on that level and plant seeds, not just for money.

All that stuff's nice. It's great. I'm also planting seeds for money.

But you can also deliberately plant seeds to have inner calm or to be happy or to not be jealous. You can deliberately plant the seeds for that. And that can be very, very beautiful and helpful, too.

Cool. Thank you. I'm going to wrap up by quoting a TikTok video I saw today.

There's an MIT math professor who's a Chinese, actually. It will come. He's saying that in the future of the AI world, one of the great capacity if you want to get a good job is that you make other people feel like they want to work with you.

Because if they don't feel like to work with you, they can use us, AI, to do the job. And the main reason they have you there is they feel good that you are there and you are inspiring. You create these good feelings or emotional value for them because that's not what AI can do, right?

So it's a refreshing point of view about future jobs that make me think. Somehow it's related to the class today. Cool.

Now I hope you can make us feel good. I hope so. Okay, your time.

That's a skillful way to... Yeah, anyways. I don't know.

I don't know. It's difficult for me, too. Anyways.

Well, you're leaving, but I find it very interesting this thing about dreams and about desire being attached to misunderstanding. That really hit me because I worry about a lot of things, but then all my worries are not connected with real causes. So it's interesting.

And this thing about this really true that your senses can create a whole world when you're dreaming. And you can touch and see things and the things function. Sometimes in the dreams is also interesting that things don't function as they usually function in awakened state.

So it's really interesting how there is some level of reality in dreams. It's really interesting. So I think it's a lot of potential to use your book for exciting things.

Okay, I'm going to share what's going on. Many things happening. Some of them serving as reminders.

Ah, I'm supposed to share my own screen. Sorry. Okay.

Okay. Here? Okay.

All right. Thanks. This one?

Yeah. Okay. Wonderful.

Okay. The next big event happening that I'm aware of. Well, actually it's the Sedona College of International Management starting on August the 20th.

That's in two days from now. And we wish them the best. After that, the one that I know about is this one is The Heart of a Yogi, Bhagavad Gita.

Errol keeps having his weddings. I bet he'll come and be very happy. It's going to be exciting to have them here and fun as well.

And for those of you who want to hear more about what's going on with it, Benji had a session last week about the connection between the Bhagavad Gita and Lady Niguma practice and some of the content that we're going to be studying for the Bhagavad Gita too. You can watch the recording there. I missed it.

But I really was interested to see what it's going to be about. I haven't watched it. I will watch it.

But you can watch it as well and see what's going on. Maybe it motivates you to either come live, why not? Make a trip to beautiful Sedona or watch from your home online.

And then I just heard today from another event that YSI is organizing, but this one is happening in Thailand. It's an offline event that Vivian is producing. It's going to be, you know, she's taking Connie, La and Errol as well with her.

This is happening on October 18th to the 27th. And then next Monday or Tuesday, if you're in Asia, we will have Vivian talking more about it. But it's exciting also if you happen to be interested in go deeper in your practice, you're in Asia or you want to go there.

This is a good option for you. Going back to September, on the 15th of September, DSU is starting their second academic session for the new generation they are training. And this time is going to happen in Dragon's Head.

You can still sign up. That's the last thing I hear. I hope when it is all closed, you guys let me know when I can stop advertising people to sign up.

But for now you can. And the great opportunity I have had to be in some of the classes. Amazing.

Really, really cool. Very deep and very practical. The combination of both worlds happened there.

The East and the West, modern and tradition. Ancient happens there. It's really, really worth it to check it out.

Even if you have the chance to just go to a few of their sessions, don't miss the chance. If you can sign up, even better. After that, or in kind of like in a mix calendar, but starting on September 26, Sedona College is having their training, step training on level one.

This is a way that you can extend the training over the length of a month and keep doing other activities while you get trained. I hope the same when whenever, if at some point the spaces are full, I hope I get to know. But for now, as far as I understand, people can still sign up.

Good. After that, after that event, about the same dates, when you're finished with that, there is going to be the five houses happening in Phoenix, October 24 to 28. That's also a very cool event.

A lot of people I know are coming from all over the world and it's going to be fun to be in Phoenix. Let's see how the city vibes treat us. Other news we have, you know, in September, a little before that in September, the spiritual connection with nature.

Chilan, I met him many years ago. I met him in Tucson. He's a great Chinese, traditional Chinese medicine practitioner along many other things.

He's a good friend of Dr. Ward Smith. They're both going to have this spiritual connection with nature and along after that, kind of along with the same flow, it's going to be the Mexican drinking agave bat reforestation program, which today Pachi is going to share with us a little bit before we move on to more exciting events happening in Diamond Mountain. So what I would like to request is tech table.

Can you help me to do a spotlight for Pachi? Thank you so much. Pachi.

[Speaker 2]
Hi Juan, how are you?

[Speaker 1]
What's going on? I'm doing well. Thank God.

How are you? We're doing OK here in Mexico. It looks great.

Thank you for all the work and production of the just last event we had. It was very fun. Thank you for inviting me and welcoming me.

So what are you now? What's going on? What are you planning to do?

Are you coming to Phoenix and then you stay and you go to Diamond Mountain? What's the plan? Well, we have the new volunteer opportunity coming.

It's going to be at Diamond Mountain. Sky Harvest is co-producing an event where we can learn how to protect, how to restore an ecological and a fragile environment like ours. We will have, it's going to be six days.

We have free lodging. We have free meals. And anyone who has come in the past can talk about the great meals we are having over there.

So, but the name of this event is called Creatures of the Night. The image is a little bit spooky. I know.

But this is, this is, you know, this is just an excuse. The idea is that, you know, 41% of the land, our surface in this world is arid or semi-arid. So if we claim to, if we want to be kind people, we need to learn how to take care of it.

You know, it's very fragile. It's not the same as here where it rains a lot and whatever damage you produce here, it doesn't matter. Two weeks afterwards, we'll have everything lushy again.

When you do something, when you're taking care of arid land, deserts, any impacts you make, it tends to use lots of time to come back. So this is just an excuse to get together, to enjoy Diamond Mountain out of retreat, have fun and learn how all these techniques and how to take care of, you know, how the ecosystem works to protect biodiversity. You know, basically, if you're interested in combating climate change or things like this, this is a great opportunity.

Okay. And you were saying like, let's say if I ask, why should anybody go? What would you say?

That's a good question. I would say, since I am a very recent father, anyone who has younger siblings or younger family members, we should all learn how to take care of this planet. So, but anyways, that's my line.

But the idea is if you're young or if you are very experienced, you should all come. Anyone who is interested in learning how to protect biodiversity should be involved. And you got what?

Sorry, no, no, no. The real last question I would like to ask is, just to have it clear, if you volunteer, do you have to pay for any expenses or everything is covered? It's free.

It's free lodging. It's free meals during six days. Okay.

So if for whatever reason, I don't have money, enough money to pay for my rent next year, next month, can I just go there? And I'll be covered, right? It's a very interesting.

You never know. Yeah, why not? It's a good excuse.

Things are getting intense. All right. Thank you so much, Pachi.

I will consider the offer. We hope to be talking with you soon again. We want to talk about some other very cool events happening in Diamond Mountain.

For that is our next segment. Hmm. It's next picture.

Oh, well, this is your picture. And then, well, you'll see where is the connection in a few more moments. But in October, this is at the end of September.

And in the middle of October, we're going to be having this innovation retreat at Diamond Mountain. You know, this project, what can I say? Director, Stanley, director.

He's producing these events. And today we have. So I just would like to welcome Johnny and Manling because they're going to talk about their experience on innovation retreats.

For that also, I will request the tech table to spotlight to Johnny and Manling. Hi, everyone. It's such a pleasant feeling that I got to be here introduce you my beloved Diamond Mountain.

[Speaker 2]
So during my learning and innovation retreat, I can share with you. There's something that totally changed my life. The first one, creation, awareness.

[Speaker 1]
And because of the application of what I learned during innovation retreat, I experienced a six times growth of my business.

[Speaker 2]
Me as a business owner, I face different business decisions every single day. But during this innovation retreat, I foresee the danger of my wrong decision making.

[Speaker 1]
But because of the process, what I learned in IR, I understand that how can I change the mistakes? And then I actually get through this crisis period and make it a safe lane to keep my company safe. So I realized that it really helps you a lot, even if you are not a business owner.

You can be a parent, you can be a student, or you just be a partner.

[Speaker 2]
Every single person on the planet, you are facing different decisions every single day. With innovation retreat, it's gonna equip you with very good techniques that can help you to make good decisions every day. And also in Diamond Mountain, I found my mission and passion.

Once I lost in the past, I remember I set up my goal, that is my dream when I first joined in DSEU, but I forgot about it. Then I pick it up this year during my innovation retreat.

[Speaker 1]
And now my new product is going to roll out. So with this finding back of my passion and what I'm going to do with my career and business, I feel my new life is going on again.

[Speaker 2]
So during that retreat in Diamond Mountain, all these magical things happening in my life across different areas. And the results are so fruitful.

[Speaker 1]
I'm so excited and expected to see all the beautiful things happen.

[Speaker 2]
So me and my husband, the two of us, we immerse ourselves totally in all its learnings, be it innovation retreat and DSEU and CSP, everything we learned a lot from teacher Stanley. And my husband, Johnny, when he came out from innovation retreat, he told me, now I realize I see my very deep attachment that I used to think that this is mine and that is you.

[Speaker 1]
You shouldn't put your things in my area, this and that. Now I finally see that part of me.

[Speaker 2]
So during this innovation retreat, we see us and we see each other. And then we can, from there, go deeper into our communication. Hi, everyone.

[Speaker 1]
My name is Johnny.

[Speaker 2]
Thank you. And thank you for my wife for this nice, sweet introduction. So of course, I want to first of all appreciate and be grateful to Geshe-la and teacher Stanley.

I went to, I joined innovation retreat in Dunhuang. And during that retreat, I saw my personal dream, my goal, and that future me. Because of Geshe-la's correct guidance, along with teacher Stanley and Xiaoping's teachings, the whole process is very pleasurable and deep.

So that makes me a student that can fully understand the teachings incorporated into myself. Now I have been put all of those teachings into practice. So I really look forward to this upcoming retreat in October.

Because it is something rare that you can find such a wife and Arya Geshe-la to lead us into personally in the retreat. This doesn't happen every day. As Geshe-la said, you should at least come once in your life, see Diamond Mountain, experience it firsthand.

You see the sky in Diamond Mountain, then you can really elevate your ability to do concentration and meditation. You experience the feeling of your mind flying in the sky. So that also helps us as a couple.

Yeah, so last year I went Diamond Mountain myself, but this year we're going to go as a couple. Thank you.

[Speaker 1]
Yes, that's great. Come, I hope you enjoy it a lot. Thank you so much for sharing with all of us your experience.

It has been great seeing you in Japan, and then it's going to be great seeing you in Arizona as well. So thank you so much for having come today and share with all of us. I think you're going to have a very, very good time.

Now it's time for our next class with Geshe Michael and Niklas Shaw. See you next time. All right.

Thank you so much, everybody. Thank you, Juan. Thank you, Johnny and everybody.

And yeah.