ACI 17 (обзорный курс), Занятие 8 (замещающий преподаватель, Нью-Йорк) — стенограмма

Class 8, part 1
Transcribed by: Karen Becker

(student, John Stilwell) So Geshe Michael is out of town. He'll
be back on Thursday. So we have to be able to fill in for him
while he's away. And tonight's class is on Vinaya...which I have
to admit, I'm a little nervous about 'cause it's not one of my
specialities (laughter), but I'll give it a shot, you know. That
ethical way of life, you know, it's tricky. So. It's actually,
I think, I hope it'll be interesting because tonight it's
interesting for several reasons, one of which is the material
tonight includes how to behave towards the Lama, you know, how to
evaluate a Lama and how to tell if you have a a good one or not,
so...it's interesting that Geshe Michael absented himself tonight
(laughter) (laughs) you know. So we can say anything we want,
you know, we can really talk (laughs) and I I actually I would
encourage you to really be frank and mix it up, you know. I
think it's a good opportunity to really...if you have some some
things which are bothering you about Lamas, or how or or how to
relate to a Lama or the Tibetan Buddhist notion of putting a lot
of faith in a Lama, or you know, sort of giving it all up to a
Lama in terms of, you know, really giving yourself to him after
checking him out, all those sorts of thing. Tonight's a prime
opportunity to really get into it and I think probably everyone
who has spent any time around a Lama has got lots of (laughs)
feelings about this subject. So so don't be shy. It's a great
opportunity tonight to to really get into it and and maybe see if
we can make some progress and get into some some meaty, dirty,
interesting conversation (laughs) (laughter). Be fun for me...or
maybe not. I don't know. So, in any case, I'll continue a
little bit with the first half of the vinaya class. The first
half of the vinaya class was the pratimoksha vows, the eight
different classes of individual freedom vows, which, I believe
they've all been covered...am I am I correct...yeah. Okay. So,
in the original vinaya class Geshe Michael spent the first first
half of the class talking about the pratimoksha vows and then the
second half of the vinaya class a couple of weeks...he actually
did (lam rim) study. So I'm not gonna go go into (lam rim) so
much because probably you've all heard it a lot and and (lam rim)
review was already done in an earlier course. So so I'm gonna
recap a little bit on the on the homework questions and the the
elements of the vinaya, and then we'll get into this Lama thing,
you know, and see how that goes. Main points in terms of
studying vinaya, you know, why study vinaya. In the this in the
Hinayana system the main reason for studying vinaya is to attain
nirvana by by keeping your vows you can eliminate your mental
afflictions and attain nirvana and the vinaya is
oriented...keeping, studying the vinaya and keeping the vows
detailed in the eight pratimoksha vows, eight sets of
pratimoksha vows, that primarily addresses misdeeds of body and
speech and not so much of mind. It's bodhisattva vows and and
highest vows, secret vows, (tantr)ic vows which address misdeeds
of mind moreso than the vinaya. They're called individual
freedom vows because if you keep them they lead you to freedom,
to nirvana. That's the idea. Nirvana, for those of you who
don't know, is a complete cessation, a complete removal of all of
your bad thoughts, all of you mental afflictions, all of your
anything which would ever disturb your mind would be ended. To
just to recap what the eight classes of pratimoksha vows are,
individual freedom vows are, you have one-day vows, you have
lifetime layman's vows, you have lifetime laywoman's vows, you
have novice monks vows, you have novice nun's vows, you have
intermediate nun's vows, you have full nun's vows and you have
full monk's vows. So, once you've got the vows, once you've
taken the vows, the study of vinaya covers how you get the vows,
how you keep the vows, how you break the vows, and what you do to
restore the vows and we can't really go into any of those things
because you require ordination to get into the details. So the
idea of this course was to give an overview just to understand it
from a broader perspective without breaking any of the vows of
the of the monks by talking about the details. So. I'm gonna,
althought I'm not a Tibetophile myself, and I don't speak
Tibetan, I'm going to be diligent and provide all of the Tibetan
materials for those of you who do like Tibetan, so when you
have...once you do have the individual freedom vows, how do you
lose them? What can cause any of the vows to be broken or lost?
The first thing is called (la pa pul), you say (la pa pul)
(repeat)...come on, (la pa pul) (repeat), all right, (la pa) is
"precepts" (pul) is "to offer", it means that you formally give
them back. You actually undergo a ceremony, you recite words
from a scripture where you official and formally give your vows
back...I'm gonna zip through this stuff because it's not really
relevant to my life...'cause I'm not a monk, but Dr. Sykes, you
might be interested. The second is (shi pu) (repeat), please say
(shi pu) (repeat). (Shi) is "dying" and (pu) is
"transmigrating". Moving on, ie you died, you lost it. It's
pretty straight forward, where you move on to, you know...another
matter. Please say (seng nye jung) (repeat) (seng nye jung)
(repeat) (Seng) is "sex organ". (Nye) is "two" and (jung) is
"if they appear". What does that mean? (laughs) Any guesses.
(laughs. No. Okay. That's if you're if you were born with two
sex organs. It has to do with your with your subtle body, with
your energetic body, if you were born without a male or female
system...

(student: (unclear))

Huh?

(student: Then you can't get ordained.)

Then you can't get ordained in the first place. So what does
this mean?

(student: This is if it grows.)

Oh, I'm sorry. That means if it grows afterwards, okay. There
you go. As I said, not too relevant to my life, I hope (laughs)
(laughter). Okay. So. The next way you get rid of you
individual freedom vows (laughter)...what happened there? Yeah.
Nothing yet. I hope. Yeah. Please say (len sum gyur) (repeat)
(len sum gyur), (repeat) so (len) is "times", (sum) is "three"
and (gyur) is "change". This means if you really like surgery
and you change your sex three times, okay. Or if you have
mystical abilities to change your gender otherwise. Which I
presume was the case back in the...thousand years ago. Un huh?

(student: To keep your vows you can only change your sex twice?)

Bingo. You got it. (laughs) You're there, you know. You
cha...you can switch genders, feel like you would have rather
been the original gender and go back and you're still okay,
(laughs).

(student: Right. Yeah. Yeah?)

(student: How many (unclear) (laughter))

Fair enough.

(student: Are you talking about (unclear)?)

No, no, not at all. This these are this is from the scripture
from, you know, fifteen hundred years ago where they listed the
things which would cause monks and nuns to lose their ordination,
and, at the time, as as a result of advanced meditative abilities
and other things, it was possible to change gender and things
like that...where a man could change himself into a woman, etc,
and so these are just re quickly recapping what the rules of the
sutra are for monks and nuns which which outline, "if you do
these things, you'll lose your ordination, you'll break your
vows". That that's all.

(student: Are you talking about castration?)

It's not it's it's to my knowledge, it's not spe spe

(student: Is this gonna be on the homework?) (laughter)

(laughs) Well, you don't have to explain it. You just have to
list it. (laughs) (laughter) It is on the homework. You just
have to itemize five things, that's all. No explanation
necessary, thankfully. That's why I'm gonna zip through them
because I don't have

(student: (unclear) exactly the word, you said (unclear))

On having both sex sexual organs appear on your body. That's how
it's it's described.

(student: You mean like male and female?)

Male and female. Yeah. Yeah. This is really gonna be a
resilient question, Dr Sykes.

(student, Dr. Sykes: No, I)

Okay. (laughs) We'll pass (laughter). Okay. Please say, (ge tsa
che) (repeat) (laughs) (ge tsa che) (laughs) (repeat). You lose
your core of virtue. (Ge) is "virtue", (tsa) is "root of" and
(che) is "cut". Your core. You cut your root of virtue

(student: (unclear))

Yeah. There you go. Sure. I often wonder if anybody really
copies this Tibetan down. I guess they do. (laughs) They do.
I don't mean to discourage you from studying Tibetan, by the way.
I'm I should keep my (laughs). I really want to get to the Lama
stuff so I'm just gonna move through this. Sorry? Huh?

(student: (unclear))

I was afraid somebody was gonna ask me that. (laughs) When it
when you cut when you lose your core of virtue, it means you hold
wrong views, Puntsok? Basically you do something really wrong
which cuts your basic connection, like believing that karma
doesn't exist, believing that...having wrong views about
emtpiness, that type of thing. That's how you cut your core of
virtue. Yeah, Dr. Sykes?

(student, Dr. Sykes: (unclear))

All right. He's gonna pass. Are you guys done with this
transparency? Yeah.

(student, Dr. Sykes: Let's go on)

Dr. Sykes is gonna be my nemesis, you know, he's he's making
faces at me, he's trying to see if he can unnerve me up here, so,
we'll see how we do (laughs), so please say (ne kap) (repeat)
(dre bu) (repeat) (hla mi) (repeat) (ne kap dre bu hla mi)
(repeat). This is one of the results of keeping your vows. If
you keep your vows nicely, then you have two results, and this is
the first one. (Ne kup) means "in the short term", (dre bu)
means "the result", the (hla) is "deva" or angel, and (mi) is
"human". If you keep your vows you have a higher birth. You
have a birth as a human or a deva, a a an angelic type being, a
pleasure being, a being of a higher realm, and the second result
of keeping your vows...please say (jang chub) (repeat) (sum)
(repeat) (jang chub sum) (repeat). (Sum) is "three" and (jang
chub) is "enlightenment", means that you attain one of the three
enlightenments. Any ideas what the three enlightenments are?
Yeah. Good. It's the two, the at

taining either of...it's called the "total enlightenment" which
is Buddhahood or it is attaining the "enlightenment of a
listener" or the "enlightenment of the self-made Buddha"...in the
Hinayana path they consider nirvana to be enlightenment and the
Mahayana path there's a different enlightenment, so between
Hinayana and Mahayana enlightenment is not the same thing, and so
what is a what is a listener...what is the nirvana of a listener?
What is the enlightenment of a listener? It means someone who
has listened to the teachings and become enlightened as a result
and the self-made Buddha is someone who has not had a teacher
teach them and yet they still become enlightened. So now, ho how
is that possible. How is it possible to become enlightened if no
one teaches you...isn't that sort of contrary to what's what's
taught and to what's said?
(student, Ann Lindsey: You have no teacher in this lifetime but
you have had many in previous lives)

Yes, Ann Lindsey points out correctly you have no teacher in that
lifetime. You cannot become enlightened unless someone leads you
along the way, leads you along the path. And so a self-made
Buddha is someone who in their current life, their present life
has not had a teacher in person but in their previous lifetimes
they've had extensive extensive extensive teachings and so
they're very ripe, they've accumulated tremendous amounts of
knowledge and progress in their spiritual path and in that
lifetime they become enlightened on the nirvana track, meaning
they attain nirvana. What is nirvana? Nirvana means that you
have a complete cessation of all mental afflictions. Your mind
is in a space which is very happy and blissful and nothing
bothers it or disturbs it. That's nirvana. The difference with
the enlightenment of Mahayana path is that you have the same type
of mental happiness or bliss but you have the bodhisattva
activity. You have the aspiration to help all beings and so you
have countless emanation bodies and form bodies and activities to
to set out and to undertake assisting all existing beings to
eliminate their suffering. So that's the difference between the
nirvana enlightenment and the Maha...and the total enlightenment.
 Yeah Jo Jo?

(student, Jo jo: Does a listener become enlightened by just
listening and without practicing meditation?)

So the question was, "does a listener become enlightened only by
listening and not by meditating?" Good question. I don't know.
Anybody know? Dido? You gotta...you don't know, oh you had a
question? Do you know Elly?

(student, Ven. Elly: They're called 'listeners' because they can
listen to Mahayana but they can't practice it".

But in terms of becoming enlightened though?

(student, Ven Elly: No, they practice)

Meditated? Meditate practice?

(student, Ven Elly: I think the reason they're called 'listeners'
is that (unclear)

So, Elly was saying, "yeah, they...she said they do practice, but
do they have to practice...well, I don't know. I don't think
there's a there's a definitive conclusion that they have to
practice. Logically speaking, according to the laws of karma, it
 seems to me they would have to meditate and they would have to
practice. Elly pointed out that if you're a listener, you listen
to Mahayana but you don't practice it. Is another element of
that. Yeah...Arie.

(student, Arie: (unclear)

I'm sorry?

(student, Arie: Other teachings say if you are going to move to
other paths, it is done when you are meditating.)

Yeah, Arie was saying that, you know, according to the other
teachings, if you are going to move from path to path or level to
level, and have any realizations and attainments that it can only
happen in deep meditation, so if you're going to attain nirvana,
that that would have to happen during meditation. So...I mean I
can...we can...logically think it out. I couldn't say from a
direct scriptural reference that, yeah, Je Tsongkapa said, da da
da da da da, you know, that's a definitive answer. So Nanette
was saying, "well, she thought that if you had a lot of virtue
you would always have teachers around". And so how karmically
would have enough virtue to attain nirvana but not have enough
virtue to have a teacher present to lead you there...like that?

(student, Nanette: To see them)

To to see them, yeah. Yeah. You know, you collect karma in
relationship to different beings and different objects. And so
if you're going to have a teacher around, you're have to collect
karma in relationship to a teacher, you know, serving a teacher
properly is the karmic cause for having a teacher. It's possible
in, you know there's there's so many trillions and trillions and
trillions of karma in your mindstream and the permutations of
their combination are vast, you know, and do you have enough
karmic seeds of a particular type so that they will configure and
arise for a particular kind of perception. Well, that will
determine your perception, you know. If you have the the the mix
of karma to to not see a teacher, than that's what you'll see.
That's the only way it could be. So you could at the same time
have enough virtue to see yourself as being quite blissed out and
happy, but not have the virtue to see someone, or not have the
karmic imprints to project a being there who is leading you along
the way, you know. And we're we're gonna talk more about that
later actually, you know. What is the karma...what happens
karmically when you're around the teacher, you know. Is it a
good thing or is it a bad thing, you know? Like that. So.
Those are the two the two results of keeping your vows. Now on
your homework there's a lot of information about the karmic
consequences of keeping your vows or not keeping your vows, and I
don't really want to get into it too much...I'm gonna let you
guys go over that during the discussion groups, but basically
there are three karmic...there are three results of karma, three
types of result that karma brings to you, and on your homework it
asks you, "what are the correlations of each of the ten non-
virtues and each of the three karmic consequences, you know, if
you kill, what are the three levels of karmic consequence of
killing, okay? The three different types or levels of karmic
consequence are, one, that it creates your environment, whatever
you do creates your environment. Okay there's an environmental
result to a karma. The second is, there's a personal result, you
experience something yourself, okay? And the third is that you
have a predisposition or a habit which you create in yourself to
behave a certain way in the future, okay. So those are the three
types of karmic consequence, and so on your homework, and you can
talk about it in your discussion groups if you like, on your
homework it's, you know, they wanna know what the three different
consequences are of each of the ten non-virtues, you know, if you
kill, if you steal, if you sexual misconduct, if you lie, etc.,
okay? Sexual misconduct, for example, just to just to to mention
it briefly, the environmental result of sexual misconduct...does
anybody know?

(students: You live in an unpleasant place)

You live in a stinky place. (laughs). You have a lot of
pollution, you have a lot of unpleasant smells, a lot of
unpleasant visual sites, like that. What is the...personal
result, if you engage in sexual misconduct? What happens to you?

(students: (unclear))

I heard a whispering but missed it.

(students: Difficult relationships)

Yeah, you can't have a relationship, you can't keep a
relationship. If you, if you steal love, essentially, you know,
if you take someone from another person, then you will not be
able to keep love yourself. You will not be able to keep a
relationship yourself. You know, you will have a lot of
competition for your mate. Your mate will be easily distracted,
wandering, you know, you'll lose your mate...they'll be
interested in other people, like that. So, and what is the the
sort of the the other consequence, the the the habit that you
generate if you do that? Anybody know?



(student: You create jealousy)

You create jealousy? Yeah. That's one idea. Anybody else have
any ideas?

(students: (unclear))

Yeah. You you create people around you who are undependable,
people who are inconsistent and you have the habit yourself of
sort of wandering, you know. There's a lot of inconsistency.
Okay. So that's the idea. In in your discussion groups, if you
want to you can go through the ten the ten, yeah, Elizabeth?

(student, Elizabeth: (unclear))

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's yeah, so Elizabeth was saying
there are three consequences that were talked about before as the
result of karma. One is, if you do it...if you do a negative
karma strongly, you'll go...really intensely, you you end up in a
in a in a really suffering realm like a hell realm. If you do a
karma with a medium degree of intensity, you know, you end up in
a moderately bad realm, and if you do a a kar...a negative deed
with a very light intensity, you know, maybe not even aware that
you're doing it, that you know, that you'll have perhaps a an
animal birth or or suffering human birth. So her question was,
how does that fit in, you know...how does that fit in with these
three things? It's a different classification. It's a different
grouping basically. They basically just say negative karmas have
three results in that way and negative karmas have three results
in this way, and what you're talking about is just where you're
going to, you know, in the future, in future births and what
they're talking about here is what happens to you in your future
birth. What the result is in your future birth. What it's like
in your future birth. Like that, okay. So, there're several
pages of this, it's...good luck in the discussion groups and on
your homework. (laughter) There are four special qualities to
the teachings on enlightenment, the (lam rim) teachings and I'm
just wanna touch on those basely...briefly. If I can find the
transparency. Yup. And I'm just gonna put this up here again
briefly for the benefit of the Tibetan track people, please say
(tem pa) (repeat) (gyel mey) (repeat) (tempa gyel mey) (repeat)
So (tempa) is "teachings", (gyel) is "inconsistencies" and (mey)
is "none". So there are four special qualities to the teachings,
the teachings of the Buddha, teachings on (lam rim) and this is
the first of them. And basically what it means is is that you
realize that all of the teachings of the Buddha are free of any
inconsistencies. Now what does that mean? You know, you could
say, "now wait a minute. What're you talking about?", you know.
In one sutra the Buddha says, "it's this way", and the next sutra
the Buddha says, "that's not right. It's the opposite way". Of
course there are inconsistencies, of course there are there are
there are mistaken things and inaccurate things, you know, the
sutras disagree with each other. So what this means is is that,
in so far as the different sutras and the different teachings
were given for specific people and their capacities to lead them
and to bring them up to the next level from where they are, there
are no inconsistencies. All of the teachings of the Buddha were
designed to bring people along the path from where they are to
the next level beyond where they are. So while it may appear
that there are inconsistencies in the teachings if you look at it
at face value, if you interpret it and if you look at the
motivation and the purpose behind this teaching, every single
teaching is designed to bring people along towards enlightenment
from whatever level they're on and in that respect, even though
various sutras disagree with each other, each and every teaching
of the Buddha has the same specific purpose and is accurate and
valid and effective in bringing various classes of beings and
people and minds along in their level of understanding. So it's
like that. Please say (sum rab) (repeat) (dam par) (repeat)
(char) (repeat) (Sum rab dam par char) (repeat). Phuntsok is
sitting up here, he's probably like thinking, "ah, he's
butchering this Tibetan" (laughs) but, doing my best, Puntsok.
(laughs) So (sum rab) is the high speech of the Buddhas. (Dam
par) is "personal advice" and (char) is "strikes you". It
strikes you. It seems to you...it strikes you. (Dam par) is
"personal advice". And it means that all of the su all of the
teachings all of the speech of the Buddhas strikes you as
personal advice. It doesn't strike you as academic book
knowledge, it doesn't strike you as something written for someone
else, it doesn't strike you as some intellectual thing to maybe
wrap your mind around one day. It strikes you as something which
you can use in your life right now and it's immediately and it
personally salient to you. You know, it means like "oh. I get
it. In my life this is what I'm supposed to be doing. This is
what they're say to be doing in my life right now"...that's
that's the idea with that. Please say (gyel) (repeat) (gong)
(repeat) (de lak) (repeat) (nyen) (repeat) (Gyel gong de lak
nyen) (repeat). (Gyel) is "the victorious Buddhas". (Gong) is
"the true intent". (De lak) is "easy happiness". And (nye) is
"to find".

(student: (unclear))

The (gyel)? is "victorious Buddhas". Victorious Buddhas. And
what this means is is that each and every word and each and every
teaching that you hear you feel and you realize is directed at
you personally so that you can reach enlightenment. You, you
feel that everything that you hear, everything that you study is
done for the specific purpose of your reaching enlightenment, and
nothing that you study and nothing that you read strikes you as
being for any other purpose, okay. Like that. If you pick up a
book and you read it...and it's a valid sutra, you know, you'd
say, "wow", you know, "this...they're they're teaching me how to
get enlightened. This is not something that's is irrelevant to
my life" Every single sutra that was ever taught you would feel
that way. Please say (nye chu) (repeat) (chen poy) (repeat)
(yang) (repeat) (se le) (repeat) (sung) (repeat) (Nye chu chen
poy yang se le sung). (repeat) Whoops. (unclear) (laughs)
(laughter) You do it...Puntsok...I need Puntsok. He's my he's my
Tibetan side kick, you know. Whenever there's Tibetan stuff I
always ask him to come along, you know (laughs). Now let's try
it again. (Nye chu) (repeat) (chen poy) (repeat) (yang)
(repeat) (sa le) (repeat) (sung) (repeat). That's perfect for
me. Although Puntsok, you know, I know...it's butchered.

(student: Can you move it up a little bit?)

Move it up? Yeah. So (nye chu chen poy) is "a great mistake".
What is (yang sa) Puntsok? What is (yang sa)? Oh, I don't know
either. He doesn't know and I don't know. Anybody know what
(yang sa) means? Any Tibetan experts in the audience? No. All
right. It's a mystery one guys. We can do the last two. (Le
sung) (Le) is "from" and (sung) is "protected". I was gonna try
to bleep over it but I was sure somebody would ask, so
(laughs)...I just fess up. Huh? Cliff? That's a good one. So
Puntsok said (yang sa), he thinks, means "cliff". That works
actually. And what it means is "you're protected from the cliff
or the great mistake". And what is that? It means that you're
protected from rejecting any of the Buddhas teachings as being
wrong or invalid or useless or inappropriate because of the prior
point...that you realize that they all contribute to reaching
enlightenment. Okay? So those are the four main points. The
four qualities of the teachings.

(student: (unclear))

Repeat...which, what?

(student: (unclear))

What it means? The last one means that you are protected from
rejecting any teaching as being irrelevant or useless or not
being valid or useful because you realize that every single
teaching is directed at you to lead you to enlightenment. Okay.
You finish you guys finished with this one? Okay. Now we get
into the good stuff. This is the stuff that I like to talk
about...is your relationship with your Lama and that is what is
an appropriate relationship with a Lama and...are you done...not
done, okay. What is an appropriate relationship with a Lama?
How do you tell if you have a good Lama? How do you tell if your
lama is wacky? How do you tell if your Lama's being way out of
line, and, you know, your Lama bugs the crap outta you and what
do you do about it, you know, and any other Lama related
irritations and questions and and issues that that happen to come
up. So. There are ten quali...I'm gonna go through the...nah,
I'll talk a little bit first. Basically the first thing that you
should realize...let me say it differently. It's important to to
understand that everything you experience and everything that you
 perceive is a function of your mind and your projections. It's
a it's a a very important point and it's a big pitfall that many
people fall into to think that Lamas are self-existent holy
people. That if everyone says so, and if they got their picture
on lots of books and if they're the Dalai Lama or Khen Rinpoche
or Geshe Michael or any other Lama that they, from their own
side, are holy. They are not, okay. The critical point that you
all understand. There are beings who perceive His Holiness as
quite an evil guy. Okay. He can not be self-existently holy if
some beings perceive him as evil and other beings perceive him as
holy. Okay. Nor can anyone else. It violates the laws of
karma. It violates the laws of emptiness and if you think that
teachers, Lamas are self-existently holy, then you don't
understand karma and emptiness and it's it and you're gonna get
in trouble most likely, particularly if you spend any time around
a Lama. So so what'da you do? I mean, what's this what's this
what is this whole Lama thing about, you know. Why do you see a
Lama as holy? Any...I mean why...any ideas...why do you see a
Lama as holy?

(student: Because of your karma)

'Cause of your karma. Because of your projections. You are
projecting the idea the concept that this is a good guy, that
this is a holy guy, that this is a special guy, okay. Will you
always have that projection? No. Okay. It's entirely feasible
that you will see someone as extremely holy for a period of time
and you will see them as a royal pain in the butt for a period of
time and you will see them as extremely abusive for a
pay...period of time. And all those things can be valid
perceptions. And will be valid perceptions from you...from your
side, for you. Okay. Very important to realize. Very important
to understand. There are no self-existent holy beings. How do
you get beings to appear holy to you? Goes back to Nanette's
question. Why wouldn't you have a holy teacher around? Why
wouldn't a being appear holy to you? If I had the karma, if
I...if my mind functioned properly, I would be seeing each and
every one of you as a holy Lama right now, okay? The simple fact
that I am not seeing Elly or Ann or Dr. Sykes as a holy being
right now means that I have not done enough virtue and my
projections and my perceptions are corrupted and I have negative
karmas ripening and I'm seeing people as limited and am
experiencing them as limited. Okay. It's a very profound point.
 It's a very profound subject. And it's a very important
subject. So. How do you get a Lama? How do you get a a holy
Lama? How do you have a perception of a holy Lama? You must
collect the karma to experience the resultant outcome of
perceiving someone as a holy Lama. ie, you must treat a
being...or more than one beings, in the proper way karmically to
plant karmic seeds which will ripen into the result of a
perception of a holy Lama. Okay? That's why you wouldn't have a
Lama in your life...because you haven't done enough virtue
specifically the karmic virtues needed in relationship to a Lama
to create a Lama...to have a perception of a Lama...to be around
a Lama. If you're around a Lama, you are using, you are
consuming and burning up, vast amounts of virtuous karma. Just
being around them. Just seeing them. Just hearing them consumes
and uses and finishes vast amounts of virtuous karma, okay. And
this is one of the reasons why in the teachings it says, "you
must behave properly in relationship to your Lama." You must
treat your Lama properly because you collect the karmas in
relationship to your Lama...I wanna...let me say it differently.
You plant the the karmic seeds to have a Lama from the way you
behave towards your Lama, so if you don't behave properly towards
a being that you consider to be holy, then you are not going to
plant the karmic seeds to experience someone in the future as a
holy being, as a teacher, as a spiritual teacher. Okay? So so
that's the idea. It's a little bit tricky perhaps...it's a
little bit slippery. Hopefully it's clear. It's a very
important point. So

(student: (unclear))

Yeah, Mike?

(student, Mike: You say you are burning up (unclear))

Using using.

(student, Mike: Why not you are getting the chance to burn up
negative karma when you are around the Lama?)

So Michael said, "if you're using vast amounts of virtuous karma
by being around a Lama, why aren't you consuming vast amounts of
negative karma".

(student, Mike: You say. You're saying while you're around a
Lama, you you you're using up a lot of negative. I say when you
got the chance to be around the Lama, you have the opportunity to
use up a lot of negative karma.)

Yeah. So Michael was saying, when you're around a Lama you have
the opportunity to to u...to use up or puri...is it purify you
mean or...

(student, Michael: Yes)

To purify a lot of negative karma. There's an important
distinction that I would make. When you're around a Lama it's
not that you are destroying virtuous karma, or it's not that you
are burning up virtuous karma. The ripening of virtuous karmic
seeds is the perception of the Lama. The fact that you are
perceiving a Lama is the manifestation of karma's flowering in
your mind and ripening in your mind, second by second, moment by
moment, okay? If you perceive a Lama in front of you, that is
your virtuous karma ripening and being used up. That's what
perceiving a Lama is. So, if you if you want to purify negative
karma in relationship to a Lama, you can do that, or you can
accumulate a lot of negative karma in a relationship to a Lama.
It just depends on your thoughts and your behavior, you know. It
it goes back to an understanding of how things exist and what the
nature of perception is and how karma works. You know, you can
think of it as a projector. Your mind is the collection of your
karmic imprints...not your brain, but your mind stream. Your
mind stream is the collection of your karmic imprints. Okay.
Your mind is your perception of your mind is the flowering of the
karmas in your mind. Your perception of me and everyone around
you is the flowering of your karma. It takes trillions and
trillions and trillions of discrete karmas flowering at any
given moment to construct a reality and and there're vast amounts
of karma ripening every millisecond to provide you with enough
data to have the perception that you have. You can think of it
as a projector, you know. It's a fairly good analogy to think
that, you know, your mind is doing the projecting and it's gotta
have a lot of stuff that it's projecting out there to create a
whole reality, you know, to create all of this, you know...of
this...all the data of these six senses, you know...to have to
have perception of all that takes a vast amount of karma which is
which is ripening and which is going off. So, it's a little
slippery. It's a little subtle. Yeah?

(student: (unclear))

I can't hear. I...

(student: (unclear))

Is...question is, is there a way to...yeah, question is, is there
a way to shut off your projections and to just witness...if you
are witnessing, you are projecting. According to Buddhism the
very act of being aware and sentient, the very act of being
conscious means that you are having perceptions. If you're
having perception of any kind that's a projection, so
it's...there's no way to escape that.

(student: (unclear))

It's not a question of the perceiver and the perceiving. It's a
question of if you're conscious, you're aware and you're
projecting. There's no...without one there is not the other
possible. Like that. Yeah?

(student: I have one small thing to say)

Okay.
(student: When you say, "I heard it like that", you're saying if
you're around the Dharma you're burning up more)

Not burning up. You keep saying "burning up", you're not burning
up, you are using up.

(student: Okay, you're using up...you're using up more karma
than you would...)

You...no, I didn't...no nope..I didn't say you're using up more
karma, I said you're using up virtuous karma. I said you use a
vast amount of virtuous karma to perceive a Lama. If you
perceive a Lama, it means that you have in your mind, flowering
at that moment, a vast amount of virtuous karma.

(student: That means that it's difficult to see or (unclear), I
don't understand...)

It me...think of it this way. If if I see you as Michael, it
means I have a mix of karmas flowering in my mind at this moment
to perceive you as Michael. Okay. Now if if I have more
negative karmas flowering in my mind at this moment, I'll
perceive you as a real jerk, okay? If I have more virtuous
karmas...

(student, Michael: (unclear))

(laughs) well it would be valid at the moment, it's true.
(laughs) (laughter) Then I felt a different way (laughs)
(laughter). So, so if I have at that moment more virtuous karmas
flowering in my mind, I would be perceiving you as a really great
guy and the more...if my mind were were filled with a tremendous
amount of virtuous karmas flowering at that moment, I would be
perceiving you as maybe an angel or maybe a teacher, or maybe a
holy being...so it's like that. So if I'm perceiving if I'm
perceiving a Lama it means in my mind at that moment I have a
tremendous amount of virtuous karmas which are flowering and
going off and creating that perception. What? Turn it off? Oh.
 You're done. So so that's what that's my point. Okay. My
point is, be aware that if you are perceiving a Lama and if you
are spending time around a Lama, the very act of having that
perception is consuming...is the expression of virtuous karma
ripening and it's getting used up at a very fast rate. Yeah,
Debbie.
(student, Debbie: But if you were having such a virtuous thought
 to regard Michael as a holy teacher you would surely be
accumulating virtue at the same time.)

So Debra says, "if you have the virtue in your mind to perceive
someone, say Geshe Michael, as a as a holy teacher then surely
you would also be accumulating virtue at the same time" No.
Lots of people see Geshe Michael as a teacher...or as a holy
being one day, and then the next afternoon they're really pissed
off at him and they accumulate a tremendous amount of negative
karma...stuff like that. Yeah, Marie.

(student, Marie. So how are we to (unclear) causes to see, for
example, John Stilwell, as the Lama...)

God forbid, huh? (laughs)

(student, Marie. Or Geshe Michael as the Lama)

So Marie's question is, "how would you create the cause to see me
as a Lama", to which I said, "holy smokes" or someone like Geshe
Michael as a Lama? It could be anyone, you know. And this is
the, this is actually the key to the secret teachings of the
Buddha to (tan) to (tantra). Whomever you select to enter into
that type of relationship with is it, you know. I mean,
essentially we all have to choose at some point to behave
virtuously towards one particular individual...three people, or
everybody, you know. The point of bodhichitta is is to to choose
to try to be virtuous towards everyone. To try to behave well
towards everyone. Now frankly in our lives our past karma is
causing us to see some people as better than others, you know.
My valid perception right now is some of you guys are a lot nicer
than others, you know. And some of you know a lot more and some
of you are a lot more experienced and some are you are a lot more
holy than others, and it's a valid perception and it's the
result of of past virtue and past karmas ripening. So normal
valid conventional perception makes it easier for us to relate to
some people as holy and it gives you a platform or a headstart to
relate properly towards them. Okay. If I see Elly as a teacher,
as a holy person who knows a lot about meditation, who has a lot
of experience, who's very pure, who's very virtuous, it's a lot
easier for me to think of her as someone I should treat nicely
and kindly and respectfully, okay, as opposed to...(laughter)
(laughs) someone else (laughs), save myself, (laughs) as opposed
to someone else who I don't respect very much and who I don't
think very highly of, it's much harder for me to treat someone I
don't respect very much and don't think very highly of in a pure
way, okay? It's very difficult for me to to make offerings to
them, to be very kind to them, to be very respectful to them, to
help them in any way I possibly can, to go out of the way to do
what they say, you know. To do anything I can to further their
noble causes. It's very hard for me to do that with somebody who
I don't like or somebody I think's just average, okay. So it's
like that. The idea is is that you...it...the laws of karma
apply to this as everything else. You must plant the appropriate
karmic seeds to have the perception in the future of a Lama and
you can do that in relationship to various beings, you know.
It's easiest to do it with someone you already see as a Lama,
okay. That's that's the idea. So, you got a jump...you got a
headstart, you're conventional perception is giving you a boost
to to make it easier for you to relate to someone and to serve
them and to and to do virtue in relationship to them, so it's
like that. Now, in (tantra) the point is, well maybe you
shouldn't only think about one person that way, you know. And
the same is true of the Mahayana, you know, you shouldn't just
try to help one person. You should try to relate to this...you
should try to relate in this way to everyone so that you can
accumulate vast amounts of merit towards everyone. Think about
it. If you treated every single person as a holy being, as your
Lama, what are you creating the cause for? What karmic seeds are
you planting? You're creating the karmic cause to perceive a
large number of holy beings in your future, okay. That's the
point. That's the long and the short of it, okay? It's like
that. Yeah. Okay. Moving right along. So...let's go through
the ten qualities of of a Lama, of what a Lama is supposed to be
like. So now, I'll say another thing too...not to overload you
or talk too much, but so what does it mean if, what does it mean
if, you know, you don't like your Lama today, you know. What
does it mean if your Lama is pushing your buttons, what does it
mean if this guy is just like seems to be really jerking you
around, you know? Or lady. What do you do? How do you how do
you behave in relationship to that. How do you treat that? What
if one day you see the guy as a massively accomplished meditator
and the next day you see him as somebody who's really taking
advantage, who's really out of it, who's really a big loser, you
know. Yeah Marie.

(student, Marie: Well, try to understand it because he's trying
to get you to a different level)

One way to look at it is to look at it from his side, which is to
say, from his side...well, maybe he's an enlightened being, maybe
he's not. We don't know. If he is an enlightened being, he's
trying to bring you up. He's intentionally pushing your buttons
and trying to and trying to test you and sort of cause you to
flex your muscles with virtue to see if you can exercise patience
and restraint and and and virtuous behavior in the face of
difficult circumstances and conditions. So that's one way to
think about it...of how he is from his side. What about how it
is from your side? You know. How would you think about it as to
how it is from your side? Yeah.

(student, Ann: It's it's like you can use the Lama as a
beautiful mirror for whatever you're seeing out there is a mirror
of what he's (unclear)

Right. Yeah. Yeah. So Ann says, you know, "well, if you see
your Lama as a jerk, you know, it's because you don't have enough
virtue. It's because at that moment you've got karmic seeds
ripening to see him as a jerk and it's valid. You see him as a
jerk. The point is how do you change that in the future? These
are the laws of karma, these are the standard laws of karma, you
know. If someone's yelling at you, how do you change it in the
future? Do you yell back? No, you know. You treat them nicely,
 you know. It changes. It changes your environment, it changes
your circumstances, it changes things. If you see your Lama as a
loser or an incompetent or lacking in having serious character
flaws in some way, you have a choice. You say, "okay. I will go
find another Lama" or whatever you're gonna say, or you say "all
right, I'm gonna behave differently in relationship to him
specifically and other people in general to create the karmic
causes to see someone pure or more pure in the future, like that.
 Yeah? Yeah.

(student: (unclear))

Yeah.

(student: (unclear))

Valid perception.

(student: (unclear))

Well when you...it's the definition of terms, when you say
"correct", it doesn't have a meaning in Buddhism. You
have...there's a valid perception...is that what you mean?
(student: (unclear))

That would be self-existent, you mean, when you say "correct" you
mean "self-existent"...from his own side?

(student: (unclear))

No, there's nothing that exists in that way. That would mean
that there's a self-existent thing. That would mean that
somebod...that would mean that if a person from their side was
always a jerk or always unpleasant, that everyone that ever came
in contact with them, at that moment in time, would perceive
them that way, and it doesn't work that way. Everyone's
perception is unique to them.

(student: Then why (unclear))

Why don't you just pick anybody and go with it? Well, on some
level...

(student: (unclear))

No that's not correct, actually. His his point was that person
has a nature and it's a question of me being able to perceive it
correctly. And that's actually the opposite of the teachings on
emptiness. According to the teachings on emptiness, that person
has no nature of their own and we perceive them according to our
perception. So

(student: (unclear))

Well, again, it's...you have to study emptiness, saying...yeah.

(student: (unclear) correct teachings)

Valid teachings...accurate teachings.

(student: Accurate teachings.)

Yeah.

(student: So that's what I'm talking...so it has (unclear))

Naw. Naw. The fact...

(student: We don't go kill people because (unclear))
Yeah. If if the Buddhas teachings were self-existently correct,
then everyone that ever heard them would think they were correct
and there are plenty of people who don't think they're correct.

(student: (unclear) The reason why we don't see them as correct
(unclear), just like a (unclear))

Yeah. Yeah. Everyone's perception determines what they can
perceive. Yup. It's like that.

(student: (unclear))

So...

(student: (unclear) And then can I see it that way?)

It's im...yeah...it's important that you're able to perceive it
properly. Yeah. So I'm gonna leave it at that, so...if you want
to talk afterwards we can talk some more afterwards, but we gotta
move on. So, going back to the Lama, going back to your
relationship to your Lama, to how you see your Lama, how you
behave towards your loo your Lama, I mean I could tell you from
personal experience, you know, I've spent a lot of time around
particular Lama and some other Lamas and it's a pain in the butt
often, you know, I mean it's a royal pain in the butt

(cut)

you know, sometimes I see a Lama as being...really way out there,
you know, as behaving in a way which is incredibly distasteful to
me, or to a way...in a way which I wouldn't never want to behave
in, or doing things which I don't like or doing things which I
think are very holy, you know, or which I aspire to, and and
it's very easy for me to say, "man, this guy is really screwed
up", you know? There's some real problems here. There's some
real inadequacies here. But if I step back and think about it
from a karmic perspective, it's not about him...it's about me,
you know. It's about my mind and my projections. If I don't
want to see a Lama in some disfunctional behavior, then I have to
clean up my mind, you know. And that's the long and the short of
it. And it's a it's it's it's very dangerous to think of a Lama
as being self-existent and then thinking that they're doing
something right or that they're doing something wrong, you know?
To to have attachment to a Lama is ignorance, you know. To want
to be around a Lama, to attach yourself to a Lama in an ignorant
way...is very bad, you know. If you understand the nature of
perception, if you understand the nature of karma, if you want to
serve that Lama, if you want to help that Lama...great.
According to the teachings on emptiness, according to the
teachings on on karma, all well and good. But having ignorant
attachment...those are the basic three poisons which are at the
center of the wheel of life, you know. And if you just exhibit
them in relationship to a Lama, it's still the three poisons, you
know...it's still ignorance. You know. You're just taking your
basic ignorance and doing the same old thing over again, you
know, in relationship to a holy...what, you know...what you could
perceive as and maybe do perceive as a holy object, okay. So
when ever you're around a holy being or a Lama, it's critically
important that you keep in mind the laws of karma and emptiness.
And you are constantly aware of the fact that whatever you are
perceiving is a projection of you. Of your karma, your karma
ripening, your mental constructs and your projections, okay. And
if you don't like what you see, then clean up your own act. Now,
having said that, what about valid perception. What about people
who do perceive a Lama as being abusive and get hurt? What about
all the people who have been hurt by various Lamas of various
lineages, traditions, you know, etc. etc. etc., you know.
There's there is the very real issue of valid perception, you
know, and if, and if a Lama, if you're a woman and a Lama is
hitting on you, and you see a Lama hitting on you, it's a valid
perception. It's happening, you know. And what do you do about
it, you know. How do you relate to that? You know. How do you
think about that. Do you think, "god, I'm so disappointed in
this guy, I can't believe this guy's doing this to me. You know,
I had such faith in this guy, and now look at him", you know.
"he's a schmuck like everybody else, or he's totally disappointed
me", or whatever it is you're gonna think, you know. It's
extremely important to realize that it's happening based upon
your past karma and it's equally important to realize that your
perceptions are valid and you must also deal with them on the
conventional level. Okay. I know plenty of women who, sort of
wanted to do the dance with the Lama to sort of try to interact
with them, challenge them, you know, see how close they could
get. And I know a woman who ended up...she was, you know, lovely
beautiful woman, you know, she ended up getting pregnant from a
very, you know, a very high Lama, you know. It's a valid
perception for me. It's a valid perception from her. I don't
know what the Lama's perception is. He may see her as a consort,
you know, or a (tantr)ic angel or a deity or something like that,
 you know, and she may see him as the same, I have no idea.
But from your side and from my side, we have to be aware of what
our valid perceptions are, you know. And if you see a Lama which
is...who is misbehaving or her do or or who...a Lama which is
doing something which you consider to be conventionally
inappropriate, you must address it on a conventional level and
you must understand it on a karmic level, which is to say, "man,
it's really really disappointing that this Lama is hitting on me
and I created this through my past karma, and it's not acceptable
that it's happening, and I have to create the causes for it to be
different in the future. Okay. Very important. Similarly, you
know, if a Lama is...well, I'll leave it at that. Yeah Brooks?

(student, Brooks: (unclear))

Can't hear.

(student, Brooks: (unclear))

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

(student, Brooks: (unclear))

You're you're exper...so Brook's Brook's point is is if I have
really excellent karma, is it possible for me to have the
perception that a Lama would never do anything bad towards me or
wrong towards me, like that, right? Yeah. I mean, that's what a
Buddha is. A Buddha is a being who can not perceive any one
doing anything negative negative to them. That's what it means,
you know. Again I'll refer to the (thangka) of a popular
(thangka) which is painted of Shakyamuni Buddha sitting in
meditation in full lotus posture under the tree as he attains
enlightenment, and in the (thangka), you know, there's...he's
surrounded by all the demons of all the realms, you know, and and
enemies and they're throwing swords at him in the (thangka) and
weapons of all sorts and shooting arrows and and the weapons turn
into flowers and ju...there's just a cloud of flowers around him
which fall to the ground. That's the meaning of that (thangka).
The meaning of that (thangka) is...the in the...those beings see
themselves as trying to do harm. The other being can't see
himself being harmed. The two are not think...in inconsistent,
you know, and it's the same way with the Lama's behavior. You do
not know if a Lama is trying to bring you up or is trying to hurt
you. You must try to decide that. You must evaluate it. You
must access it. You must not judge them, you must look at it and
say, "I'm experiencing this according to my own perceptions, they
are experiencing it according to their own perceptions, I do not
know what their perceptions are, I do not know if they're trying
to help me or harm me, but from my side, I have to look at it to
ascertain whether or not I think this person is trying to help me
or harm me and I have to then act based upon my decision. If I
perceive the Lama is is trying to push my buttons to bring me up,
great. I'll stay in a relationship with that Lama. If I
perceive the Lama is trying to hurt me, I'm not staying in
relationship with that Lama, conventionally speaking. And I will
go off and I will create the causes karmically to have a Lama who
will treat me sweetly, and purely and nicely. Okay. You know,
there there's a saying that if you're ready, the teacher appears.
 Well, I mean, it's a bit of a a a, you know, trivial statement,
but it's karmically it's true. If you have created the karmic
causes, you must have a teacher. You can't escape it. You can't
avoid it, okay? Similarly, if you created the karmic causes,
you'll get whatever teacher you created, you know. And it and
it's not static. It's constantly in flux. Yeah Dr. Sykes.

(student, Dr. Sykes: About a Lama that's clearly in violation of
all the vows that you hold dear?)

Well Dr. Sykes question is, "what about a Lama who is clearly in
violation of all the vows you hold dear?" I would say that
sounds like a conclusion. I would say the first thing that you
have to do is go through a process of evaluation. I think you
have to try to ascertain what their motivation is, I think you
have to try to ascertain what their level of experience is and at
what their level of attainment and accomplishment is, and and
then I think you have to put it altogether. I think you have to
say, "okay. I gotta weigh this against that. It's possible

(student, Dr. Sykes: But where exactly is the line, okay. A
Lama (unclear))

You gotta deci...yeah.

(student, Dr. Sykes: The Lama (unclear) running)

Yeah, you gotta decide where the line is...

(student, Dr. Sykes: (unclear) gun running would be a bad thing.)

Yeah. So Dr. Sykes says, "where is the line?" you know. "What
if a Lama is gun-running" as an example. You know there's this
there's this one of the there's one of the stories...I forget
exactly who the characters are, but there's a guy who's a hunter,
 you know, and, you know, he goes around shooting sheep. This
was in ancient Tibet. And, you know, he goes aro...he's he's a
herdsman and, you know, he he tends sheep and and every now and
again he shoots one, you know. And and a a a spiritual
practitioner sees him and and scorns him and says, "Don't don't
you know anything? Are you crazy? Don't you know what kind of
karma you're creating? Don't you know what you're doing?" And,
you know, another realized being's there, says, you know, "you
just made a really big mistake", you know, "he is a massively
realized practitioner and you should be so lucky as to be shot by
him because he guides the consciousness of those beings to the
pure realm after he shoots them". So, you don't know.

(student, Dr. Sykes: But that's...but he can't say that to a
person that has a perception. He he's just killed something.)

Yeah. So Dr. Sykes point is, is well you don't know and you
can't just let people go around killing. That's true. That's
right.

(student, Dr, Sykes: And it sounds that the other person is just
trying to legitimize any kind of behavior that they can get away
with).

So Dr. Syke's point is is you know, you could just legit...you
could go around trying to legitimize any kind of behavior that
you think you can get away with if that's the case. Yeah.
People try to do that actually. (laughs) It's true. And that's
why I'm talking to you. Because you know, we have to use our
faculties of critical evaluation to try to evaluate it, and every
person is different and every person has their own, you know,
their own way of looking at it. Their own way of evaluating it.
You know, and you gotta say, "I think this person is incredibly
holy and I think they're pushing my buttons and I'm willing to
have it happen, because I I feel strongly that it's for my
personal spiritual advancement and I really think they're doing
it with the sweetest of motivations and the purest of hearts, and
in fact, it's a, you know, a Lama that I know said that he would
never enter into a relationship with a student...well, let me
phrase it differently. He said, for a student to enter into
(tantr)ic relationship with a with a vajra master, that student
should be willing to die literally for that teacher. That is an
appropriate relationship between a vajra disciple and a (tantr)ic
master. You must be so convinced in your heart of your teacher's
motivation that you would be willing to say, "you know what? I
feel with great certainly that if they kill me that it would be
to guide my consciousness to a to a pure realm and I'm okay with
that". Now I don't advocate that, mind you...please don't, you
know, take it that way, however there is that element, you know.
There is an element where you have to say, "okay, I've checked
this person out for ten years, for twenty years, you know. I've
I've spent, you know, a vast amount of time with them, you know.
I've watched them practice, I've watched them study, you know,
I've watched them behave towards everyone for all this time, and,
you know, I gotta get off the fence, you know. I gotta give
it...I gotta say...I gonna take a step back...you get to a point
where you yourself feel that you've accumulated enough virtue so
that no negative virtue can ripen upon you. Let's put it that
way. That's a better way to say it, okay. If you can get to the
point where you feel that you have accumulated enough positive
virtue and karma so that it's not possible for any kind of major,
negative thing will happen to you...at that point it's probably
appropriate to place yourself fully in the hands of your
spiritual teacher. You know, it's really hard to get to that
point and it's a major major amount of harrassment along the way.
 I can't tell anybody, "look, this is the decision, this is the
cut..you know, this is the cutoff point". It's true, and this is
what we are talking about, certain people try to use these
principles to their to their gain and to their benefit, you know,
and try to push the envelope as much as they can. Certain people
try to say, "look, I'm self-existently good. Just listen to me",
you know. Certain people have ignorant attachment towards a
Lama, you know. So it's it's like that, and and it's a
pro...it's a real problem, you know, and and we need to
understand just what the Lama is. The Lama is our projections,
you know, and he will change, he must change, he must be in this
constant fluctuating state according to our the karmas ripening
in our mind and our perception. So if you are around a Lama, and
and the the actual act of perceiving him is consuming your
virtuous karma, you gotta generate a massive amount of additional
virtuous karma just to continue perceiving a Lama, you know, let
alone perceiving one who's holier and holier and holier and
holier, okay. It's like that. Yeah Vilma? Yeah.

(student, Vilma: I think we also have to talk about the
qualities in assessing a Lama.)

She says, "let's talk about the qualities of assessing a Lama".
Here we are. It's time. (laughs) Yeah Michael, what were you
gonna say? So, having said all that, how do you check 'em out,
how do you evaluate 'em? Sol said it's time to quit. Time for a
break. Okay. I'll tell you what. Let's take a break, do the
discussion groups, and then when you come back then we'll go over
the...there are ten qual...I think ten qualities...there are ten
standard qualities that you use...ten standard benchmarks that
you use to es...to evaluate evaluate and assess a Lama, okay.
We'll talk after.

(break)

You guys asked how can you tell if a Lama is really qualified or
not. How do you know...how do you know...what do you measure
your teacher by? What's the what's the benchmark...what's the
standard? What do you check? What what what characteristics or
attributes do you check about the about your teacher, about the
Lama. This is also on your homework. So the first is (dul wa).
Please say (dul wa) (repeat) (dul wa) (repeat). Means
"discipline". Means he has...he or she...has discipline, he's
controlled, they're controlled. What it means is they possess
training on ethical living, on morality, it means that they're
keeping their three sets of vows...pratimoksha vows, bodhisattva
vows and secret vows. So this is the first quality which a a a a
fully-qualified spiritual teacher should have. Second quality is
(shi wa). Please say (shi wa) (repeat) (shi wa) (repeat). It
means "peace". They're peaceful. What that refers to is is that
they have a an exceptional training in meditation and
concentration. They can deeply concentrate. They have peace.
Please say (nyer shiwa) (repeat) (nyer shiwa) (repeat). It means
"really peaceful" (laughter (laughs). (Nyer) is "really". It
means they have...they're completely peaceful. It means they
they possess the training on wisdom, they deeply understand
wisdom, meaning emptiness, have a deep understanding of
emptiness. (Yunten) ...please say (yunten) (repeat) (laughs)
(hlakpa) (repeat) (Yunten hlakpa) (repeat). (Yunten) is
"spiritual qualities". Spiritual qualities. (Hlakpa) is
"excessive". It means they have exceeding qualities. It means,
basically, they know a lot more than their students. If you're
going to teach someone, you have to know a lot more than they do,
so this is what that refers to. You have to have exceeding
qualities in the sense that you per...you possess spiritual
qualities which are much greater than than those of your your
disciple or your student. Please say (tsun che) (repeat) (tsun
che) (repeat). Means "has effort", (tsun) is "effort", (che) is
"has". He has effort in that he wants to achieve the two goals
for himself and everyone else. It means that that person is
primarily spending their time and is dedicating their life
towards becoming enlightened themselves and teaching other people
to become enlightened with the idea to save them from their
suffering. Please say (lung gi) (repeat) (chuk) (repeat) (lung
gi chuk) (repeat). Means they are "rich in scripture". (Lung)
is "scripture". (Gi) is "in". (Chuk) is "wealth". It means
they have deeply studied the three collections of scripture.
They are rich in scripture...the vinaya, sutra and the
Abhidharma. Please say (de nyi) (repeat) (rabtu) (repeat)
(tokpa) (repeat) (De nyi rabtu tokpa) (repeat). (De nyi) is
"emptiness". (Rabtu tokpa) is "a great realization". They have a
deep realization of suchness, of emptiness. They've had a direct
perception of emptiness. Particularly it means that they can
explain the relationship between karma, emptiness and morality.
You know, in a way that's kind of the holy grail of Buddhist
studies. If you can understand the relationship between karma,
emptiness and your behavior, ethics, then you have the basis to
become fully enlightened. You have the kernel and the key to
succeed in your practice. You have the meat of it of it all.
Please say (ma ke den) (repeat) (ma ke den) (repeat). (Ma) is
"teach". (Ke) is "master". (Den) is "possesses". It means
"he's a master teacher." Means he teaches at precisely the
appropriate level for his student and at the appropriate speed
for his student. He or she teaches. They teach. You know, they
they know what you need, they don't teach above you they don't
teach below you. Kind of like (b: Goldilocks and the Three
Bears). Not too hot...not too cold. (laughter) Just right.
Please say (tseway) (repeat) (daknyi) (repeat) (tseway daknyi)
(repeat). Means "the image of love". (Tseway) is "love".
(Daknyi) is "the embodiment of". He embodies love. This refers
to his motivation. You know, is he teaching because he wants the
bucks, because he wants the fame, because he wants his face on
the cover of a book, because he wants to have people following
him around or because he wants to be popular, or is he teaching
because he really cares about the people and loves the people and
wants their happiness and particularly, yeah...he's just not
persuing world...he's not persuing worldly worldly dharmas,
worldly motivations. And then finally the tenth quality is
please say (kyowa) (repeat) (pa...pang) (repeat) (kyowa pang)
(repeat). (Kyowa) is "distaste". And (pang) is "to give it up".
 It means "he's overcome all distaste for you his students
(laughter) (laughs). What that means is, "he doesn't get tired
of answering your questions twenty times" (laughs), "doesn't
doesn't mind answering the same question over and over and over
again". Okay. It means he's he's willing to just do it and do
it and do it even though it takes a long time for the student to
learn it, they don't quite get it, you know, like that. Doesn't
get impatient. He's forgiving when you botch it (laughs). That
kinda thing. So so if you look at this...everybody finished
writing the script? No. Okay. So if you look at these ten
qualities that we're talking about, you've got someone who is
keeping their vows nicely, they meditate nicely, they deeply
understand emptiness, they have great spiritual qualities of
their own, better than their student, they making a lot of
effort, they're dedicating their life to su..their life to
spiritual activity, particularly to help other people, prevent
their suffering, they have extensive scriptural knowledge,
they've had a direct persepthing perception of emptiness, they're
a master teacher, they teach exactly to your level, they teach
out of love and they have a lot of patience and they repeat
themselves a lot. So, can you find somebody like that. Where do
you find somebody like that? Can you find somebody like that?
In the scriptures it says, "well, frankly, it's kinda hard to
find teachers like that". (laughs). You know. And if you can't
find teachers like that, well,at least try to find someone who's
spending most of their time and most of their activity on
spiritual things...as a bare minimum, okay? So that's the idea.
So...so this is the authorized scriptural checklist to to to use
in checking out your teacher, your spiritual teacher and to see
if they have all these qualities or or a lot of these qualities,
or enough of these qualities. Like that. Okay? And in the end,
you know, as Dr. Sykes said, you know, "how do you know", I mean
what's the cutoff point...where whe what is the point at which
you say, "they went over the line, or they went too far". you
know, and and there's...I just can't be around them anymore, you
know...they're not for me. Doesn't work. You know, what is that
point. And there is no hard and fast answer, you know.
Everyone's mind is different, everyone's capacity is different,
and you've all gotta decide on your own. But the main point to
realize is is that a a a ho a spiritual teacher is a very
powerful karmic object because of their potential to do benefit,
all right. So whatever your behavior is around a spiritual
teacher, you're planting very powerful karmic seeds...for better
or for worse. So, if you have a really hard time behaving
yourself around a spiritual teacher, you know, then personally I
would suggest that you distance yourself a little bit so you can
you know, reign it in and get it under control a little bit
because there's no point being around a spiritual teacher if it's
only to plant a lot of powerful negative karma which will ripen
upon you quickly. Powerful karmas ripen very quickly. So, if
you are able to to work with your mind to the point where you
don't get pissed off excessively at the teacher, or, you know,
where you can do virtue in relationship to a teacher, then, you
know, great, be around them. But be very careful, you know.
It's very slippery slope, it's very tricky. So like that. And,
yeah, I hope I hope everyone here can, you know, have the
perception of having pure teachers, pure holy teachers and to do
that, you know, you have to start treating people as if they are
your teacher. It's one of the advises of the bodhisattva vows
actually...is to...it's one of the one of the actual bodhisattva
vows is to see all beings as your Teacher, you know. If you
don't do that, you're not keeping your bodhisattva vows. Is to
is to train yourself to think that everyone you...that you meet,
all day long is trying to teach you a lesson for your benefit and
that every single person you encounter is some kind of teacher
for you and that they are knowingly, intentionally and
consciously engaging with you in the way that they are to teach
you something, you know. So, you know, how do you start to
accumulate the karma to have spiritual teachers? Keep that
bodhisattva vow, you know, and, you know, plant the karmas to to
to create very holy beings for yourself so...I get very
frustrated myself sometimes because it's like, "man, I really
hate this", you know, "this is such a pain in the ass. I really
wish he weren't like this, you know. I really wish this person
wasn't like that, you know. I wish...I should go find somebody
better, you know, (laughs)...however, in the end if I ask myself,
you know, what do all my other projections look like, you know
(laughter) (laughs), am I projecting anything any bettier better
anywhere else, you know (laughs)...well, fortunately not
(laughs). Yeah, go ahead.

(student: (unclear))

Yeah. Yeah. So the question is, "what about your
loyalty"...this will be...this has to be needs to be the last
question because we have to go, so the question is, "what about
your loyalty towards your Lama", you know. If you have a Lama, a
teacher and other teachers coming to town or or are around, is it
okay to to go to their teachings. Should you...are you betraying
your Lama in some way? Something like that, you know. No, not
at all, you know. If if they're a...I mean in my opinion, if
they are a pure teacher, they want you to learn, you know. They
want you to advance yourself and, you know, anyway that you can
do that, you know, great. All the better. So, you know, perhaps
they know enough that they can see your mind, see the stream of
your karma, see exactly what's right for your mind and they know
that you'll get the most benefit if you study with them that day
on that subject as opposed to someone else, but if you don't have
that kind of intimate relationship with a teacher, you know,
where they are personally saything this is, you know, this is the
best thing for you right now, it's, you know, yo...advance
yourself anyway you can, is my opinion, you know. Study wherever
you can, and anywhere you can. You know that's why the Buddha
taught so many different techniques and so many different ways
and so many different levels, because every being's mind is
different, you know, and they need different teachings and
different presentations and different levels and in different
ways, so yeah yeah...study away. Okay. Thank you very much,
thank you for the opportunity to accumulate virtue. (applause)
See now, I'm glad you rejoiced. Now I get to rejoice in your
rejoicing. We're all just like snowballing merit here, you know?
 (laughter) It's great (laughs).

(cut)
Review Course 17