Медитации на пустоту: объяснение шагов к пониманию того, что ничто не является самим собой, занятие 6

[Speaker 1]
Okay, you ready? Do you want to read or are you into it?

[Speaker 2]
Okay. Good. Good.

Good, okay.

[Speaker 1]
DOR NA means, to summarize, or in brief, it includes the word DO, which means sutra. The Tibetans chose to translate the word sutra as a short book, DO. But DO also means a crossroads, a place where the two roads cross.

So, LAM DO. THEG PA GSUM means, all three tracks, like listener, self-made Buddha, and bodhisattva. So it doesn't refer to tantra sutra and open sutra.

GSUM DKA' What's the difference between GSUM DKA' and GSUM PA? Yeah, all three paths. Here's a use of it.

It's the first column, DKA'. GSUM DKA' Then he mentions two of the five paths, so be careful. This is two split into two.

So it's MTHONG LAM and BSGOM LAM. MTHONG LAM and BSGOM LAM. Each of those has two parts, so you got to reflect that in your translation.

They both have a BAR MCHED MED LAM and a MNAM DU LAM within the LAM. So, BAR MCHED MED LAM is a sub-LAM of MTHONG LAM, and BAR MCHED MED LAM is a sub-LAM of BSGOM LAM. So both MTHONG LAM and BSGOM LAM divide into BAR MCHED MED LAMs and MNAM DU LAMs. BAR MCHED MED LAM means uninterrupted path. BAR MCHED means interruption. It was a constant thing with Kim Rinpoche. Everyone's BAR MCHED me.

I'm trying to watch this show and people keep bugging me. Then if someone really interrupted him a lot, he would call them BAR MCHED MED LAM. So anyway, that's how I learned Tibetan.

Obviously BAR is the BAR in BAR DO, for example. BAR DO meaning in between. BAR MCHED means cut in between, meaning interruption.

So that refers to the period when you're in the direct perception of emptiness. It's called uninterrupted path. Meaning it is not interrupted by any other perception other than that of ultimate reality.

You can't take a break and come out and brush your teeth and go back in. It's a continuous flow from beginning to end. You never perceive any conventional object in between.

Then NAM DU LAM is path of freedom or something. That refers to the period when you're perceiving the sixteen aspects of the fortress, which is in the RJES MTHONG, which is following the direct perception. It's called liberation path because by then the MTHONG PHANGS and BSGOM PHANGS have been eliminated.

It's the direct perception which blows away the obstacles. Then by the time you come out, you are free of those obstacles. For example, the path of seeing famously eliminates only three of your negative emotions.

They are doubt about the path, intellectual belief in self-existence, and belief in extreme practices like in India they burn themselves or they cut themselves or something like that. So those three negative emotions, only those three out of the 84,000, are eliminated permanently by seeing emptiness directly. During the direct perception of emptiness, they're fighting.

The direct perception is fighting against those three. Then when you come out, that's a PAR BYED, when you come out, you are already free of those. When you come out, it's called path of freedom, NAM DU LAM.

Got it? Yeah. They are the same.

So GOM LAM, according to the Amida Dharma, has direct perception period and outside of... So during GOM LAM, you're also having direct perception of emptiness. On occasions.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, and by the way, when does GOM LAM start? It's like the same day that you get... It's always the same day, GOM LAM.

You see? It starts in the evening or something. Then you're a GOM LAM person.

It always starts a couple hours later. Yeah. Yeah, you can say that.

I don't think it's a big deal if you say the next day. That's alright. But the point is that GOM LAM only lasts a day.

[Speaker 2]
So when you stop being able to read people's minds, you know you're now...

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, you graduated. LAM GYIS NGOS MI STAR RAG GZHEL BYA is a word that we have to talk about. GZHEL is the future tense of a verb.

NGOS BYA GZHEL No, there's two prenasal GZHEL words. MA BYA means to meet somebody. And it's the honorific.

NGOS BYA, apostrophe, means to weigh something. To take the weight of something. Or to take the measure of something.

So, GZHEL BYA is a synonym for ZHES BYA. And YOD PA. YOD PA, GZHEL BYA, ZHES BYA.

And by the way, YUL by itself is a synonym for YOD PA. In Adam's text. So that thing which is to be estimated...

Estimate is not a bad translation. That thing which is to be estimated is another word for existence. So, GZHEL BYA means the object under consideration.

I like to translate it as the object under consideration. So, they're talking about what is it that you're looking at? What is the direct object under consideration?

Especially during BAR MTSAN MED LAM. What are you thinking about? What are you focusing on?

In my opinion, this would be... the GZHEL BYA for BAR MTSAN MED LAM is ultimate reality. And the GZHEL BYA for RNAM DU LA'AM That's more like the sixteen aspects or something.

GZHEL BYA But I guess he wants to include both ultimate reality and high truths that you see when you come out. Then, GANG YIN, if you want to know what they are. Those direct...

He says direct objects of those perceptions. I guess meaning there are implied objects, but we're not going to talk about them. Yeah, what they are.

What those objects are. GZIG means... This is a mistake.

It should be TSA. It should be TZ. Okay.

Check your manuscript. Check your scan. This SAM should be TZAM, I think.

No, because it would have... This would have to end in S. And that spelling of ZIG means joints.

So I don't think... I'm guessing it's TZAM. Or it could be GAM.

[Speaker 2]
Not TZIG MTHAM.

[Speaker 1]
Which means either words or GZHOD PA'I. I don't know. But we got to say it's something wrong here.

There's something wrong with the manuscript. I'm going to guess it's TZ. But you have to look at your scan.

Okay, so TZIG MTHAM GZHOD PA TZIG MTHAM GZHOD PA would be just talking. In words. Only words.

GZHOD PA means to express. TZIG MTHAM means only in words. RGYAL LTAG means like argument.

Disputation. Conversation. Talking a lot.

Arguing about it a lot in words. I would translate it something like that. Arguing about it a lot in words.

About what? Shelja.

[Speaker 2]
No.

[Speaker 1]
The specific object of those perceptions. Of those meditation states. Arguing about it in words.

PHAN RGA. No, read it this way. It's not going to help you much.

That's what it means. It means it would be difficult to help. But what it means is it's not going to help you much.

It'd be hard to say it's going to help you much. PHAN RGA means that. PHAN RGA means doubtful it would help you much.

In English we say doubtful it would help you much. He's trying to soften it because he's writing a book. His book is in that category.

So he's like, he doesn't say it won't help you. He says it's difficult. DE DAG GIS SHEL JA What they are considering.

BDAG MED Here he says no self nature. The fact that things are not themselves. I like to translate it that way.

The fact that things are not themselves. If you want to be less understandable you can say no self nature. DE DAG GIS SHEL JA BDAG MED RNAMS DIR BYAS PA BZHIN BZHIN means as I have explained it.

Or as I am explaining it. DIR BYAS PA BZHIN RANG GIS means by yourself. This NGES PA is a verb.

NGES PA as a verb means you must perceive it. So NGES PA as a verb means to perceive. NGES PA as an adjective means definite, certain, positive.

But as a verb it means grasp. Or see it. Yourself.

CHA, future tense, GOS SO. You have to do it. It's something you have to perceive yourself.

David Swenson used to go off on this thing called apples. You can't tell somebody in words about the taste of an apple. You just give them an apple and they bite it.

He's talking about yoga poses. But it's similar. He's like saying, you got to bite it.

There's only so much you can do with arguing about it in words. Okay, got it? That's kind of a beautiful paragraph if you translate it well.

It'll be interesting. I have to check. If you want to, you and me can separately check whether NAM DRA LA'AM ever perceives dogma directly.

I'm not sure. He's kind of implying. So I'll have to check what the Abhidharma people think.

Because the way I explained it to you, he's not perceiving emptiness at that point. But here he says emptiness. But they don't call it emptiness, they call it dogma.

One of the 16 aspects is emptiness. So sometimes you can fudge it. But anyway, you're out of the direct perception.

Now, I've supplied you for free some headers which will make your life a lot easier. Because he's going to go through the four schools now and what do they think is emptiness. So that's very sexy.

That's a very interesting subject. So NYID PA, his second category, which they don't often tell you what it is, but he did, is the individual explanation of the four schools. What does each school believe is emptiness?

And that's the real value of your text. We get four ideas of what is emptiness. The reason there exists four ideas of emptiness is because these are typical ideas that human beings will come up with.

Every human being will misinterpret emptiness in three ways and eventually come to the fourth one. So they are not just theoretical. I think that's important.

When you teach it in a class, I think you should say that. This is not just a theoretical exercise. These are errors that all human beings make when they start studying emptiness.

So each of you in my audience should try to detect in your own mind the tendency to think this is emptiness because it's not the real one. But it's helpful. It's a step.

It's a step up. Here we go. DANG PO NI You want to read that?

And I'm going to be more brutal on your pronunciation.

[Speaker 2]
DANG PO NI BYAS DRAG MANG BA DAG GIS GONG PO ZHIG DANG DANG BA DE DGANG SGRONG CHOS KYI MED PAS BDAG SKYES LEN NA Oh, that's boring.

[Speaker 1]
You did it right. DANG PO NI So here's Vaibhashika, right? CHOS DRAG MANG BA Vaibhashika This is where you get BASA.

You see? VAI means say different things. BASA means to talk.

Indonesian language name is BASA. So this is Vaibhashika. The first school of Buddhism.

It's called those who talk about different things. VAI means different things. BASA means people who BASA.

People who talk. CHOS DRAG MANG BA KA'I PHYIG Some of them accept. Here's the verb.

Do you want to break that verb down for us? Anybody want to try?

[Speaker 2]
LEN is to take.

[Speaker 1]
I'll give you a clue. It's an instrumental.

[Speaker 2]
Take with your mouth.

[Speaker 1]
It means to accept something. Okay? It's like how you take a...

accept a youtiao with your mouth. No, it just means... It means to accept it.

Yeah, you can say that. To accept it with your mouth. Take it with your mouth means to accept.

[Speaker 2]
I'll eat that.

[Speaker 1]
They accept a self nature. By the way, the GAC CHA. What they say...

Emptiness is empty. What they say... They don't speak much about DONGS PA.

They don't speak much about Shunyata in the first school. They call it self nature. I don't like to say self because in English people have trouble with not referring to a table.

You see, I mean... It's true you can say it self. But normally when you say self you're talking about people.

And the Buddhist word ATMAN is meant to refer to things and people. It's easy to think that a self nature could belong to a table. It's harder to think that a self belongs to a table.

You see, what's easiest of all is to say the table is not itself. That's comfortable for anybody. But you have to get used to it.

It's a phrase instead of a single word translation. Baby translators feel more comfortable with a one to one correlation. And they use dictionaries which screw them up.

So they see one word, one word and they keep plugging words in. They keep replacing words. And then they lose the flow.

So the idea is to go to that stage, use dictionaries, then throw the dictionaries away and re-cook it for your reader in a way which is even more accurate than if you had used a string of translated words. So that's the challenge. And that's a maturity in translation.

And two things help with that. Conversation and debating. Debating is...

There's nothing like debating for a translator in a foreign language. So we can do it when we open our Varanasi Center or something. GANG NU'ANG SBYUD DU MED PAS So they accept a self, nature or self which is indescribable.

SBYUD DU MED PA SBYUD DU MED PA It comes in the tantra, right? Beyond all words. SBYUD DU MED PA means cannot be described.

What? Whether it is one with the heaps or separate from the heaps. GANG DU'ANG means either one.

Either one, cannot be described as either one. Whether it is one with the heaps or it is separate with the heaps. Now, you know, if for the rest of Utpala's hour we only talk about these two words, it's a good use of time.

DANG GCIG DANG GCIG Say DANG GCIG and say DANG THA DE So if you don't really understand Buddhist philosophy, you will translate this as one with the heaps or separate from the heaps. But that's not really the deeper point here. DANG GCIG is an idiom for set or subset.

Set or subset. And the syntax is weird. You say Toyota car DANG GCIG DANG GCIG Toyota car DANG GCIG And what it really means is if it's a Toyota, it's a car.

So it's not, you know, you're going to have to think about it. To say one with a car, that's not the same thing, right? To say Toyota is one with a car.

I mean it could almost mean that but it's not very clear. I prefer to translate DANG GCIG with a whole phrase. I'll say to be the self is to be the heaps.

You see what I mean? Or to be the self is not to be the heaps. You see what I mean?

I like to say it that way. So you'll have to struggle with that. And you have to identify when a DANG GCIG refers to that relationship.

Does it here? Does it refer to that here? Is it true that to be the heaps is to be the self?

Or to be the self is to be the heaps? Or is it to be the self is not to be the heaps? Is self and heaps like Toyota and Chevrolet?

See, that's your choice. What's your relationship to your body and mind? Are you like, is Stanley like Chevrolet to Toyota?

Separate thing? Or is Stanley's relationship to his body and mind such that to be Stanley is to be his body and mind? Like car and Chevrolet.

Is the relationship between Stanley and his body and mind, is it Toyota and car? Or is it Chevrolet and Toyota? To be a Chevrolet is not to be a Toyota.

Toyota is to be a car. You see, and you got a dung cheek, so be careful how you translate it. That can be a glorious thing of our school of translation.

Which if we survive long enough, people will talk about us a hundred years from now, like Xuanzang and his students. You know what I mean? They say, oh wow, they pioneered this great translation.

They didn't say the self is one with the heaps. What's that mean? They said to be the self is to be the body and mind.

Because to be a Toyota is to be a car. And then the other one is to be the self is not to be the body and mind. Like Toyota and Chevrolet.

Okay, separate things. They don't have a relationship such that to be one is to be the other. What's the normal lower view?

Chik or thaday? Relationship between Nick and Nick's body and mind. Are they separate or if you are Nick, are you automatically Nick's body and mind?

Be careful. No, we're talking about the gac cha. Yeah, a soul which will survive after his body and mind are gone.

A transparent invisible diamond-like thing deep within his heart that when he dies and his body dissolves this thing goes to heaven. This is what I grew up with. You see, that self, the transparent crystalline thing that goes to heaven after you die in your sleep, you know, is that chik or thaday?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, it's thaday.

[Speaker 1]
So the normal lower view would be thaday. There's a self-independent. Before we had this difficult phrase chen gyi mi tun mar.

Basic fundamentally dissonant. That's not very smooth. Anyway, you could have a band called Fundamentally Dissonant whose nature is inconsistent with.

That's going to come in your text. He favors that phrase. chen gyi mi tun mar What did I just say that was better?

Fundamentally No, but after that I said something better. Yeah, fundamentally inconsistent. Okay, meaning is Nick's soul fundamentally inconsistent with mind and body?

And they would say yes. That's the gak chak. That's what doesn't exist in the lower school.

That there's a little soul that's inconsistent with physical matter and mental stuff. It's something else. And it floats around and the body's come and go and mind's come and go, but this thing stays.

You see what I mean? Got it?

[Speaker 2]
That's the gak chak in the lower school.

[Speaker 1]
But what he's saying is some lower school guys get worse. They're even worse. If you say is the soul consistent with the body and mind or not?

They say, no one can say. chu du me pa Got it? He's picking on even weirder ones among the weird ones.

You ask him, is the soul part of Nick's... is to be the soul to be Nick's body and mind, car, Chevrolet, sorry, Chevrolet car, or is to be the soul to be different from Nick's body and mind? And they say, no one can put it into words.

It's indescribable. Got it? And is that the view of all the lower school?

No, because he said, good, I would give you five. Some of them, some of the vaibhashikas, meaning not all of them, but some of them have this really weird idea. It's indescribable.

Again, the syntax of the use of dang chik is first the thing under the set, Chevrolet, car, dang chik, Chevrolet, to be a Chevrolet is to be a car. The English goes one, three, two. To be a Chevrolet, dang chik, is to be a car.

So the syntax is nasty. The syntax is hard. Don't forget.

So here the order is dark, pungpo, dang chik. Dark, pungpo, dang chik. To be the soul is to be the body and mind.

Got it? Or you can say dark, pungpo, dang, ta de, to be the soul is not to be the body and mind. Like Chevrolet and Toyota.

Got it? It's hard. What makes it harder is dang always means and.

It has nothing to do with and here. Nothing. Dang chik is a single word.

It means to be one is to be the other. Sometimes I'll translate it as they don't have a relationship such that to be the soul is to be the body and mind. I'll just throw out the whole...

I won't try to do word by word. I'll just rephrase the whole thing. They believe that you cannot say whether it's true that to be the soul is to be the body and mind.

That's how I would translate it. Now a bad translator is going to say the self is one with the heat or the self is separate with the heat. Then everyone is like, what does that mean?

Sorry, you have a question. GANG DU'ANG GANG DU'ANG here means either one. Indescribable.

Cannot... Either one. It means either one here.

Either one at all.

[Speaker 2]
It's not described as either. It would be less mystical. But just to say we wouldn't want to say it's either one is a little more moderate.

[Speaker 1]
It's not that they don't want to accept either position. That's not the point. The point is that they believe it's indescribable.

It's beyond words. You could say it's MA SANGS RGYUD LEN DE MA SANGS RGYUD LEN DE From Vajrayogini. MA SANGS RGYUD LEN DE Beyond all...

Beyond all words and thought.

[Speaker 2]
MA SANGS RGYUD LEN DE So as to the question of which it is, they would say...

[Speaker 1]
It's indescribable. It is supposed to be New Age-y.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
They're New Age. They're in West Sedona. You can find them over there.

Just get a car. It could be a Chevrolet or a Toyota. Toyota.

[Speaker 2]
Can you repeat it?

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, I love that he cares about it. CHEVROLET CAR DANG GCIG That's the syntax. So here it is.

CHEVROLET CAR DANG GCIG Here it's reversed. DAG PHUNG PO DANG GCIG Or DAG PHUNG PO DANG THA DE And the DANG is allowing that? Forget the DANG.

Yeah, the DANG is a troublemaker. It's like...

[Speaker 2]
But it's working like DANG LDAN PA or something.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, exactly. Just throw it out. Don't think about it.

You'll get confused. The first thing is the Chevrolet. The second thing is SUBSET SET DANG GCIG SUBSET SET DANG GCIG When you're denying it, it's SUBSET, SUBSET, NOT.

No relationship. Toyota and Chevrolet. To be a Toyota is not to be a Chevrolet.

[Speaker 2]
Or even is to be not.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, something like that. But to be a Chevrolet is to be a car. And that's the best way to translate it.

To be blah is to be blah.

[Speaker 2]
Necessarily. That's wrong.

[Speaker 1]
To be a car is to be a Chevrolet. Sorry, you're right. To be a car is not necessary to be a Chevrolet.

Yeah, it's like a mock-up. That's going down. Car to Chevrolet.

Normally these discussions are Chevrolet to car. Or Toyota and Chevrolet. But I just taught you a very valuable thing, and it took me many years to figure it out.

You can say the self is not one with the heaps. But it means nothing to a reader. To say to be the soul is to be your body and mind.

Or to be the soul is not to be your body and mind. Which one is it? Beyond all knowledge.

No one can tell. Man, we just lost that valuable thing. I was recording my crotch.

Okay. V would disapprove. That's private.

Alright. So if you get that right, I'm going to kiss you. Even if you do grow a beard.

Alright. Now he's going to talk about other ones. Other ones.

And don't forget the doctor talking. This is all gotcha. Don't forget.

This is not that they accept a doctor like that. It's that they deny a doctor like that.

[Speaker 2]
Alright.

[Speaker 1]
When they say the doc, they're talking about doc gotcha. Other, yeah, Vibhashikas. Khelen?

With their mouth. They accept a self-nature, if you want. That's easier.

Which is Ranggya Thupa. Literally can stand on its own. Here's the can.

Thupa. Can stand on its own. Can stand on its own.

Or self-standing. I would just call the whole thing self-standing. Ranggya Thupa.

In philosophy it all goes together. Ranggya Thupa. And what are we going to say about this word?

Kya? You'll often see it miscarved, misspoken, mistyped as RGYA. Because it's a thousand times more likely.

DE THAMS CAD KYANG BDAG GCIG RANG BANG CHEN GYI MED PAR BSDOD PA RGA'O But they are all the same. All these guys are similar in saying that. So you go DE THAMS CAD means all these guys are the same.

By the way, BDAG can mean similar or same. And it's tricky. BDAG can mean similar or same.

BSRUNG is definitely same. And not similar. M-T-S-U-N-G But when it's BDAG sometimes you got to translate it as the same.

Unfortunately.

[Speaker 2]
And YAM DU could be both also, right? What's it? YAM DU You can say that.

[Speaker 1]
But all of them It's kind of a but here. Oh, there it is. YAM.

But all of them are the same in saying that there's no self. There's no self which is BDAG GCIG RANG BANG CHEN I think I have to back up here. I think I made a mistake here.

The first two BDAGS are ones that are accepted.

[Speaker 2]
The first two BDAGS are ones that are not GAC CHAS. They're not GAC CHAS.

[Speaker 1]
I think so. I think so, yeah. I think what he's saying in the second one, for example, is that these guys do accept a self-standing self nature, but they don't accept a self which is unchanging, singular, and autonomous.

Yeah, I'm sorry. I missaid it. I'm sorry.

I made a mistake.

[Speaker 2]
I made a mistake.

[Speaker 1]
The first group of guys accept a self which cannot be described as being the body and mind or being separate from the body and mind. The second group of guys accept a self-standing self. But all of them are the same.

Here's the BA YANG. All of them are the same in believing DOD PA. Don't say desire, okay?

That there is no self which has those three qualities. Unchanging, singular, and independent. Now, if you're in the debate ground after this class, which is how it works in the monastery, you know, kids in the debate ground are in the class, they're looking for stuff to use in the debate ground.

They're looking for ammunition in the class. They're already calculating what they're going to say tonight in the debate ground. They're like, yeah, I got this.

Now, I'm going to get this guy because I'm going to say, you know, what's the different between Wang Rang Wang Chen and Ranggya Thubpa? And the guy's going to say they're not different. And I'm going to say, yeah, but there's schools that say you can be Ranggya Thubpa but you cannot be Wang Rang Wang Chen.

And then he's going to, that's the difference, man. And the guy's going to be stuck because I can't even think of the difference right now. Now, hopefully he's going to go into it.

But it gets really messy. It gets really messy because different guys have different ideas. What's the difference between self-standing and autonomous?

Because apparently, they all say it cannot be autonomous, but some guys say it can be self-standing. What's the difference? That would be really good fodder ammunition for debate ground.

And in a class like this, when you debate in the afternoon or in the evening, we always debate in the afternoon or in the evening. In the morning classes, people are calculating. They're like, wow, I'm going to use this tonight.

Okay.

[Speaker 2]
Geshe-la, you said the yang was but, but then what is the kyang?

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, that's true. As well. Or something like that.

You can tie them together. Actually, I think it's superfluous.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, right.

[Speaker 1]
Okay, let's keep going because we're not going to finish much.

[Speaker 2]
Right. It's 2019.

[Speaker 1]
BDAG GCIG RANG BAN CHEN This phrase with three elements, unchanging, singular, autonomous, is to be understood as I have explained it earlier. As LTAR, I have explained it, SHES PA, SNGAR earlier in this text. And if next time you have a class, we're going to ask you to explain it to us.

Has he given us the difference between BDAG GCIG RANG BAN CHEN and RANG SKAD DUG PA? We're going to ask you to explain it to us because we don't remember. Okay.

[Speaker 2]
Has he read my text?

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, apparently it's earlier in the text. All I remember is that you did have a text earlier. Okay.

LTAR YIN LA Here's that soft disjunctive. But, or whereas, so it's whereas rather than but. DE SGOG PA'I RIG PA Logic which is used to deny this kind of a self-nature, which is BDAG GCIG RANG BAN CHEN, logic which is used to deny that among many different kinds of logic.

But, if we were to just summarize all those logics, all those arguments, you might want to use argument here for RIG PA. There are many arguments used to deny this kind of self. But, you know, just if you wanted to wrap them all together, do not.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
And I want you guys to put, especially Adam, for example, your text, Sugong, your texts are in debate format. In the Tibetan, break it up like this. BLA BA BLA BA CHOS CAN BLA BA BLA BA DANG BLA BA BLA BA YIN MED CHOS So, you should know the elements of a reason.

Here's the subject under debate. It's stated first, the CHOS CAN. First you say what you're going to fight about.

What are you going to argue about? Here it's... Yeah, the person.

Okay. Consider the person. BDAG GCIG RA BANG CAN MA YIN TE That's your assertion.

Technically, it's called the quality asserted. It's the quality about the example that you want to prove. And it's assumed that the opponent doesn't accept it yet.

Okay. We should go to the movies tonight. Take tonight.

We should go to the movies because I want to. This is arguments with your spouse. First you take a thing.

Tonight. Let's talk about tonight. We should go to the movies.

That's your quality asserted about tonight. And then you give your reason. Because I want to.

Or because it's a really good movie. By the way, well, that's another story. It can't be BDAG GCIG RA BANG CAN.

Okay. Because it is MI BDAG PA and GZHAN DBANG. Because it is changing.

And it's at the mercy of other things. Okay. It's at the mercy of other things.

I mean, you can't say it that way but find a literary way to say that.

[Speaker 2]
It sounds like my noise school.

[Speaker 1]
It is really. It boils down to the same thing. Because it means it's at the mercy of other forces.

That's what GZHAN DBANG means. It's not autonomous. Because it has to do what other people force it to do.

GZHAN DBANG Okay. It has to do what others decide. Meaning its causes.

Okay. It may want to be intelligent but if the causes are not there, it cannot be. It's at the mercy of other forces.

[Speaker 2]
GZHAN DBANG Exactly.

[Speaker 1]
Nice. Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Not DAG.

[Speaker 1]
DAG. Oh yeah, it's unacceptable to just deny it. Yeah, it's okay.

It's okay.

[Speaker 2]
It's not unchanging.

[Speaker 1]
It's not unchanging because it's changing.

[Speaker 2]
That's okay. Yeah, that's true.

[Speaker 1]
Okay. Now, say, DUN PA'I YANG DAG DUN PA'I YANG DAG So, you guys are mostly familiar with these first three lines. Take the subject, say something controversial, give a reason that the other guy cannot deny.

That he already accepts. He already agrees to number three. Number one is the subject, the thing under discussion.

Number two is something about it that he doesn't recognize yet. Number three must be something he already agrees to. Okay.

You cannot say to your wife, you have to say to your wife, let's consider tonight, we're going to the movies because I want to. Because she won't accept the relationship between one and three. The relationship between one and three is one of the things that the opponent must accept.

So, you cannot say that to your wife also. You have to say, consider tonight, we should go to the movies. It's a killer movie.

You will love it. You see? You don't say, because I want to.

Because she doesn't accept the relationship between one and three. Just because you want to doesn't mean we should go to the movies. But you have to convince someone they must accept number three because you will love it.

Okay? Got it? Got it?

Don't forget. Okay? In logic.

Does the opponent accept the relationship between one and two?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Good. Beautiful. I'll kiss you.

Not yet. Not yet. He didn't say not.

He said not yet. But they do accept the relationship between one and three. Now one more step and you will understand some of logic.

If something is three, must it be two? Because the opponent must agree with that also. That's called the khyabpa, right?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
Not yet. Dhog khyab comes later. This is je khyab.

Does the wife agree that if it's a movie she will love, she will go to the movie? Yeah. No.

She'll agree to that. You assume that. If you can convince her that she will love the movie, she will agree that she should go to the movie.

So she must accept one is three. The movie is something I would love. And then she has to accept that if I love it, I should go.

Now in logic, the definition of a good reason in Buddhism is three relationships hold. The definition of a good reason in Buddhism is three relationships hold. Three relationships are correct.

One is three. The movie playing is a good movie. And if three, then two.

If it's a movie she will love, she should go. Now there's a reconfirmation step. If not two, not three.

If not two, not three. What's that? If it's a movie you shouldn't go to, it's one that she doesn't like.

It's not like that. Those are called tsul sum. It's important because it's coming up in your text.

It's coming up in your text. It's called the three relationships. Tsul sum dupa means they hold.

And that's the definition of a correct reason in Buddhism. The three relationships hold. I just taught you the first step of logic.

Three relationships. If one, three. If three, two.

If not two, not three. Got it? And the last one is kind of just a reconfirmation.

It's not really that necessary, but it's tradition. Sorry?

[Speaker 2]
Is it necessary at all?

[Speaker 1]
Just for reconfirmation purposes. There's no case where the second one holds when the third one doesn't hold, to be honest. It's by nature.

Self-existently. The last element, now there's a fourth element which is required in a really classical Buddhist discussion. You should have a dunpay yang dak.

It means an example which the opponent will accept fits both two and three. Here it's, he just takes a bumba. What's a bumba?

Don't say this, okay? Yeah, I want to say water pitcher in our school of translation. We got the Mixed Nuts Translation School.

Bumba is the most famous example in every argument in Buddhism. Why? Yeah, there was no plumbing in ancient India.

Every room had a water pitcher with water for washing your hands, water for washing your bottom, water for drinking. The wife went and carried it. They still do it.

They still do it. They carry these five-gallon things on their head and they bring the water back because there was no water. Now what would be the modern example in the Mixed Nuts School of Translation?

A coffee cup. You're casting around for an example. Take a coffee cup.

It's something that's at hand which is easy to grab and say, I mean it's the same. What? This coffee cup is not unchanging, it's not singular, and it's not autonomous because it's changing and it's at the mercy of other factors.

The way it's going to go is not something it can decide. It's run by other things. So it's not autonomous.

Okay, got it?

[Speaker 2]
Doesn't the opponent ever attack the perna instead of the kapha or the japa?

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, they do. The most famous perna in thunpay yangdap you should call it. Thunpay means it incorporates both qualities.

Thunpay. Yangdap means a good example. Sometimes the thunpay is not yangdap.

It has one but not the other quality.

[Speaker 2]
Or it has neither quality.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, people do that.

[Speaker 2]
You don't use perna so often?

[Speaker 1]
No, you can use it. In the end you will use it because some people say, I don't agree. And you say, well it's just like the movie we saw last week.

You really liked it, you didn't want to go. And then you went and it was a beautiful movie. That's a thunpay yangdap.

That's step four. You compare it to something else that has both qualities. Oh, come on.

It was that movie last week we went to. You said you didn't want to go. I said we should go and you liked it.

[Speaker 2]
I've never really had this conversation.

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, why do I use this example? Because I've been there. Okay, now he says khyapa matthu.

Which means your reason is good but it doesn't prove what you're trying to prove. I might like the movie but that doesn't mean I'm going. That's it?

[Speaker 2]
Who is debating us by the way?

[Speaker 1]
That's a good question. We are summarizing all the arguments that the first school would use to deny a self which is unchanging, singular, and autonomous.

[Speaker 2]
So they're debating a non-Buddhist?

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, probably. By definition, yes. They are, according to this description.

Right. Or some rogue Vaibhashika or something. Which means he's not really a Vaibhashika.

Okay, here we go. By the way, it's one of the schools he's studying right now. It's one of those Sankhyas or something like that.

Kapilas. Okay, khyap te. No, it is a khyap.

So khyap te assumes he already said khyapa matthu. Which means just because something is changing and at the mercy of other forces doesn't mean it's not unchanging, singular, and autonomous.

[Speaker 2]
When you translate that, would you put that the assumed one in parentheses maybe?

[Speaker 1]
So that a Western would understand? I'm sorry, what? No, I always add the unspoken comments.

Yeah. I think it should be a standard of our school. Khyap te.

He says ma khyap. We say it is a khyapa. If something is changing, it's contradictory that it would be unchanging.

If something is changing, it contradicts the idea that it could be unchanging, singular, and autonomous. Now, is it fair that he throws all three into the second part of the khyapa? That's what bothers you?

His claim is once something is changing, it can't be any of those three. That's our claim. That's our claim.

Once something is changing, it can't be unchanging, it cannot be singular, and it cannot be autonomous. The singular is a little tricky. Okay.

I don't know.

[Speaker 2]
I think he's right. Well, it's less certain what goes outside of it. We've used as our third statement only autonomous statement.

[Speaker 1]
Well, he's going to convince you, okay? Here we go. DAG LTA'I LTA'O It is true that if something is changing, it cannot be any of those three.

If something is changing, it cannot be unchanging, singular, or autonomous.

[Speaker 2]
No, he's saying if something's changing then it can't be all three of those. Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

[Speaker 1]
Oh, I thought you said that. No, I want to say any. Well, let's see.

DAG LTA'I LTA'O, going up, right? DAG LTA'I LTA'O, it is so true. He's got a good LTA'O sense.

He's probably had a lot of talks with his wife. Now, yesterday we discussed the verb MDOG, which meant... Good.

All right. Or stick a name on something, okay? Adhese...

I always think adhesive, you know? Like stick a label on an apple, which is so irritating when you're trying to eat an apple. Stick the mental image that came out of the karmic seed on the pen.

Apply it. I like to say overlay, you know? It's like an overlay.

So MDOG, present tense, past tense. DAG B-T-A-G-S DAG Here you see the future tense. DAG So, let me hear those three different dentals.

They're dentals. They come from the teeth. Now, future tense.

DAG Because it has a prefix letter, it's a real English D as in doctor. Okay? DAG If it didn't have a prefix letter, DAG, which means pure.

Okay? Now, present tense. MDOG Okay?

Tibetans don't know about prenasals. You ask a Tibetan, is that prenasal or not? They'll just look at you with this dumb look.

And then you'll say, is it MDOG or is it DOG? And they'll look at you like, what are you talking about? They do it, but they don't know they're doing it.

Okay? They do it, but they don't know they're doing it. Ganden Monastery has no N in it.

It's a prenasal. Okay? Anyway.

But if you ask them, they'll say, I don't know what you're talking about. You know. Okay.

And here, and what's a past tense? DAG DAG Does not exist in English. The sound does not exist in English.

But I'll give you a clue of a country that it does exist in. Because if you take the cup, and you get the pen, and you want to go to the store, you will take the cup, and you will go to the store, and you will get the pen. Yeah, India.

Because they grew up on Sanskrit roots. You see? Yeah.

That's why an Indian sounds like an Indian, because they're not aspirating. All their... In English, in non-Indian English, it's all second column.

It's all second column. Okay? DAG You know.

Cup. Pen. It's all second column.

But an Indian is saying all first column. Okay. Pen.

Cup of tea. A cup of tea. Without the pen.

You see? So, we don't have it in American English, or British English, or Australian English. We don't have...

We don't have unaspirated. Past tense of MDOG? DAG Okay.

Cup of tea. Okay, good. All right.

Yeah, okay. So, this is future tense, which means to be. To be.

So, DAG BZHI means... Now, this is a deep, deep thing. The parts of the pen.

Is the DAG BZHI. And it's a very deep subject in the study of Buddhist philosophy to understand the DAG BZHI. The collection of parts which you are going to put the picture onto.

Okay? The collection of parts. I wish this came apart.

Anybody have a pen that comes apart? Okay, the collection of parts. I had too much coffee.

Sorry, I'm sorry. The collection of parts on which you put the picture. That collection of parts, which is not yet a pen.

Okay? It's just the DAG BZHI. The thing to be given the name.

G-D Right here. Right here. DAG BZHI.

With a person, what's the DAG BZHI?

[Speaker 2]
The body and mind. Yeah, PHUNG PO.

[Speaker 1]
The body and mind. Got it? It's a very beautiful idea.

When you walk back into the auditorium, there's nobody there. This thing is on the chair. The two parts are on the chair.

And you haven't looked at it yet. It's a DAG BZHI. It's the thing to be given the name.

And if you want to go deeper, there you are. Name and karmic... Name and picture...

Name and picture coming out of a karmic seed in Buddhism are the same. In the beginning, there was the word. It's so cool.

It's so cool. It's not really a word. It's a picture coming out of a karmic seed.

And that's how karma works. Picture comes out. There's a DAG BZHI there.

The thing to be given the picture. The thing to accept the picture. It's the parts.

And that's why the parts aren't the whole. Until the picture goes there. Then it's a whole.

Okay? And all the explanations you heard in the Lam Rim are wrong. I'm sorry.

[Speaker 2]
So, Prasangika uses the word DAG BZHI as well as other schools?

[Speaker 1]
Yeah, every school uses the word DAG BZHI.

[Speaker 2]
Well... Not in Prasangika.

[Speaker 1]
You know... The word is mostly used in Madhyamika. He's kind of fudging it here.

You can go to the First Dalai Lama's commentary the Abhidharmakosha or Choney Lama's commentary and look up DAG BZHI and see if it's there. I doubt it. Who uses this word mostly in Madhyamika?

[Speaker 2]
We're over time here.

[Speaker 1]
I know. I'm always over time.

[Speaker 2]
DAG BZHI PHUNG PO Yeah.

[Speaker 1]
This body and mind... And I'm just using body and mind to make it more comfortable for you. I don't want you to necessarily use it for PHUNG PO.

But the body and mind to which we apply the name or the picture is changing and it is at the mercy of other forces. Okay? Okay.

Meaning is causes. Got it? You okay?

How do you translate that? God bless. The thing to be given the name or the thing to be labeled.

I think I might use that. The thing which is going to get the label. But the label is the picture coming out of the karmic seed.

Just remember that. I don't think 95% of people who are studying this understand that. Not really.

Say again? Yeah, it is.

[Speaker 2]
It is.

[Speaker 1]
Which is? It's an adjective clause.

[Speaker 2]
It's the sign of an adjective clause. Now an adjective clause. Say you?

Oh, yeah.

[Speaker 1]
He's saying the RGYUD KYI Essentially what he's saying is the RGYUD KYI can be translated as which is. Just that little I. It becomes an adjective clause.

Clause means has a verb. Phrase means it doesn't have a verb. And then there's rules about commas or no commas.

That would help you put your commas in the right places. Oh, don't say foundation. Who said that?

[Speaker 2]
I choked on it.

[Speaker 1]
The body and mind which are to be labeled. Which are going to be labeled me. But he didn't say that yet.

Self. Me. Person.

The body and mind which are going to be receiving a label is not too bad. Got it? He didn't say which label yet.

But it's me or self. Myself.

[Speaker 2]
It's a brutal place to start. Oh, so the label is not pungus?

[Speaker 1]
No, no. The pungus are the object of the label. They are the apple that's going to get the price tag.

They are the apple. Okay, listen. BDAG GZHI Apple.

RDOG BYED The machine that the guy has. The labeler. The labeler.

Okay. BDAG GZHI Apple. RDOG BYED The mind which gives the label.

The machine in the guy's hand that spits out those labels. Say again?

[Speaker 2]
BYED E-R in English.

[Speaker 1]
The doker.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Speaker 1]
No, I'm going somewhere. Listen. Hang in there.

I'm going somewhere important. BDAG GZHI The apple before it got the label. RDOG BYED The machine that the guy uses.

Which is your mind. BDAG PA'I CHOS The finished product. The labeled apple.

So there's a word for it. BDAG PA'I CHOS Is it apostrophe I? The finished labeled product.

[Speaker 2]
BDAG PA'I apostrophe I?

[Speaker 1]
Yeah. B-T-A-G-S B-T-A-G-S probably. And it's a beautiful thing.

So there's a BDAG GZHI There's a RDOG BYED And there's a BDAG PA'I CHOS Means the finished apple with the label. There's a doker. There's a doker.

There's a thing to doke. And there's a doke thing. The finished doke thing.

Got it? Doker? Dokey?

And dokecity. Okay, let's go. No, wait, wait.

Let's go one more line. I'm with you. I'm with you, Upala.

I'm with you, Upala. No, one second. You can go.

You can go. You can always pee pee. I don't object to anybody peeing.

Okay. Now, he covers the MI BDAG PA and the GZHAN DBANG. Look at what I'm doing here.

The MI BDAG PA is covered by GES SHIN GCIG PA. The GZHAN DBANG is covered by LAS GNOD KYI GZHAN DBANG. Okay?

The MI BDAG PA relates to the GES SHIN GCIG PA. The GZHAN DBANG relates to the LAS GNOD KYI GZHAN DBANG. Why is it MI BDAG PA?

Because it's GES SHIN GCIG PA. Why is it GZHAN DBANG? Because it's LAS GNOD KYI GZHAN DBANG.

Karma and negative emotions. Why are the body and mind changing? Because they start and stop.

Please try to use start and stop where it's appropriate. Here's it's appropriate. They start and stop.

SKAD GCIG GI SKAD GCIG GI SKAD GCIG BYAS PA'I CHOS Definition of MI BDAG PA. Definition of MI BDAG PA. Definition of changing.

Moment by moment coming in and out of existence. Starting, stopping, starting, stopping, starting. And they are not autonomous because they are at the mercy of other forces.

What are the two other forces? Karma and your mental afflictions. Got it?

That's why you're not autonomous. You're at the mercy of these other forces. You don't have a choice whether you get to go to the bathroom or not.

You're at the mercy of whether you let other people go to the bathroom. And the selfishness which is...

[Speaker 2]
Okay, let's go. Oh, that's so much better. Thank you.

[Speaker 1]
OM AHU OM AHU