ACI 3 «Прикладная медитация», занятие 4

Class Four: Eight-Point Posture of Vairochana
February 24, 1994
transcribed by: Marsha Derynck



[cut]

And inside of that were [students: six preliminaries [unclear]]

and seven ingredients of the [unclear] ok?      And then we finished the, what,
second one?

[student: the sixth edition]

Yea, which were the environment [unclear] you know the environment that
should be around the [unclear]

Finally, we're getting to [student: posture]

Posture. How do you sit, what, how should your body means be when you sit,
and then after that, obviously, we're gunna have to do, what?

[students: meditate, [unclear]

How should your mind be when you sit? [laughs] So first we cover how how
should your body be when you sit.

Say {chu gay}[repeat]{duh chu} [repeat]{chu gay}[repeat]{duh chu} [repeat]

{Chu} you should know. {chu} Anybody? Dharma {laughs} ok. {Chu} means
dharma.
{gay} means eight.
{duh} means body. {chu} means [student: number 8?] Yea, number eight.
[unclear] not the eat dinner, just eight. Uh, and {duh} means body and {chu}
means {chu} means, literally activity, but it means how you [unclear] This
posture knows eight characteristics, you know, I got confused because I, I, in the
back of my mind I was remembering that the seven, seven part posture, and
here we've got Tsong Khapa, Je Tsong Khapa talking about the eight part
posture. So I used my computer and I asked, and, you see both, both of them
occur. You see the seven part posture and you see the eight part posture. Their
both called the posture of good {Vairochana}
{Vairochana} if you're not sure, that's a Buddha, his name is {Vairochana}. And
the name means {nom nom} in Tibetan and that means someone who is able to
eminate any different forms depending on what he needs. {laughs} If he has to
eminate as a bridge, he eminates as a bridge. If he has to eminate as a tree, he
eminates as a tree. [student: {num num}?] Yea, the Buddha {num num} which is
{Vairochana}. And that's true of any Buddha, but, his name emphasizes, his
name is called appearances. {Vairochana} means appearances. He can give you
many different appearances. He can appear on the subway next to you and test
your patience. {laughter}

[student: the Buddha appearances or the Buddha of appearances?]

The Buddha called Appearances. [student: the Buddha call] His name means
appearances. It's a little bit of a hard name, actually. And finally I saw in a
commentary that an explanation of it that he gives many appearances. They all
do but, that's his name. And they say, we're gonna have eight parts to the
posture, the eighth part, which we'll get to later, is you breathe, breathing, how
you breathe. And they say that when they talk about the seven part posture,
they, they're not counting the breathing. They count the breathing separately.
When you count the breathing as part of the posture, then you get eight. OK. So
it's eight, that's why there's a difference between seven and eight. And you'll see
both in scriptures. And I always confuse them I checked in the computer, they
both occur and their both called {Vairochana's} posture. Sometimes just the
posture of the legs is called {Vairochana's} posture, so, anyway.

[silence]

[students: [whispering, unclear]

{dorje num num sum a lay}

[student:ok]

[silence]

{kang-pa kyil-trung}
{kangpa} means the first, the first characteristic of the posture is what do you do
with your legs. {kangpa} means legs. {kangpa} and {kyil-trung} means lotus
posture. Lotus is where you put one leg up first and then you put the other leg
over it. So it would be like, you can't see it very well {unclear}, put your left leg
all the way up, up here, first, left leg first. And then you put your right leg all the
way up there. (Unclear) That's a full lotus. That's called a {kyil trung}

Um, Tsong Khapa and every other scripture says if you can't do that or if you're
not comfortable, which I'm not, uh, it's ok to just put, make a half lotus. A half
lotus would be your left leg, up, up like that, so that your foot is on your right
thigh. And try to get it as high as you can. You'll get better at it, uh, over many
years time, uh, and it won't hurt much. [laughs and laughter] So that your legs
will get, uh, we sit like this in the monastery for six seven hours at a time, during
services and stuff. And you get [unclear and students:unclear] sometimes, not
me but, in a half lotus. Half lotus is pretty comfortable. It's not much problem.
You know if you can't. The main thing though, when you're meditating is, uh,
not to do anything that would distract you. So if sitting like this distracts you, its
its against the meaning of meditation and you shouldn't do it. If you truly have
bad legs and uh it hurts you so much that you can't think about what you're
doing, then it's stupid. So Tsong Khapa, … Je Tsong Khapa says and you can
read it in his commentary, if you can't do a full lotus, it's ok to do a half lotus. He
doesn't say anything else, but in general, in monastic custom, if it's painful, you
… you're allowed to, it's called {mik sal} special case [laughter] and if a monk is in
pain a lot of the rules of the monk are are different, you know, if you're in pain
or you're sick, you're not required to follow everything very strictly. But you
have to truly be sick [laughter, laughs, unclear] Sometimes its very comfortable
just to set them down flat, you know, and not put one on top of another. But if
you can, it's very important later in your practice, in the higher practices, you
have to do some physical conditioning so it's good if you can at least do a half
lotus, get in the habit.

[student: why is [unclear] some people can't?]

I think it relates to just how, not, it's how loose your legs get and if you do it for
a long time you your legs start to get loose at your hips. And if you do a full
lotus, if you can, if you can get used to it and you never will if you don’t practice
every day. You know, but if you can hold that for a while what is does is it forces
your back up perfectly. It makes your back perfect. And you can, if you get used
to it, you can stay like that for many hours, you know, if you can do a full lotus
it's very good. But it's not like, uh, you know, you have a choice between getting
rid of your anger or getting rid of your ability, your inability of doing a full lotus,
you know, chose the first [laughter] don't get hung up on, uh, don't get hung up,
you know, looking like a great yogi, you know, better to be a great yogi.

[student: unclear]

We'll talk about it, we'll talk about it, so that's the, yes:

[student: does it make a difference if your left foot goes up first [unclear]]

Yeah, they say you should, then again, it's different in every country, every
tradition, you know, you're learning Tibetan Buddhism so you should keep pure.
You shouldn't mix it up with other traditions. Maybe you've learned something
from a Hindu tradition or even from another Buddhist country, but if you're
going to follow this path for five years or whatever, uh follow it pure. Don't mix
it up with other things, because it, other things later will get messed up if you
don't follow it now. You know, don't don't uh, I've said it before, I say it again,
individually the medicines are very great. Mixed up together they can make
poisen. You get confused if you try to do everything you've heard about. So just
follow one tradition well. Uh, if it doesn't work, then change and go follow
another tradition well. But it might not work if you don't follow it the way it's
taught. So anyway, left left leg up first, right leg over. Yeah?

[student: I've heard that women should put their left, if you're sitting in half
lotus, that women should put their left foot up and like on their]

That that's what we do too Yea, I'm talking a full lotus, you put your left foot on
your right thigh first

[student: unclear]

and then you put your right foot over your left thigh. That's a full lotus as far as I
know, for everybody. Half lotus put your left leg up on your right thigh. And
that's ok, so so that's the legs, ok? He'll talk later about why it's important to do it
that way according to this tradition. Ah, {[unclear]}

[silence]

[student: does it say why the left should be up first? Is there any reason given?]
Uh, I, I can't talk about it. [laughs, laughter]

[silence]

The second characteristic is {mi} What’s {mik}

[Student: eye?]

Your eye, ok, good, your eyes. {mi} is what in Tibetan, you know? Negative, all
the negatives in Tibetan start with an 'M". All the feminines do too. No, no joke
intended.

{mi ye}? {Mi ye} means, uh, not open too wide,

and {mi sun} means not closed too far.

This is a little tricky, ok, you, when you're meditating let's suppose I'm sitting
down, right, um, the classical posture is if you have your eyes wide open like
that, you will see too many things and they will distract you. By the way, it's also
good to meditate in front of a, if your altar has just a very plain color and
surface, no no fancy texture like a, like a cloth with all one color or something, so
that your eyes even though their not full open, even if their half open, you don't
see a lot of things. You know, it's very distracting when you get into deep
meditation if, even to see, like that screen, fireplace screen or you know just the
pure white of the wall would be better. Better not to have anything in front of
your eyes, especially letters or designs because your eye will start to catch them
as you get into deeper meditation. So what the book says is don't keep your eyes
open too wide because you'll get distracted, if they're full open. And don't close
them completely because then you'll get, what?

[student: sleepy}

sleepy. [laughs] Uh, so the classic, classic posture, in the, in the scriptures is like
that, like half, half open. And focus a little bit down. Your head is [unclear] your
head is just perfectly straight and erect,; but your eyes are down and a little bit
half closed like that. So you're not going like that, you know, your head is
straight, but your eyes are focused down and so Je Tsong Khapa quotes, this is
all from {Kamalashila} which is from the Buddha. He's saying focus around your
nose. When I first heard that, when I was first studying 20 years ago, I used to
sit cross-eyed in my meditation [laughs, laughter] because they miss translated it.
And it said focus on the tip of your nose so [laughter] it’s very, it was very hard,
it didn't work. And then I studied more and I read more and I asked my lamas
and they just means focus, uh, focus your eyes about here. You see? About, if
you drew a plane at the tip of your nose. It doesn't mean focus on your nose. It
means focus about this far. If if you had a book that you were reading right here
then you focus your eyes right about there. So so your not focusing on, uh,
there's something in front of you like if I'm standing right there I'm not, my eyes
are down and I'm just focusing on out here somewhere. It doesn't mean you're
crossing your eyes, your eyes are straight but their just focused in mid air. It's
like a camera that you've miss focused, so, perfect focus, if there were anything
here it would be perfect. Does it have to be anything there

[student: down like about a 45 degree angle down:]

Yea, like that, so its very, uh, difficult problem in the begining that you you so
your eyes are like this. And it helps, if you keep them wide open you're your
eyes get, like the water runs out and they get dry and you can't stay very long.
And if you close them all the way, you get the [unclear], you get this problem of
uh sleepiness. So the classical posture is, is uh in all the Buddhist books its uh, its
like that. Which is also the way you're suppose to walk down the street if you're
a [unclear] I, I'm {unclear] [laughs] So, uh, I think in Thailand they do it pretty
well, it's pretty strict. The good monk are always bumping into telephone poles
and stuff [laughter] But, uh, its like that.

[student: can I ask another question about your [unclear] Sure [student: in, uh, in
sitting uh does number one pertain to uh the thickness of the pad you sit on, I]

No, we'll talk about that later, but you keep your eyes focused down like that.
They say in the scriptures if your having a problem if you have trouble
concentrating with your eyes even half open, then just close them, for a while. If
you have to, close them and a lot of meditations you do, a lot of good ones will
say just close your eyes because they know that you're probably gonna start
looking around. So it's good, but the very very best way you can stay that way
a long long time is like half focused and its very good for your attention. The the
light is enough to keep you from getting sleepy, and its not so wide that you see
a lot of things. So its very good if you can, uh, put some kind of plain colors in
front of you know what ever you're gonna meditate in front of, make sure its
very bland, not bright colors, no bright textures or designs like that, just like
that, yeah?
[student: isn't there something about tucking your chin in a little bit or…?]

We'll talk about it. We're getting there [laughs] [unclear]

[student: to keep your..]

No, you keep your head very very straight. And the tendency is when you hear
that you have to keep your eyes down, you go like that [laughs] No, that's
wrong. You, and it's unnatural, ;you don't sit this way normally. Normally, when
you're looking at something its its straight its your eyes are like that. The trick
here is to keep your head straight but to move your eyes down. Not all the way
down you know, just somewhere focusing out here somewhere. Focusing on
nothing at the at this kind of … focusing on nothing. That's what it means at
your, the level of your nose. Say you were focusing on your hands, you would
see them. And then you, you take them away.
[student: so then you need like a point, you know 8 inches in front of you
[unclear] yea

[student: a point in space 8 inches in front of you] riight, yea. Or actually less. Do
you have an eight inch nose? [laughter] [unclear, student and teacher talking
while laughter]

It’s about 6 inches there, something like that. It doesn't really matter, the point is
your eyes are unfocused. You know, that's very important. Because it lets you
[laughter]. It lets you withdraw from your eye sense. It let you withdraw from
your visual sense, easier, because they're not picking up anything and that's very
important. That's why it's very bad to have letters in front of you., cuz you, the
human tendency is to focus in on the letter and see what it's saying.

[student: is it alright to dim the lights?]

Uh, it, they say dim them to a point in which its conducive to meditation but not
so much that you get sleepy again. And and very bright lights are bad too. By
the way, it's not a Buddhist meditation and never was to stare at an object. That's
not correct. In many scriptures its said this is not meditation. You know, you
don't stare at a picture of the Buddha, or stare at, uh, your lama's picture or
something like that. They say if you want to do that, we'll talk about this later
when we get to, what?

[student: the object]
The object. But it's not it's not a, the idea of it [unclear] with draw from your
senses. The idea's that your eye's not focusing on anything. You're not in the
realm of your senses, so to stare at an object is is not meditation. Part of the
definition of meditation is that you're withdrawing from your five senses. So it it
it wouldn't be relevant.

[student: isn't that single pointed concentration?]

To stare at a picture, it is. It's also single pointed concentration to have a good
dinner and fork it down [laughs] [laughter] So I mean you have to, it's not
considered a good practice. You know, they say look at, look at the Buddha's
image, you know, learn every thing about it. Study it. And then go to your
meditation [unclear]. Somebody asked, uh, {Kabje Trijang Rinpoche}, our root
lama's lama, and the Dalai Lama's lama, uh, there was a westerner that we knew
he said could you draw a Buddha for me. He was about 80 years old, and he had
this perfect, absolutely perfect, you know, and he wasn't a {thangka} painter, he
just was meditating all the time on the Buddha and I have that, I have that
drawing at home. [unclear] so I mean in his mind he had it very very perfect.
Any other [silence]

[student: so really if you're meditating in front of your altar, it would almost be
better to turn [unclear] and face the wall] [unclear]

It’s very nice to meditate towards your altar but get it up high enough that you
know make put some cloth in front of you.

[student: drop a cloth in front of your altar, you mean? ]

Yeah, I mean have a a cloth that comes from your altar or something like that

student: so its above eye level?]

Yea, otherwise it will distract you. Uh, what number are we on?

[silence] I'm making these very short so that you know I want to do the whole
thing with you [unclear] [silence]

Say [Lu} repeat {drang-po} repeat [Lu} repeat {drang-po} repeat This is no big
deal, uh, when you're sitting, you, uh, they say, they say, keep the, keep the
chest, you know, in a in a vertical plane because if you lean back what happens?
[laughs and laughter] you start to fuzz out and if you lean forward of course
you're crunched up it’s very common, I've seen western people, after a few
minutes they start to, like this, and it's very bad for your, for some inner reasons
that you'll learn later when you learn the secret teachings so very important that
you don't uh start to bend your back. So it should be, you should be like
absolutely straight, and you shouldn't be going back, and it's very bad to lean
against something. If you're doing like a one month retreat and you're in
extreme agony then its ok and I've done that and it works, you know, to lean
against something but, but, uh, generally you shouldn't be touching anything
else. You know you will be, and nothing else should be touching you, that will
become a distraction to you. Obviously, your clothes should be very loose and
comfortable. You know, robes are nice, pajamas are nice, something very very
comfortable. Yea?

[student; what's the translation of {lu drang-po}?]

{lu} means body {drang-po} means up straight. Up right. Erect

[student: [unclear] upstraight?]

It means straight. Straight. Keep your body straight, and it's defined as don't let
it go back too far and don't let it go up, up too far. What will happen is you'll
meditate you'll find you start, keep, your body's human you know, and you start
to, after about 20 minutes you find yourself like this and its ok very slowly go
back up, you know, don't go, cuz that will ruin your breath and everything else,
just very slowly. You catch yourself because your body is you can't keep your
body up straight forever, you get tired and your body slowly starts to come
down and then you gotta very very slowly bring it up, back up, without ruining
your breath, without ruining the flow of your breath. Which we'll get to later. So
you'll find yourself slowly, and then there's this [unclear] where you keep going
like that and very very subtle, without, without changing the flow of your
breath.

[student: you keep doing [unclear]]

You will …as you meditate for a long time, you'll find yourself crunching down.
Cuz your body just, gravity just pulls it down and when you catch yourself you
just slowly bring it back up, Don't do it fast enough to to stop, don't do it fast
enough that your breath has to change. Then you'll, you'll, we'll talk about that
later. Yes, that's number

[students: 3]

Ok [silence] Say {trak-pa} repeat {ngam} repeat {trak-pa} repeat {ngam} repeat.
{trak-pa} means your shoulders. What do you guess {ngam} means?

[student: [straight]]

Yea, level. And that's that's pretty obvious. You know you don't want to be
going like that and you don't want to be going like that. But you might catch
yourself doing that sometime especially depending on how your arms are. And
that he doesn't talk about the arms but the uh it’s the Tibetan tradition that you
set your … if you don't do this your {trak-pas} won't be {nyam} ok? You set your
… you set your left hand out first. Ok like that. And then the right hand goes on
top of that. So left hand down first and then right hand. And then the tradition is
to join your thumbs like that. So left hand down first right hand down first and
then you join your thumbs like that. I used to really get distracted by that
because my thumbs would flop down. Now and I found myself trying to
concentrate to keep my thumbs up, and it became a distraction for me, and i
didn't like it, uh and I was wondering why they made me do it. But what
happens if you if you just personal experience. I don't know how your hands are,
but my hands are not that great I, I found that if I stuck my elbows out little just
a touch then it would force the thumbs up against each other and they would
stay up, without my thinking about my thumbs and ruining my meditation. You
know, so they say they should be joined like that.

[student: could you show it again?]

Like this, But what I found is if, instead of putting your hands like straight, in
which case my thumbs fall down, you force them up agai.., you kind of put your
elbows on a, and I believe that if you meditate a long time you'll find that your
elbows can be a distraction. If they're in too tight uh some heat builds up here
and it becomes uncomfortable so if they're a little bit like, I'm not that extreme,
but if they're a little bit out, that forces your thumbs up against each other and
maybe they say that's why to do that, I don't know. But if, it should keep your
elbows up out away from you body otherwise you're going to get some heat
building up and it'll distract you. And also this supports you, it helps support
your body. If you're in a half lotus, then then one its in the in the pit of your uh
ankle here and its very comfortable and it kind of keeps you up straight.. If I, I
would say if you find the thumb thing distracting, just let them down, ok,
[laughs] If you find you know, you're worried about whether your thumbs are
up, just forget it. But eventually, you can learn, it it'll [unclear]

[student: how, maybe I asked you before, when you put your legs on the
[unclear] what happens if they fall asleep, should you ignore them?]

Yea [student:[unclear] by getting tingling feeling] When you get good you you
realize just forget it. You know, it'll tingle for 7, 8 minutes and then they'll fall
asleep and let them fall asleep, who cares? It's even good, you know, just be
careful when you get up [unclear] broken ankle, I said what happened. He said I
stood up right after [laughter and laughs] His foot went to sleep and he jumped
up, you know the phone rang or something he jumped up and he broke his
[unclear] You have to be careful about that, let it fall asleep, who cares. Also on
personal advice, you get an itch, just watch it. I mean you get a itch just let it go,
don't move and it just goes away, just fades away after 10 seconds [unclear]
You've never let an itch itch for that long but it you know it goes away and
[laughs]

[student: but when your, you have that sense of needles, I find it very
distracting]

yea, it'll go away in about 5 minutes

[student: [unclear] it drives you crazy]

It'll drive you crazy for about 5 minutes

[student: just force yourself] [unclear]

If you're planning planning to sit for a long time. Your gonna have to let it do
that, let it go

[student: you can't change your position for a few minutes and go back
[unclear]] You can't Golinka who is a very good teacher of meditation. When he
does a course, he says get into your position and no one in this room can move
anything for the next two hours. And I remember in Darmsala we did it with
Gelinka under the Dalai Lama's supervision, and one lady just broke into tears,
you know, she was in such pain. But everybody else had a great meditation.
[laughter] So, I mean if you just decide, there's, there's a Buddhist uh custom, in
fact it's what the Buddha did when he sat under the Bodhi tree and he said I'm
gonna sit down on this cushion and I will not get up until I'm enlightened. And I
don't care if I die on this cushion. You know I mean we don't have this uh
resolution, resolve but uh decide, get down on your thing and decide you know,
I'm just not going to move until I'm done. Period. And if you do move you lose
your concentration. You won't be able to get {shamata}. I can tell you that.
Sooner or later …you might as well do it now. Just don't move. If you have to
do a slight, like I said, that's about the most move you can make. Slowly gravity
will push your body down and then you just have to slowly straighten up. But
you have to do it very slowly. Otherwise just decide in your mind, I don't care if
my legs hurt, I don't care if my back hurts, I don't care if my head hurts, I'm just
gunna stay and concentrate. And and as you get better you'll withdraw from
your senses, you won't, you'll be able to just withdraw from those senses. So, it's
not easy. If you're doing a long meditation, and it really hurts for a while. You
have to stop and change your position. You should stop, because then it's just a
distraction. The object is not to be a tough guy, uh and a lot of people think that,
I mean, if, if you can stand it, stand it and take your mind off of it. If it’s
bothering you or distracting you, then move. But when we do meditation in
here you're not going to be able to move. I'll just tell you it works, I've seen it.
Yea [unclear student name]

[student: isn't two hours a little bit of a long meditation?]

Well I want to say one thing, uh, in the begining, you should restrict it to ten to
fifteen minutes. Its like weight lifting, you know, when you first start they say
weight lift for ten minutes then stop. And then, better to do it with long rests
inbetween. Meditation is the same way, at the beginning, forget it, you can't
keep your mind for 5 minutes 10 minutes. If you stay longer than that I predict
you'll get one of the five problems that we're gunna talk about, which is called
{chingwa}, which is this very dangerous buzzed out state where you think you're
meditating well and you're just dulll. You know you're just duh duh duh and
you get up and you say boy that was great [laughter] you know. Very
dangerous. Je Tsong Khapa, he wrote many pages about it this state of mind
that people get into where you're you're just sort of buzzed out and your mind is
actually dull. Like after a big meal. And people sit there for many many hours,
in that state very bad, useless. Real concentration is like is like when you're into
a good movie and you don't know that three hours have gone by. That's real
con..or a good book or good music. That's real concentration, that's what it
would be like
[student: so you [unclear] eat too much] I

'll say that too I mean it just doesn't work after eating, you can't meditate after
eating, forget it.It's like swimming, they tell you to wait a half an hour or
something before you [unclear] I found that too, Really true. It's also not good
to [unclear] when you're very hungry because your stomach [unclear] [laughs]
You have to eat healthy, you have to eat well as you meditate, if you want to
meditate seriously you have to eat well, uh, and you have to watch your body
you have to be healthy. If you're not eating enough you won't be able to
meditate. If you're eating too much and your body is heavy and physically too
too much weight you you won't be able to sit up nice. You have to be just, it's
not vanity to make your body healthy and the right weight for your frame cuz it
helps you meditate right if that's your motivation. It's ta, it's to, be old but still
look young. It won't last very long. [laughter and laughs]

[student: [unclear] have a special meaning why the right is over]

There is some meaning, is some meaning and I …I … I partly I … I haven't read
it in the last few days and partly I know there's some secret meaning but I cannot
tell you that. So so just do it for now.

[student: Michael, a lot of, it seems to me some of the text talk about have your
thumbs at the level of your navel and I find they're way below that unless I
really, I mean I really have to hold my hands up to get them like that]

I think if you're doing a lotus it comes up to about your navel. Let me check it.
[laughs] Yea, if you're doing a lotus its like this, No?

[student: no no way} Maybe you've got short thumbs. [student: [unclear] long
arms unclear]

Yea, I went, they have to be on your legs, so that's [unclear]

[student: you, you've got your fairly close in tho right, your really]

And I like that because the elbows are out a way from the body and that helps.

[student: right]

It helps support you, it's a natural support. And you don't build up heat here.
And you'll find that that bothers you.

[students: what is [unclear]

Excuse me? Uh I wouldn't hold it up in the air because [unclear] you get tired,
won't [unclear] [student: if you're using your mala beads or should you be doing
that [unclear] When you do certain, uh, advanced meditations you're required to
be using your mala beads at some point and and and I thought that would be
distracting but it works ok. But but later when you're developing {shamata}, like
when you see emptiness directly you can't have any bodily action going on. It
won't work So you know if you're doing your mantras and a visualization then
and you have to use your mala, but then stop the mantra and visualize. And
when you get advanced you're allowed to do the mantra mentally, but it takes a
lot of practice. I I haven't … in my long retreat I didn't get to that [laughs].

[student: is there a special posture for doing the mala should it be down in your
hands?} Um [student: cuz I see some people up like this doing it, some on their
knees doing it]

I can't tell you that now [laughs] that's actually tantric you see mantras are
[unclear] and uh this summer after you take that initiation, I can show you the
text and it’s [unclear] you know, you can read it, and there is a special method
OK [unclear] yea, quick question

[student: you know when your legs falling asleep, isn't your body telling you
something that you're going to be doing physical harm or some such thing? Is
there some danger?] I don’t know … I have been doing it for 20 years and I
think I've heard that it’s not good for you. [laughter] I heard its not good for you
but I never had any problem with it but I don't know

[student: I think its more than knees, you know you really can get to bad joint
problems, doing trying to do the lotus or just sitting with your knees bent for
[unclear]

I know I know

[student: I was lame for a week after a meditation [unclear]

I've known people, I've known one lady who came to my class in the beginning,
Linda Jordan and she over did it, she tried to do the hundred thousand
prostrations and they began to hurt her legs and she did not stop and she's
crippled by it. So don't …don't … don't do that but I a full, don't squish yourself
into a full lotus if you're not ready for it, start with a half lotus. If you can't do a
half lotus, it's very very fine to just put both legs down flat on the ground, like
that, left leg inside first and then the right side out. And just flat down on the
ground, that's all right. And when your left leg is in like that slowly this, it'll start
to stretch out here, your tendons will start to stretch out. And then you'll be able
to get it up here and that's that's a half lotus and then you're all right. I I haven't
[laughter] [unclear] should sit up here.

[student:unclear} [student: can I say one] [student: are you demonstrating that:]

I can't do it in the air yet [laughter] It's ok to have the left foot in like that and the
right foot in and then just flat down on the ground.

[student: Indian style]

Yea, but left one inside and right one outside But if and then if you get used to
that these these tendons around your knees will loosen up and then put it up on
the side like that. And then later say if you meditate an hour a day you'll be able
to do a full lotus there but I I haven't found that and I've tried a long time. I
found that it was mostly distracting, to me, the pain. But if you can do it, God
bless, it's a good thing. It's a very good thing.

[student: can I say something about the knees in the full lotus? You know I
know some people who have who have been trying to do full lotus for many
decades. And when you do full lotus, this, you can really damage your knees
because your knees are your shock absorbers when you walk and you're
supposed to stretch your hips out and loosen your hips to be able to do full lotus.
So if you try to do full lotus, you can really stretch the tendons in your knees
which will cause you knee damage, you know, knee problems later in life.]

If you're not ready, yea, if your not ready, but build up to it and it's the best, you
know but if you force yourself into it and try to be a tough guy and it hurts like
hell and then you pop something, that's ridiculous, that's stupid, you're not
supposed to hurt your body, this is a sacred body.

[student: Yoga Journal published a couple of years ago a set of exercises to build
up the lotus posture if people are interested]
That's right, maybe you can find, can you bring it?

[student: yea]

OK, but I … I … I really wouldn't want to, I mean it's not, don't don't sit there
saying oh my god I'm not doing lotus, half lotus is fine. If you can't do it, if
you're not comfortable, put them down flat. If you, if you have a medical
problem, sit in a chair. Sit up right, in a nice, in a nice uh chair, in a nice cushion.
Don't lean back if you can help it. And you know, if you have serious problems
with your legs or knees or back, you can find that you can do a very good
meditation sitting up very straight in a , not in an easy chair, ok [laughter and
laughs] but you know in a pretty straight backed chair with your feet flat down
and it works.

[student: but Michael I have a problem with my lower back]

uh huh

[student: if I sit in that position and I don't feel any discomfort then it's ok, I'm
not doing anything to my body, as long as I don't feel the pain, it's ok?]

Yea as long as when you get up you don't feel any bad effects, you're [unclear].
They'll be some pain and you gotta toughen up, you know, later on in the text,
Tsong Khapa says you know come on this is something important. But you
have to use good judgement. You know, a lot of Buddhist practice is good
judgement and like my lama is always saying that Rinpoche is always saying
that, just use your common sense, you know, don't hurt yourself. And then on
the other hand, don't be a lazy, don't be gutless you know. Stick it out for a little
bit. You'll find that if you stick out the pain for a few days or something, you
won't have it after a while. When you start a long retreat, you always get some
pain, somewhere, like some kind of sciatica or something. And it hurts a lot, but
you just keep going, you've got to keep going, so

[student: It doesn't have to be anything, its going out and start to run without
any practice or stretching or loosening up, you'll have pain. If you take it easy,
you stretch, massage is very good for your legs, when I was in Thailand it got so
I could sit in a full lotus with no trouble for as long as I wanted. I want to go
back real soon. But there's ways of doing it, if anybody wants to talk to me
about it.]
Yea sure

[student: what was five]

Am I on [students talking] I'm sorry [unclear] we got four right?

[students: yea]

[silence]

The one thing you can say about all of this stuff it that if you don't do it every
day, you won't be good at it. You won't get any of this stuff if you don't do it
every day. And if you do do it every day, you'll find the adjustments that you
need to make yourself, after a while. You have to do it every day. It's like
running or weightlifting or dance or whatever.

{Go, go} means head.
{mito} means, uh, not high up and {mima}means not bent down. Your head
shouldn't be cocked back and it shouldn't be bent down. It should be just
straight. The same section says, by the way, that it shouldn't be off to the left or
off to the right either.

[silence]

[student: so this thing that I've always heard of the chin slightly tucked is not
accurate]

I haven't seen that

[student: yea, it was in Nine Ways of Resting the Mind, was that the text? It's a
classic meditation text] [student: I don't know about the meditation text but
people tend to stick their head out a little to far forward so that gravity pulls
your head down and if you slightly tuck your chin back then you're supporting it
with your spinal cord. You're like resting it and then you don't have to hold it up,
but I don't know about that]

Ah, wait, we'll get to something similar. We'll see if he covers it, it's gonna come
maybe later on. So it used to say, it says over your navel in a line over your
navel and I used to wonder what that meant.
[student noise in background]
They used to tell us in Dharmsala if water dripped off your nose it should hit
your navel but that's too far back for me, I don't know about you, maybe they
had a long nose, but uh, but I reading Tsong Khapa's text it seems pretty clear
that, he's talking about the centering of the head vertically. It shouldn't be off to
the left side. It shouldn't be off to the right side. It shouldn't be bent down. It
should be up, it should be, it should be over the,if the navel is here, you could
draw a straight line up to your head, and what what I've found, what I, what
experientially I think you'll find, if you're just a little bit, if you're sitting up
straight, it's its its that your head really is placed over your navel vertically. You
know if you drew a straight line up 45 degrees from the ground, it would come
out thru your head. So like that, but his main point is shouldn't be to the left
shouldn't be to the right shouldn't be bent down, very distracting, some people
end up meditating like that, you know, and that's very distracting. You'll hurt
your body. That number?

[students: five]

Five.

[silence]

Say {so chu} [ repeat] {rang luk} [repeat] Ok

{so} means your teeth and {chu} means your lips.
{rang luk} means in this case, although it has philosophical meanings in other
cases, however they are naturally. What do you thnk it means? Their natural
position for you.

This is something really really important and you wouldn't think it's important
but the tendency is that you keep your mouth shut and tight and you can feel it
here. You know you're meditating and you're going, like that, and you'll feel a
little tightness here. That's very bad. It really is distracting. When you get good
you your lips will be a little bit open, just the way you normally, if you're
watching a really good movie, you know [laughter] and that's really the way it
is, that's really the way your mouth should be, it should be totally unconscious,
you know and and it's a little bit open. And they say that keeps you from getting
thirsty along with the next one

[students talking unclear]
And by the way,you never breathe thru your mouth when you meditate. You
never breathe thru your mouth, your throat will get dry and what will you do?

[student: swallow]

You'll swallow and as you get deeper into meditation that sounds like a truck
going by. You know, you don't want to be swallowing. You will have to swallow
from time to time but you don't want to cause anything that's gonna make you
swallow all the time. So the the lips and the teeth are just natural, exactly like if
you were in concentration on a movie or a book, it's like a little bit open and it's
just loose. You know, the tendency when you meditate is like that. And that will
distract you. And it doesn't mean to leave your mouth open like that cuz
Rinpoche says you'll get flies in your mouth [laughter] and also your mouth will
get dry. Then you'll swallow and then distract, then you'll hear it and then you'll
break your concentration. We're up to number seven, right?

[silence]

{che} means tongue {ya soy} means upper teeth, these teeth here, the upper
teeth as apposed to the lower teeth, these teeth here and not these teeth and {ya
soy to} means keep it in that area, keep it up in that area, which is natural when
you're concentrating your like, and your tongue is just tucked up in your palate.
The way it is naturally, you know you don't want it sticking out [unclear], it's just
natural, it’s stuck up into your, into the palate, and that also keeps you from
getting thirsty, and don't … don't think about it you know, don't read this and
try to do something with your tongue. It's the way your tongue normally is
when you close your mouth, almost have your mouth closed.

[student: so you don't have to touch the top of your mouth with your tongue or
anything like that?]

No, but the teeth, you are touching your teeth with the tip aren't you, or the
base of the teeth right?

[student: that's supposed to be very good for your immune system, that
position?]

Oh yea? [unclear] How come I got a cold then [laughs] Just kidding. {tjo} means
in that area. {sha ka tung do} is the only other place it occurs and that means at
your lotus teeth, in the area of your lotus, so like that

[student: will you pronounce that whole thing [unclear]

Just this part here? {che ya tsu trung} [repeat] [repeat] [students: unclear] Yea,
but itself, {so} and with this it's {soy} {che ya tsu tung} The main this is tho keep
your mouth natural, slightly open, do not, like that, tight, it'll distract you, it'll
actually hurt you.

[cut]

But in the Lam Rim Chomo, which is the greatest book ever written in Tibetan,
he talks about the eight part posture, he includes it, and then later he, either he
or Pabonka explains that it, some texts say seven some say eight and it's the
[unclear] that's difficult. Yea. I'm just going to write one word because it's a long
story. [students: {ook?} [laughter]
[student; what does it mean?]

{Uk} means breath, and I can't make it short for your it's a whole sentence and I
can't [unclear]. This is a whole story in itself. The source, and you don't have to
write this down, the source for this is the {Abhidharmakosha by {Vasabandhu}
350 AD [laughter] You don't have to know that. Just so you know it, the brother
of [laughter]

[students: Asanga]

The breath is a long story. The first thing to know is that, contrary to what you
would expect, when you count your breath, which is also taught in the
[Abhidharmakosha}, you count the outward breath as the first half and the
inward breath as the second half. But its not like [inhale. exhale] one [inhale,
exhale] two it's the opposite of that, yea it does matter, its very important later.

[student: but when you start breathing you start also out and then in right? Or
not]

I, you'll have to ask my mother. [laughter] I don't remember. I don't know,
which one came first? Anyway, when you count your breath, you count the out,
it's counted [exhale, inhale] one [exhale, inhale] two. Ok like that. Always
breathe thru you nostrils. The purpose of the breathing, and we'll get in to it,
we're not now talking technically about the ten, the count-to-ten breath
meditation. That's a different subject. There is a meditation where you watch
your breath, and you count up to 10, we'll talk about that later, ok, it's to change
gears between what and what? Between my office and my meditation [laughs]
you have to do that. It's not a meditation in itself and nobody meant it to be. It
was taught by [Vasabandhu} He didn't mean for people to sit there for 5 hours
and watch their breath. It was meant and it's stated in the text that it's a go-
between, because obviously your breath is not what?

[student: good object]

Not a Holy object. [laughs] it's a good object when you're changing gears. You
use it to put your mind into neutral and then you focus your mind on a better
object. But its very important and it might take you three hours to get up to 10.
You're supposed to count 10 breaths with perfect concentration And if you're
honest you might never get past five. And often times I found myself doing 14
[laughs] It's funny.

[student: out in is one?]

Yea, out in is one, it's not like, you know, when you are swimming if you [pants]
It's very important, later it's very important.

[Silence]

[laughter] [unclear] So…Tsong khapa says a few characteristics of the breath
should be very very slow. Very very slow. As you get better in meditation, you
will be able to hear your breath whistling past your nose hair. It will sound loud
and distracting. As you get deeper into meditation, you have to slow your
breath down or else it distracts the hell out of you, drives you crazy. Ok, but as
you get better at meditation, you'll start to hear the air going past the hairs in
your nose. And the object is that you breathe slow enough that you don't hear
that any more because they're not going by the hairs fast enough to make a
noise. You can't do that right away and it's considered very bad to try to force
your breath. You shouldn't try to force your breath, you shouldn't try to
breathe slower than what your body wants you to breathe, you know, don't sit
down and immediately try to breathe slow. You know, let the body calm down,
let the heart slow down, and then you'll start breathing slower. If you have any
thoughts about the guy at work that you don't like, if you have any thoughts of
desire, if you have anything on your conscience, you might find that your breath
will never slow down. It's kind of strange. You know, if you're not, if you haven't
done your preliminaries well, you might find that you can't keep your breath at
a certain pace. So it's import, that's probably why the preliminaries are good. So
you're breathing out first, in first, try to go slower and slower. When you get to
a deeper point of mediation, you'll see, you'll be able to imagine the breath as
like a big piece of silly putty and its like one unit that keeps moving up, I don't
know how to describe it like oil, but its like a pint of oil that never leaves your
body. It goes up and a little bit hangs here and it goes out and then it comes
back in and you suck it back in, and it's the same, like the same air, you just keep
moving it back and forth. You know, you get this motion or this feeling of the
air going down as a piece and then coming up as a piece, like a big thick piece of
jello or something. And it's just, it's the same air coming up and down like a
piston you know its coming out and in, the same air's coming in and out. And
that, the front part of that air starts to get longer and longer. You know, the tip
of the air I think goes out when you're first getting fairly deep in meditation, it's
going out about this far and then coming in. And then its going out about this
far. If you put a red flag on the first part of the breath, you, you can feel it
coming out about that far. And as you meditate better, and you get better and
better in meditation, say 3, 4 heart beats between breaths, it starts stretching out.
And it'll go a long way. Should you try to force that, no. If you meditate every
day well, you'll start to experience that. So they say don't try to force it, into oh
Michael said I should get it two feet out, you know. [laughter] Then it becomes a
distraction and you shouldn't be forcing it. You should never be, that you're
trying to force your breath into doing something. Then what happens is that
when you're first meditating their not equal. Like you'll be, it won't be going out
as far as it's coming in. Normally when you breathe, you're breathing too short.
If you're going [he takes breaths] as you start to meditate better it'll be [silent
breaths] and the breaths stop, breath stop [unclear] starting again. And it comes
all the way down and they will become equal. The length it goes out and the
length it feels like its going down become equal but you shouldn't try to force it,
don't try to force it. And that'll be like, let me see like four heart beats on the
way out, you know. [student: what if you're] Maybe 6 heart beats, some eight,
nine, ten, you build up.

[student: is there a pause in between and when its all]

Slightly, slight pause,

[student: the way out]

very slight pause Like [makes noise], like a California stop, [laughs] exactly,
really you know like a brief stop and then go, not a full stop.

[student: if you're naturally a mouth breather should you just force yourself to]

Well there's certain cases where you can breathe thru your mouth, if you have
some kind of a nose problem, people do, you know, I mean we have a lady out
in New Jersey she has a nasal problem she can't do it. You have to breathe thru
your, again it's common sense, you have to use your common sense. If you
have any physical problem that you can't do one of these things exactly the way
you have to, forget it. Buddhism is all, especially you guys who get to study the
[vinaya} later when you become a monk or a nun [laughter] that';s … {vinaya} is
the rules for monks and its full of exceptions based on common sense. Common
sense says, you know, some way you're not supposed to touch a lady's hand. If
some lady sticks her hand out to the Dalai Lama, he shakes her hand, you know
I mean its common sense you have to use your common sense. So, so the breath
is going out and then its coming in and you'll learn to make it to your heart beat,
and the number of beats on the way out and the number of beats on the way in
will become the same. And you won't get any of this happening if you don't
practice. You have to keep practicing like that.

[student: just a reminder, last class didn't you say we would possible learn to
become Buddhas with out becoming nuns and monks] [laughter]

You know when you take your vows, you go in a room and they say never tell
laymen this but you have to become a monk to become a Buddha [laughter] No,
I didn't

[student: yea we had this big discussion]

Drontompa, Atisha's greatest student, was, never became a monk, so don't
worry.

[student: you mean never in that particular life that we know about]

[unclear] could have been a life that we gave [unclear] Anyway, person [unclear]
monastery, in front of which Tsong Khapa taught the [unclear]. So anyway,
that's a basic breath, and it's very very important, the breath becomes very very
important for you and you focus on the breath. And you focus on the breath for
a certain amount of breaths then you shift the line to the object of your
meditation. And we'll talk about that when we get to the object. I think it's a
good point to take a break, and when you come back, we'll just try to sit for a
while. I've always wanted to do this in this class and now it's time. Time came,
you know.

[student: sit [unclear]] [student: and meditate]

[cut]
Other wise its very hard to get clean glasses. We used to have a lot of problem
before [unclear] so that's what [unclear] The seat is extremely important.
Meditation seat is extremely important. The back should be slightly higher than
the front. That keeps your spine up straight.

[student: Michael, is this any part of the eight]

No its not, it in the [unclear] its in the [unclear]. And it’s not in other books and
it’s not in the oral tradition in the monastery but the back of the seat should be
up higher than the front and that forces your back to sit up. It forces you to sit
up straight. If your, if your legs are in that posture are a little bit forced on a
plane going slightly down, it forces your back up straight, it’s very good
[unclear] I like to keep a mat like that. I found for long [unclear] you keep
something like that down first and then put your seat on top of that. And what
this does is keep your legs warm cuz your legs aren't on the seat and uh if they
touch the floor it also cuts off your circulation so if you don't like your legs falling
asleep, you might try that. It's just a thin one that's big and it covers the full lotus,
you know, it covers all the way up to your knees so in that way I found my legs
don't fall asleep any more, because there's something under even the outside of
my leg. And it also keeps them warm, if you just have, if you have your butt up
on a seat and then you have your knees, your legs up against the linoleum or
something it's very distracting, it doesn't work right. So its very good to have
that, it's got to be perfectly smooth, I used to think about the story of the lady
and the pea in the bed [laughs and laughter] You know when you meditate for a
long time, and I'm not talking five hours I'm saying every day for 15-20 minutes
or a half an hour, when you get good at it, the way you get good is that you do a
little bit every day, its like exercise, its like dieting, its like weight lifting, its like
anything that you want to get good at. It's not thru these 5 hour sessions once a
week. It's thru 15 hours sessions every single day with never breaking it and
even if you don't feel like getting up, get up, even if you don't feel like doing the
preliminaries, do them and you'll get used to it and what will happen is it'll force
a change in the priorities in your life which is also desirable you know you'll start
thinking I'd better get to bed now or else I'm gunna have a lousy meditation
tomorrow, and and you'll start to change your priorities and that's fine and then
when the phone rings you won't answer it cuz this is real important. And you
have to do that, you have to carve out the time and make it sacred and you do it,
you do it for eating you do it for pooping you know you set aside time every
day. Don't tell me you don't have 15 minutes, it's a lie. Ok so don't eat that day, I
don't mind, because it's more important to meditate. It really is. It really is. But
we got our priorities messed up. No one ever, you can always tell em that when
a client is calling I'm in the bathroom, you know, going to the bathroom. No
one ever in the world says, your boss doesn't say you have, if you say you have
to go to the bathroom they don't say sit down you can't go to the bathroom.
Now meditate, and its weird, your priorities are, thats more priority than your
meditation. [student: I don't get that, Michael, you imply that we should meditate
in the bathroom?] [laughter] One other thing is that you have made parts sacred
in your life, all your sacred times, your bathroom time, the shower time, and
your uh, what was the third one?

[student: eating]

Your eating time, you make it sacred, you find time, don't you? Doesn't
everybody? You know you do find time for those things. Don't tell me their not
15 minutes. You have 15 minutes to eat, or ½ an hour to eat twice or three times
a day and you have time to go to the bathroom and meditation is more
important. It really is.

[student: I'm not trying to find an excuse but for example you say the best time
to meditate is the morning when your mind is fresh, but for me it takes me an
hour or two sometimes to wake up and then I have to go to work]

You're not really [unclear] or do it at night. I mean some people meditate better
at night. I, tradition is to meditate in the morning, but it's not, its not fixed, again,
common sense. If you're a night person and its really nice and quite in your
neighborhood at midnight and you can stay up tol midnight and you don't have
to get up till late in the morning, just do it at night if it works better. There's
nothing that says that you, it's common sense. Dharma is a lot of common
sense. It think a lot of people miss that. You know that, ok, so here we can do a
little meditation.

[student: could you tell me what the [cusha] grass]

Why it works?
[student: or [unclear] where is it?]

[laughter]

[student: I've got some of that but just one strand of it]

That's all you need. You need like two-three strands or one [unclear] and you
put it down like if I've got this and I'm gunna put a cushion over it. Put it down
and put the cushion over it.
[students: unclear]

yea, no, I'm talking to the cushion.

[student: somebody mentioned putting it under your mattress too when you
sleep at night]

That's especially during certain special programs.

[student: initiations]

Ok, so we'll try to meditate a bit, so put your books away.

[student: so what'll I do?]

In Thailand if you're wearing a short skirt, they give you a blanket, right, when
you go into a temple … I don't know, you can sit like that maybe, it's ok.

[silence]

Next time you know if you want, you know sweat pants are really good. Robes
are great. [laughter]. Loose jeans are good

[student laughter and talking]

Ok, so left foot up here, right foot down there. And you can get one of the, if
you cannot get it up on your thigh, let them both down flat, that's fine. Then left
hand down first, right hand on top of that, if you can join your thumbs like this,
put your thumbs up like that joined.
[student: what was the second thing?] [student:eyes]

Janet, no cross eyes, ok? [laughs] [laughter] Ok they're loose. Body up straight.
The third one?

[student: shoulder]

Yea, third was body up straight and keep it up straight. And this actually helps,
this is like a support for your arms. And then, uh, what was the forth one, oh,
shoulders straight across. And then your teeth should be, your mouth very very
very slightly cracked open and your tongue up against your [unclear] just
normal. Then we'll just count breaths ok, and that's how you get into your
meditation, so count out as one, out and back as one. Try to get up to ten. The
point is that your mind shouldn't be distracted to something else before you
reach ten. If it does get distracted, stop, and go back to one again. All right? And
you might find that in a whole hour you'll never get to ten, if you're honest.

[student: [unclear] open the door ever so slightly to increase the oxygen]

I think the window downstairs is cracked open.

[End of tape]
940228-1.aaa
Course III: Applied Meditation